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jays58s Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2004 Posts: 2133 Location: Nor-Cal
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Posted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:30 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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spectre6000 wrote: |
To avoid further thread hi-jacking, we are discussing some of the finer points differentiating the '58 and '59 model years.
bill may wrote: |
58 and 59 rear fenders are the same. 58/59 front fenders the same. 1960 lost the dimples between bolt holes. |
I really could have used this information a while back.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=393685&highlight=fenders
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392797&highlight=fenders
I asked a few more times in a few more ways in a few more threads, and each time got different answers. The most common and convincing answer I got was that the flare on the front fenders near the running board stopped early in the '59 model year, as evidenced by the existence of og metal conduit fenders (which stopped with the '60 model year) without the flare. This is corroborated by the suggestion that the '59 model year (at least in some markets) started "early in the '59 model year" (say, around November).
bill may wrote: |
difference between 58/59 split case trans chassis and 64 tunnel case trans? 1 difference between 58/59 and 64 is torsion bars and covers were changed in 1960 model year. by the way what is a coupe???? a hardtop beetle is a limosine. |
Also something I've been told multiple times to the contrary. I know the trans is different, I had no idea there was a difference in the chassis beyond that. What are the differences?
bill may wrote: |
if you look at PR part 1 it starts with type 2 on the nov change. |
Explain please. I see the references in the photo above to various Type 2s, but I don't understand your response. Why is the November change bunk? Wilson states, and seems to think (by the photo above to be, at least in some part, validated by PR) November was the point at which the '58-'59 switch occurred.
Further, why is the home market change delay bunk? The home market was the last to get a number of changes and options over the years. The designation "export model" implying a difference between the ones leaving the country and the ones staying (both of the cars in question in the other thread were German market cars). |
I know this is the very beginning of the thread and much has been discussed since, but I have owned numerous 58-59's over the years, and 2 of them were September of '58 cars, and they were all original. Up to November 1st, everything was the same except the '59 only colors that were introduced on what I'm guessing was August first. Cigar ashtrays, the Frankenstein or whatever style rear seat stop posts, the lower rear seat bar spot welded supports & bigger mounting bolts, the Made In Germany tag, the '58 only front turn signal covers with the sharp points, and ribs in the front clip were all used through the end of October. Another thing that I just noticed on my current car that I just got, is that the front tubed fenders do NOT have the step at the running board. My car and a buddy's car that he just got are both 6/59 cars, both all original, and both cars don't have the running board step at the front fenders. Another thing that is weird is that my car has the 1960-61 rear fenders with no ribs. Does anyone else have a 6 or 7 of '59 car that is all original that has non ribbed rear fenders? I can post pictures, but my fenders are the same color on top and underneath, have the same patina/wear everywhere, and the fender beading is perfectly mounted and doesn't appear to have ever been changed. The ONLY non original parts on my car are the tires, ignition switch, coil, and the previous owner added drop spindles to the original beam. Even the blinker relay on my car is the correct 58-60 only relay. I'll try to add pictures soon. |
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bwaz Samba Member
Joined: August 24, 2004 Posts: 1780
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Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2018 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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So I got a reply from VW regarding my 1958 beetle. It’s a little confusing... my car is an early square window car. VW says it was built July 15, 1957, delivered August 2, 1957. According to the technical pages on the samba, the last car on July built was chassis 1600847, my car is 1601113. But if my car was built July 15th, is progressive refinements wrong, or just a pre-startup of square window cars built in July, not August?
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69830 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:35 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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It sounds to me like they started it in July before the vacation period in August and completed it as a 1958 model when they returned.
Sometimes the Progressive Refinements #s used for the VIN charts are off a little. Also I don't know where that number really came from. Is it when the car was completely done and left the factory floor to be shipped or a little earlier or ?
To clarify something:
As far as I know the "delivery date" does not mean it was in Canada, it means that's when it left the factory to be shipped to Canada. _________________ How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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Nick-Rackham Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2009 Posts: 20 Location: Kesgrave, Suffolk, UK
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Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:22 am Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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ida2332cc wrote: |
Gday all, this is my first post on the samba. Ive lurked for a little bit and have finally decided to join mainly due to this 58/59 discussion. Im in australia and have a 1958 bug with aussie flash trim. Mine was last registered in 1984. Mine has what looks like a cigar holder in the ashtray. A locking pushbutton handle on the glovebox lid. It has blade bumpers with short over riders, there is no holes present to have tall over riders. I have a flying vw badge. I also have window washer nozzles and a molded water bottle that goes behing the bonnet latch. I cant find much info on it but it is a vw item that locks into place in that area
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That's one awesome looking bug! I'll be posting mine up soon, a '58 Aussie Deluxe. |
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myvolks1 Samba Member
Joined: February 07, 2011 Posts: 182 Location: Modesto, CA
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Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:32 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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Well, sort of a one year only cigar ashtray as early 59s also have them like my October 58 build registered as a 59. It also has all of the other parts that came on the 58s.
Ruger59 wrote: |
My VW addiction got the better of me today. I couldn't resist this beautiful black 58. It's a numbers matching body and pan with ribbed rear fenders and a four tab hood. Unfortunately it's missing the front fenders, passenger door and deck lid along with a couple other items.
The fenders might be rusty, but I think I can save them.
Near perfect front clip.
Still has it's one year only ash tray!
And a photo of my 59 in which I'm currently rebuilding the original power train. |
_________________ 1959 L358 (Garnet Red)
Type-113 De Luxe Sedan
WANTED: DEET EICHEL (Modesto, CA), license plate frames and other Deet Eichel related items.
Wanted: Original VW |
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jays58s Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2004 Posts: 2133 Location: Nor-Cal
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Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:03 am Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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Does anyone have an all original June or July of 1959 with it's original rear fenders, and are they ribbed or smooth? |
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Bug-nut Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2015 Posts: 488 Location: Knoxville, TN
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Posted: Sat Nov 10, 2018 8:54 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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After a few years of searching I was finally able to track down a correct right hand sunvisor to replace my missing one. I also had to strip off the silver-gray paint a previous “restorer” sprayed onto the left hand visor/mirror assemble. Unfortunately that person also used some fine sandpaper on the chrome bits to help the paint adhere... It’s not highly noticeable but I wish they hadn’t... Anyway I was also somewhat successful in using a heat gun to remove the worst of the warpage from the left hand visor. All in all I’m pretty happy with the results. (And yes I know I have the wrong headliner - I’ll get to it one day. Also I’m sorry for the crapppy cell phone pics.)
_________________ 1959 Fjord Blue Volkswagen Beetle
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight=
1962 Austin-Healey Sprite
Snort wrote: |
A 59 Beetle is just an Oval-Window car with aspirations of modernity. |
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myvolks1 Samba Member
Joined: February 07, 2011 Posts: 182 Location: Modesto, CA
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Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 7:08 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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BTW, your cell phone pics look great (nice and clear).
Bug-nut wrote: |
After a few years of searching I was finally able to track down a correct right hand sunvisor to replace my missing one. I also had to strip off the silver-gray paint a previous “restorer” sprayed onto the left hand visor/mirror assemble. Unfortunately that person also used some fine sandpaper on the chrome bits to help the paint adhere... It’s not highly noticeable but I wish they hadn’t... Anyway I was also somewhat successful in using a heat gun to remove the worst of the warpage from the left hand visor. All in all I’m pretty happy with the results. (And yes I know I have the wrong headliner - I’ll get to it one day. Also I’m sorry for the crapppy cell phone pics.)
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_________________ 1959 L358 (Garnet Red)
Type-113 De Luxe Sedan
WANTED: DEET EICHEL (Modesto, CA), license plate frames and other Deet Eichel related items.
Wanted: Original VW
Last edited by myvolks1 on Thu Nov 15, 2018 7:02 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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67Vw2387 Samba Member
Joined: June 30, 2014 Posts: 215 Location: CT
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:08 am Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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my 58 dash
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sunroof Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006 Posts: 1774 Location: Winnipeg
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Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:11 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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My 1959 T115 dash:
Don _________________ Better and better mistakes! |
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jack1448 Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2012 Posts: 272 Location: Northern NJ
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Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:55 am Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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I might as well play too - here is my 58 dash:
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bwaz Samba Member
Joined: August 24, 2004 Posts: 1780
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Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 2:46 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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EverettB wrote: |
It sounds to me like they started it in July before the vacation period in August and completed it as a 1958 model when they returned.
Sometimes the Progressive Refinements #s used for the VIN charts are off a little. Also I don't know where that number really came from. Is it when the car was completely done and left the factory floor to be shipped or a little earlier or ?
To clarify something:
As far as I know the "delivery date" does not mean it was in Canada, it means that's when it left the factory to be shipped to Canada. |
Wondering how the factory organized building European cars, then export cars or right hand drive ones on the assembly line? Weeks of exports at a time, or days of certain types, or intermixed as they came down the line. |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69830 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 6:28 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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bwaz wrote: |
EverettB wrote: |
It sounds to me like they started it in July before the vacation period in August and completed it as a 1958 model when they returned.
Sometimes the Progressive Refinements #s used for the VIN charts are off a little. Also I don't know where that number really came from. Is it when the car was completely done and left the factory floor to be shipped or a little earlier or ?
To clarify something:
As far as I know the "delivery date" does not mean it was in Canada, it means that's when it left the factory to be shipped to Canada. |
Wondering how the factory organized building European cars, then export cars or right hand drive ones on the assembly line? Weeks of exports at a time, or days of certain types, or intermixed as they came down the line. |
I'd be interested to know that too
I would think the RHD cars were done in batches for ease _________________ How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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bwaz Samba Member
Joined: August 24, 2004 Posts: 1780
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2018 11:20 am Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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I’ve been searching to get a close as possible 36hp to what my August 2/57 delivered car should have. Someone with a July 5/57 built oval was kind enough to pass on their serial and engine number. That car with serial number 1588849 has engine number 1903455. My car built July 15/57 is serial number 1601113 which has their’s 12264 before my car, adding that difference to his engine, my engine could be 1915719? (Cars built 10 days apart) I recognize those blocks we’re going into buses and convertibles too, so it’s only a guess.
As my car is a square window, the Samba says my enine should start with at least a 1937052 block. The block I'm looking at is 1922713 which is midway between all those numbers... anyone with a later July or earlier August (August. 1) delivered car care to help out? Thanks |
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Stephan Schmidt Samba Member
Joined: March 26, 2002 Posts: 213 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:54 am Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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What is the correct color for my wiper arms on my 1959 beetle? Or what paint have you all used in the past that is close?
Thanks!
Stephen |
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stale air Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2007 Posts: 5155 Location: Senoia Ga, formally NorCal
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:54 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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Stephan Schmidt wrote: |
What is the correct color for my wiper arms on my 1959 beetle? Or what paint have you all used in the past that is close?
Thanks!
Stephen |
We have talked about it before, but I couldnt find the post. Anyway, what I have been using for years on not only the wiper arms, but the headlight buckets, backs of the bumper, and bumper brackets (61 and up) is Rustoleum Matte Nickel in a rattle can. Color in my opinion is perfect, and hold up over time. _________________ WANTED: Henry Veale Santa Rosa plate frames
WANTED: Brittsan Motors Fresno plate frames
WANTED: Any Georgia plate frames
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Stephan Schmidt Samba Member
Joined: March 26, 2002 Posts: 213 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 5:16 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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stale air wrote: |
Stephan Schmidt wrote: |
What is the correct color for my wiper arms on my 1959 beetle? Or what paint have you all used in the past that is close?
Thanks!
Stephen |
We have talked about it before, but I couldnt find the post. Anyway, what I have been using for years on not only the wiper arms, but the headlight buckets, backs of the bumper, and bumper brackets (61 and up) is Rustoleum Matte Nickel in a rattle can. Color in my opinion is perfect, and hold up over time. |
Thank you! |
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wiferdill Samba Member
Joined: February 13, 2006 Posts: 67
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Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 8:33 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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Great having do much 58 and 59 info in one place. I can't find anything on the horn for a '59 Euro beetle. Anyone have some first hand experience getting the horn to honk? Still 6 volts. Thanks |
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Eric&Barb Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004 Posts: 24765 Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 8:52 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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wiferdill wrote: |
Great having do much 58 and 59 info in one place. I can't find anything on the horn for a '59 Euro beetle. Anyone have some first hand experience getting the horn to honk? Still 6 volts. Thanks |
Horn is same as 1956-59.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=527652&highlight=horn _________________ In Stereo, Where Available! |
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pops711 Samba Member
Joined: December 01, 2005 Posts: 66
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Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:56 pm Post subject: Re: '58/'59 Beetle Discussion |
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I i have sheared and can not find this information. What color should the shifter and e-brake handle be for a Kalahari beige bug? |
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