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5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon
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Gizmoman
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:53 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

MarkWard wrote:
Are you asking about removing the spring in the transmission?

If your question was a response to me then yes. It's a last ditch effort though and I am going to see what adjusting the cables or changing pivot arm lengths might do first.
Here is a link to my cable shift post which I just added to this morning.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=681726&highlight=

The addition is regarding Bentley 35.65b which shows two different springs were used - older and newer.
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82 Vanagon Westy - AAZ 1.9 TD, HE200 Holset, WAIC, 27.75 dia tires, Electric power steering, 5-speed AAP w/.078 5th

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bridgetroll13
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:01 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

BTW... the shift from "1st" to second is pretty notchy even with the stock linkage. I think that's more a peculiarity of the box than the linkage.

Erik
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:59 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

Are you asking about removing the spring in the transmission?
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bridgetroll13
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:57 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

I did not read back through the whole thread but I'm pretty sure someone pointed out that the 4 speed linkage can be modified to work wiihtout much effort. I got the front portion of the 5 speed linkage when I bought the 5 speed box but had to buy the back portion of a 4 speed linkage as the original 5 speed rear section was lost in shipping. It works just fine without modification.

I don't know what impact moving the trans back to accommodate the additional length has on using a standard later non-diesel style 4 speed linkage has.

Erik

AAZ / AAP
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Gizmoman
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 5:58 pm    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

My apologies for reviving this thread but there was some discussion threaded throughout that mentioned 5 speed linkages, mods and other bits.

I just did a custom cable shift to control my rebuilt AAP 5-speed and while it works fairly well, the biggest issue is the 1st to 2nd change (as mentioned previously). I realize this is a spring loaded affair - away from first. I wonder if possibly removing the spring could assist with the 1st to 2nd transition.
If anyone with some experience with this would chime in, I'd really appreciate some opinions.

As it stands now, if I could get my hands on all the components required to install the stock 5-speed shift, I might go that route. I have been cruising ebay UK in hopes of finding all the parts but alas, no luck as yet.

Agaion, any assistance would be welcomed.
Jim
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82 Vanagon Westy - AAZ 1.9 TD, HE200 Holset, WAIC, 27.75 dia tires, Electric power steering, 5-speed AAP w/.078 5th

Oversize Spare rack - stock location https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2169071
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Zeitgeist 13
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 9:57 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

Those are exactly what I was talking about.
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 9:26 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

If you have the later carrier bars then I would look at these. They utilize the bars original attachment bolt, but support a hydraulic mount. I can't make those for what they are selling for. No affiliation with the seller.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1382462
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rsvp
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 8:19 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

I've seen those and they look great... but I have my own 83 5 speed bars... only need the mounts, and to fit them.
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Zeitgeist 13
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 8:09 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

It's my understanding that the mount kits Tony sells here on the Samba are originally for Jetta trans mounts. I installed them on a van and really like the way they work. The kit works with '83 and later and/or Tiico carrier bars
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rsvp
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 8:03 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

thanks!

I'll look for those Audi types when I do my conversion

regards,
Steve
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:27 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

Hello, it probably had more to do with the engine brackets I fabricated to support the ALH TDI engine. Here are a couple pictures of my modified carrier bars to support the Saab Mounts. I felt the mounts should be supported around their entire flange.

Since then, I have seen a post where someone is using Audi mounts I believe and are selling the supports to work with the later carrier bar mount brackets. Hope that is of some help. mark

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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rsvp
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:02 am    Post subject: Re: 5 speed in 82 Diesel Vanagon Reply with quote

hi Mark,

regarding your motor mount and why they didn't work for you the same as the OP, can you put up some pictures of what you did, and how that's working form you?

thanks,
Steve
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad to help if I have. I spent about a day staring at the original carrier bars trying to figure out how I would modify the stock bracket to support the Saab mount. I just could not get it right in my head and decided to cut off the factory brackets and fabricate my own mount cups. I don't believe the Saab mount is designed to be hung by the ears only. It probably worked for the original person above, but not for me. Good luck.
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rotaecho
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Awesome! I really want to update the mounts, esp if I'm doing everything else for the conversion. You're various posts here and vwdiesel got me optimistic Very Happy

rsxsr wrote:
Here is a picture that I used as a reference. You can just make out the part number.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here is a listing on Amazon with the years. They were a bit pricey, but comparable in price to the OE diesel mounts. There is cheaper rubber Saab mount, but I opted for the hydraulic ones.

http://www.amazon.com/85-94-Engine-Support-Hydraulic-REIN/dp/B00U11LHB4

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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a picture that I used as a reference. You can just make out the part number.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here is a listing on Amazon with the years. They were a bit pricey, but comparable in price to the OE diesel mounts. There is cheaper rubber Saab mount, but I opted for the hydraulic ones.

http://www.amazon.com/85-94-Engine-Support-Hydraulic-REIN/dp/B00U11LHB4
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rotaecho
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2015 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark,

Have the P/N of those SAAB brackets?

Thanks Sir!

rsxsr wrote:
Erik, congrats on getting back on the road. The vibrations can be cured, but will require some more fabrication. I lived with the vibrations for two major road trips. I believed it could be improved, but the simple things did not give me the result I wanted. After doing some reading, I installed Saab engine mounts to my stock diesel carrier bars and added a torque mount to limit the engine up and down movement. I don't even know the engine is back there now. You can search the gallery for my user name to see more. mark

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Daizee, I have calculated the speeds for the same transmission, but different tire sizes so you can see the difference. At 70 mph going to a taller tire over stock yields about 120 rpm less. The math does not lie. There could be errors in your tach or speedometer that could throw off your calculations.

Gearbox:- Vanagon Air Cooled Transmission 4.57 - .852 4th gear
Tyre:- 185/R14
Engine speeds in top gear:-
30 MPH = 1528 RPM 40 MPH = 2037 RPM 50 MPH = 2546 RPM 60 MPH = 3055 RPM
70 MPH = 3564 RPM 80 MPH = 4074 RPM 90 MPH = 4583 RPM 100 MPH = 5092 RPM
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gearbox:- Vanagon Air Cooled Transmission 4.57 - .852 4th gear
Tyre:- Yokohama 215/65/16
Engine speeds in top gear:-
30 MPH = 1476 RPM 40 MPH = 1968 RPM 50 MPH = 2460 RPM 60 MPH = 2952 RPM
70 MPH = 3444 RPM 80 MPH = 3936 RPM 90 MPH = 4428 RPM 100 MPH = 4920 RPM


These numbers are the same regardless of what engine powerplant you have. mark
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My other hobby is car racing. We can get almost any gear ratio for the racing transmissions and the rear ends have quick change gears for an almost infininte number of final ratios. I have software for crunching the numbers. With the Vanagon, we are limited to our options, so choosing is not so easy. I spent about a month running calculations before pulling the trigger on the 4.14 ring and pinion. What was more difficult was deciding on which 4th gear to choose. Stock, .77 or .70. Highway gearing was more important to me so I went with the .77. Honestly the calculated difference with the 4.14 and the stock 4th was not much better than the 4.57 I had been running. So I went with the .77. I am a little over geared now for long high speed grades. I don't see those in the Southeast, but out west they are everywhere. I just ordered new nozzels from ID Parts. I don't want to damage anything in the driveline, so I opted for the Bosio Sprint 520's. They are spec'd similar to the european TDI. I can't wait to put them in. I will do dyno runs before and after and report back. mark
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DAIZEE
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not quite sure what you are saying but I went to 15", correct load was taken into account and my highest 'normal' rpm is lower that 3000. I've always wondered why it was lower because in my 5 speed cars, it is usually at 3000 at speed with no obvious excess engine load. i.e. I shift my cars by rpm AND sound and then speed.
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bridgetroll13
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Sort of like being in too tall a gear on a bicycle. You have more top speed, but your legs are killing you.


No matter how many times I used to try and explain that to people they would just look at me funny (of course they still do but for other reasons).
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