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Lisl Angel - SoCalGhia - [email protected]
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Viewing feedback for: SoCalGhia
Email: [email protected]
Last Visited: February 26, 2010
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typesoneandtwo
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Joined: September 29, 2004
Posts: 659
Location: Cape Cod Mass. Bass River
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:28 pm    Post subject: Lisl Angel - SoCalGhia - lisl_ange[email protected] Reply with quote

I recently had a sour transaction with Lisl Angel, who responded to an ad but is apparently not a registered samba member.

I advertised this reflector, not specifying which side.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=557468

She responds,



Quote:
Hello, I am interested in your left rear turn signal. Do you still have it available?
> Thanks


Now it doesn't register that she's asking for the opposite side, in other words, not the part I am advertising.

So I respond...
Yes, that is still available. I accept PayPal at this e-mail address.
mayojonathan@hotmail.com
I also take Postal money orders.
Thanks,
Jonathan Mayo

I then get this...
Quote:
Hi Jon,

I received the reflector and it was the wrong side. I need the left reflector but this one is for the right side. Do you have the left reflector? I can ship this one back.

Thanks,
Lisl


Now I really felt it was her mistake and she should keep the part, hell spare parts are good to have.
I respond,
Lisl,
Sorry, I don't.
I guess you have a spare now.
Thanks,
Jon

Then came this...



Quote:
Hi Jon,

I guess I don't understand your response. I paid for a left rear reflector that you advertised. I didn't receive that. Are you saying that you never had the left one and that you are satisfied with taking my money for an item that you clearly know that I did not need? I was vey clear before I paid for it that I needed the left side. I am requesting a refund. I need a response immediately.

Thank you


I respond...
Lisl,
Maybe I am mistaken.
Where on this ad does it say "left".
It doesn't.
I see now that you wrote "left" but that's you, not me.
If you made a mistake in ordering this, it is your mistake not mine.
Regardless, I can offer this.
Return the light. I'll refund your money, minus the cost of me shipping it to you.
This is only fair, since it is more your mistake than mine.
You'll find that refund tonight.
Please return the light to the address on the label.
You can find the other side here.,
http://www.karmannghia.com/viewDetail.asp?strMasterCat=&idproduct=2800

Thanks,
Jon

Now I tried to issue a partial refund after that but since she categorized the pmt as "personal" only a full refund was possible.

I issued a full refund.

then I got this from her boyfriend...



Quote:
Jon,
Please review Lisls first email below. It clearly reads “left”. You responded that you in fact had it according to the electronic document below. Now you are saying it’s our fault. Interesting.

I am requesting a full refund ASAP. I will be happy to send the part back to you but your expense. In addition, I intend on filing a complaint with the fine folks at PayPal.

Please resist the urge to send back a sarcastic response. The refund ($25) is far less important to me then it obviously is to you. Your dishonesty and blatant play on words is all the motivation I need to fuel my interest.

Regards

Todd Angel
VP Pacific Express

my reply....

Quote:
Todd,
I have over two hundred ads on thesamba. When someone responds to an ad and types "left" it might not immediately register that they are requesting the wrong part. She was indeed mistaken in even responding to the ad.
When someone says,"I want "x" I assume they thoroughly read the ad for "X" or they wouldn't be asking for it.
Your refund was posted.
My response was not at all sarcastic.
Feel free to call me dishonest as well.
I can tell you I am not.
I will be leaving feedback for Lisl on thesamba, including our full e-mails. I accept the fact that I didn't recognize her mistake.
Best Regards,
Jon


.


In any event that's the way it went down.
I accept some blame, but I don't tolerate being called dishonest based on a mutual mistake, especially when I took the time to search out the part for them.
Confused
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Last edited by typesoneandtwo on Thu Feb 25, 2010 6:05 am; edited 1 time in total
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Tram Premium Member
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Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22099
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jonathan, you seem like a good egg and all, and I'd certainly buy from you, but you didn't specify the side in the original ad, and it sounded like maybe Lisl was telling you what she wanted, figuring that you'd tell her if her assumption was incorrect.

I think it's your mistake. An honest one for sure, but still your mistake. I've been around VWs for 30+ years, and if I needed that reflector, I'd assume it would fit either side since you didn't specify. But I'm a Type 3 guy, not a Ghia guy. The seller should be the expert. If you had told her that it was the right and not the left side, I'd say it was her fault. But I can see why she bought it even if it was the wrong one... She bought it because you didn't tell her otherwise. She was being specific. You were not.

Shit happens. Make this a learning experience.
_________________
May 4, 1970- 50 years- NEVER FORGET!! Sad

vwfye wrote:
Oh the joy of custom things...



RIPRW

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typesoneandtwo
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Joined: September 29, 2004
Posts: 659
Location: Cape Cod Mass. Bass River
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tram wrote:
Jonathan, you seem like a good egg and all, and I'd certainly buy from you, but you didn't specify the side in the original ad, and it sounded like maybe Lisl was telling you what she wanted, figuring that you'd tell her if her assumption was incorrect.

I think it's your mistake. An honest one for sure, but still your mistake. I've been around VWs for 30+ years, and if I needed that reflector, I'd assume it would fit either side since you didn't specify. But I'm a Type 3 guy, not a Ghia guy. The seller should be the expert. If you had told her that it was the right and not the left side, I'd say it was her fault. But I can see why she bought it even if it was the wrong one... She bought it because you didn't tell her otherwise. She was being specific. You were not.

Shit happens. Make this a learning experience.

I guess I have to.
Very Happy
Thanks for the perspective, Mart! Very Happy

Lisl's PayPal payment was marked as "personal" which created problems when attempting a partial refund.
PayPal's payment page clearly states how payments are to be classified. as goods,services or personal, essentially a gift according to PayPal.
I couldn't even print a PayPal label, since addresses don't attach to personal payments.
Why anyone would classify a parts payment as "personal" is beyond me.
Goods are goods.
I hope to receive the part back.
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SoCalGhia
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Joined: February 24, 2010
Posts: 2
Location: SoCal
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2010 4:54 pm    Post subject: Too Bad About This Transaction Reply with quote

Jon,

I am more than a little bummed about this transaction. Not about the part itself because mistakes happen. I am upset that when I let you know that it was the wrong side you emailed me a response of "Sorry. Looks like you have a spare now". That was not cool. I asked if you had the left one initially and you said yes so I bought it.

You keep saying it was your mistake for not catching my mistake. I guess I don't know what mistake I made. I asked you if it was the left side since you didn't state it in your ad. You responded with yes and so I proceeded with the purchase. I made the PayPal purchase to the address that you sent to me. If it went as a personal payment, that had nothing to do with me. I have used PayPal for years and have never had that happen.

As for making me out to be the bad guy, I would hope that you remember that I received something that I clearly did not ask for. I offered to return it and you were quick to say that you would refund without your shipping charges. There would not have been any shipping charges if you would have let me know that it was the right side instead of the left side. It is simple, you did not pick up on my specific question as to what side it was. You made a mistake and unfortunately, you don't want to take full ownership of it. Instead, you couldn't wait to blast me here in an open forum.

My life goes on. I can't let one bad experience get me down. So far, most people have been wonderful and very helpful with my restoration project.

I posted your email to me regarding your lack of concern. It is below.

Lisl

Emails:

Feb 23, 2010
Hi Jon,

I received the reflector and it was the wrong side. I need the left reflector but this one is for the right side. Do you have the left reflector? I can ship this one back.

Thanks,
Lisl

Response:

Lisl,
Sorry, I don't.
I guess you have a spare now.


Thanks,
Jon
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typesoneandtwo
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Joined: September 29, 2004
Posts: 659
Location: Cape Cod Mass. Bass River
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2010 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am also bummed about the transaction.
Let me explain my position a bit.

You write,
Quote:
I asked if you had the left one initially and you said yes so I bought it


not exactly-here was you initial e-mail.

Quote:
Hello, I am interested in your left rear turn signal. Do you still have it available?"
> Thanks


To be honest, my first thought was, What turn signal? So I clicked the link to see the reflector housing.
My next thought wasn't, "is that left", but "OK that's what she wants, the reflector housing"
You inquired about a specific ad. By writing, "do you still have" I really thought you wanted what was clearly pictured in the ad
I thought it was that ad you were interested in.
Now you really meant the left and indeed wrote "left" but the word "left" appears nowhere the ad. Again my mistake for not noticing that you really didn't want what was in the ad, but its opposite.
It would be far different if you said, "I see in this ad that you have this housing, what side is this?
or "I see that you have a right-hand housing, do you have the left?"


I field such e-mails all the time and respond to the best of my knowledge. Never would I intentionally send the wrong item.

It's obvious that communication broke down and we share the blame.
You could have been clearer that what you needed was indeed not what was in the ad. I should have noted the side/noticed that your initial e-mail didn't match the ad specifics.
You wrote
Quote:
"Sorry. Looks like you have a spare now". That was not cool.

First of all that was misquoted.
I wrote... " Lisl,
Sorry, I don't.
I guess you have a spare now." (see above)
I really felt as though you bought the part that was advertised. My error
It also bears mention that I didn't resort to character attacks.
I never accused you of dishonesty. Todd was very quick to call me a liar.
The last communication I received was this.
Quote:
Serious. What are u, 5 years old? Stop emailing me.
Todd Angel

In hindsight, I really feel the blame is shared. So where are we now?
I am out $30.40 as it stands now.
$25 for the refunded payment and $5.40 for Priority Mail shipment prepaid.
In all fairness all I really ask is that you mail the part back, $5.40
Since blame is truly shared, poor communication on all sides, this seems more than fair.
If you disagree, keep the spare and we'll move on.
I'd like to put this to rest, in any event.
Good luck with the restoration and welcome to thesamba.
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SoCalGhia
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Joined: February 24, 2010
Posts: 2
Location: SoCal
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 1:27 pm    Post subject: Jon Mayo is in Denial Reply with quote

Seriously!!!!

I asked you if it was the left side. You said yes. You admit that you didn't post what side it was. If you were confused on the part I was refering to, why didn't you clairfy with me? The blame is yours and your need to keep "explaining yourself" only makes me more frustrated with this entire situation.

Stop trying to be right. You said that you sell hundreds of things on this website. If you don't pay attention to the emails regarding your items, how on earth do you get any of them right? There would have never been a problem if YOU had just read my question.

There is no blame to share. It is yours. Why you even posted anything about this is confusing. You were the seller. I asked you a simple question. You didn't pay attention to the question. You have posted the proof that it was your fault. Other people see that it was your fault, yet you want to share the blame. It is a $25.00 part which included shipping. I paid the money for a part that I didn't need. I never bought a spare part. I thought I was buying the part that I had asked you for. I was the one who got screwed here. I paid for something that I didn't get.

If you want the part back, send me a prepaid mailing envelope and I will ship it back. I will not be out any money for something that I did not need due to your mistake.

Maybe next time you will be more specific in your ads to help the next buyer. Apparently if they ask what side it is you will just respond yes and accept their payment.

GET OVER IT!!!
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