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Cranks, but no start. Bad Hall effect sender?
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Cairos Bus
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 5:36 pm    Post subject: Cranks, but no start. Bad Hall effect sender? Reply with quote

Ive searched and read a thousand posts and none seem to be exactly my situation. My van is cranking and cranking but not getting any spark. Plugs all look fine, just had ignition coil checked and its ok as well, rotor and cap could be replaced but likely not the reason. Any ideas about ignition fuses or any other culpirt? Any help is much appreciated.
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Last edited by Cairos Bus on Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:08 pm; edited 1 time in total
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firepilot
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check for fuel pressure, and seeing if the pump is cutting on when key is turned on.

Where in Boise do you live? I am in the SW part of Boise, I am certainly not a Vanagon expert mechanic, but have been thru enough of these trials to have learned a few things the hard way.
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fatboypaul
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You might like to search the term "hall sender", in this forum, it might just be your problem.
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jkidd152
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 9:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Cranks and cranks but no start. Reply with quote

Why not the rotor and cap? Seems like the timing is a likely culprit...but I don't know...
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Cairos Bus
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jkidd - I do plan on replacing the rotor and cap since they are such inexpensive parts but I was really looking for the deepest cause. My rotor would spin when cranked and there wasn't spark coming from the ignition coil so would this be a rotor/cap issue or something else?

When I was searching earlier, I stumbled on another topic dealing with a bad hall sensor/sender? due to dust/dirt/grime and I think I'm experiencing similar conditions. When I pulled the dist cap and rotor it seemed like the hall sender (or I think thats whats under it instead of points) had been in contact with a bit of moisture, lightly oxidized. I called a generic FLAPS as it was early evening and all foreign parts stores were closed and they would have to order the part. Is there any way to visually check if the sender is bad or even clean it up to a better state?

Could a bad hall sender affect engine performance, ie significant loss of power on even light grades?

Firepilot I live up on the bench about a half-mile west of the train depot. I would love to see your syncro, most likely ive seen you around town because the girlfriend and I get excited at every vanagon we see. Are you one of the westy syncros I drool at up at Bogus every time I'm up there? Very Happy Also if you have a Bentley that I would be able to look through until mine arrives in the mail (Christmas in March if you ask me...) I would be forever grateful.

Thanks again for the replies guys, this was my first post after lurking for months and I love how committed we are to having our lifestyle vehicles on the road.
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firepilot
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If Hall sender is bad, ECU will not know engine is turning over, and it will probably not fire as far as I know. Dead ECU could be a culprit too.

Hall sender can be tested, with a multimeter. Bentley talks about how to do it, and I do have one

I havent taken it up to Bogus yet, I recently got it running and have not skiied since. It is a gold Westy, you could have seen it around town. I can try to come by sometime tomorrow and see what we can do
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Cairos Bus
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I bought a multimeter this evening but have no idea how to use it so any help would be awesome. PM me and we can set up a time if you wouldn't mind coming over and looking at it with me. Im completely new to VWs and by no means anything more that a shade-tree mechanic. I think it would be the hall sender it seems to me through searching the samba that the ecu is pretty hardy. What would cause the ecu to go bad?
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The failure of the Hall sender is usually in the wiring, the wires are a tiny gauge and break with time. Just pull on each wire lightly where they go into the plug on the side of the dizzy. If one is broken it will likely pull loose.

You should also check the digital idle stabilizer. If is mounted to the left side on the engine compartment and has two plugs in the bottom. Squeeze the plugs to remove them and then plug them together. If this gives you spark the stabilizer is bad.

You should have 12V power to one side of the coil when the ignition is turned on, this also should power the Hall/ignition control unit.

With a Digijet the only way a bad CPU could stop the coil from firing is if it grounded the signal out, I haven't heard of this happening.
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Bruskyvw
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cairosbus, I had this same problem I checked around the Hall effect sender for cracks did a reading off of the sender with my multimeter (bought a lot of tools during my ordeal) and it was fine. I had someone come over with an ecu and plugged it in and it started right up. If I were you and if you haven't looked already, go through my entire thread about my Vanagon not starting. Hopefully it isn't the ecu (they are pricey) and I'd check everything else before. I.E grounds and hall sender. Find someone around you to see if you could borrow their ECU.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3...hlight=ecu
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RenoVanMan
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am having the same problem now....... Did you ever find the fix??!!?!?
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tencentlife
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have a cranks-but-no-spark situation, and wonder about the Hall generator (it's not a sensor), take an injector pair out and watch to see if they spray while cranking. If they do, the ECU is receiving the Hall signal.
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RicoS
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tencentlife wrote:
If you have a cranks-but-no-spark situation, and wonder about the Hall generator (it's not a sensor), take an injector pair out and watch to see if they spray while cranking. If they do, the ECU is receiving the Hall signal.


Damned clever.

Richie
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