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kever56
Samba Member
Joined: September 06, 2004
Posts: 14
Location: Antwerp
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 Posted: Fri May 28, 2010 10:48 am Post subject: Judson which distributor? |
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Hello,
What's the best distributor for my 36 HP engine with Judson compressor?
greetings Geert |
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Braukuche
Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004
Posts: 11005
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| Posted: Fri May 28, 2010 11:32 am Post subject: Re: Judson which distributor? |
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| kever56 wrote: |
Hello,
What's the best distributor for my 36 HP engine with Judson compressor?
greetings Geert |
They were designed to run with a stock diz, right? I use a 019 in mine. |
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Steve22
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2004
Posts: 1389
Location: the wild unknown
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| Posted: Fri May 28, 2010 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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I used to run mine with the stock dizzy on my 40hp, also ran it with a Bosch 010. Both worked very nicely.
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'65 Karmann Ghia 'vert
'73 Super Beetle
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Glenn 
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 76949
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Fri May 28, 2010 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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I've seen them with 010 and stock VJU4BR8.
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Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
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John Moxon
Samba Moderator
Joined: March 07, 2004
Posts: 13958
Location: Southampton U.K.
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ProjectX
Accessory Nut
Joined: May 01, 2006
Posts: 1014
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| Posted: Sat May 29, 2010 7:35 am Post subject: |
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Or you could always run a Blue Screamer 
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kever56
Samba Member
Joined: September 06, 2004
Posts: 14
Location: Antwerp
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| Posted: Sun May 30, 2010 11:39 am Post subject: |
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| 56OvalRHD wrote: |
Or you could always run a Blue Screamer
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that's something i don't know  |
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Pharquarx
Samba Member
Joined: August 24, 2005
Posts: 249
Location: Southern California (Orange County)
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| Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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So, no performance or incompatibility issues with the Blue Screamer. Guess it comes down to sex appeal.
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Charlie
Stock 67 Vert Under Restoration
1958 Lambretta TV175 Series 1
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1970 Triumph T120R (Bonneville)
1950 Vincent Comet
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kever56
Samba Member
Joined: September 06, 2004
Posts: 14
Location: Antwerp
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| Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 10:04 am Post subject: |
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| Pharquarx wrote: |
| So, no performance or incompatibility issues with the Blue Screamer. Guess it comes down to sex appeal. |
Hey,
Indeed I also think it's the main thing is the look.
Can I do something wrong to the engine or judson with installing this distributor?
@John Moxon: We've seen eachother in Hessisch Oldendorf last year at Alejandro's place. I promised you pictures of my car for your site. I'll try to do this next week. 
Greetings Geert |
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John Moxon
Samba Moderator
Joined: March 07, 2004
Posts: 13958
Location: Southampton U.K.
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brisbane6
Samba Member
Joined: July 08, 2018
Posts: 16
Location: Queensland
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 4:25 am Post subject: 40hp Judson & fat boy distributor |
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| John Moxon wrote: |
| Stock out of the box Judson set-up...stock distributor...runs very well. |
Hi team...would appreciate any guidance...connect or disconnect vacuum?? ...I installed Judson in my 1959 bus...I am running zv/pau4r5...the vacuum advance line is connected. 5deg static timing translates to 8deg idle. The idle is sitting about 1000rpm currently. The thing is: Even on no load it rockets to full advance really quickly when the throttle is opened. Also (when warmed up but not so much at all when cold engine) it is inclined to pink/detonate at low rpm picking up load (not at high rpm). I am wondering should I disconnect the vacuum altogether...and aim for some intermediate advance setting. Or swap to centrifugal advance distributor. Or.....?
Would really appreciate any actual experience out there. Oh yes, carb is 28pict. Engine is stock 40hp 1960 engine. Plugs b6hs 25 thou. Points ignition 16 thou / 48 dwell.
Thanks in advance... |
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Glenn
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 76949
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 4:28 am Post subject: Re: Judson which distributor? |
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The zv/pau4r5. is vacuum only so if you disconnect the hose you'll get no advance.
I've seen almost every distributor used including 383,VJ4BR8, VJU4BR8, VJ4BR25, 010, zv/pau4r5. and 009.
But i've been told by customers that they find the VJ4BR25/010 to work the best.
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare |
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brisbane6
Samba Member
Joined: July 08, 2018
Posts: 16
Location: Queensland
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 5:19 am Post subject: Re: Judson which distributor? |
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Ok...just thinking...010 is centrifugal-only, right? Just to test something with you...: This is my daily driver in traffic etc...ie mostly NOT constant rpm cruising (nor screaming) etc, but rather has to respond through the rev range...knowing that, what do you think, still yes to 010? Also does a few trips a year of say-1000km highway driving each time.
[Definitely does seem that vacuum signalling is not very effective or meaningful when coupled with supercharger...that’s why I thought maybe disconnect it altogether and just choose some mild advance that gives tolerable response whilst avoiding preignition...Silly idea maybe?] |
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Glenn
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 76949
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 5:46 am Post subject: Re: Judson which distributor? |
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I've had mechanical only distributors for 40 years with over 400,000 miles of daily driving.
I live on Long Island so i've spent many miles in traffic. I've also driven across the USA twice in the car and did many out of state car shows.
BTW, Porsche has mechanical only distributors across all the 356 and 912 from 1948 to 1969. They didn't add vacuum advance till the 70s when they needed to lower emissions.
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Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
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TomSimon
Samba Member
Joined: January 13, 2004
Posts: 751
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 6:17 am Post subject: Re: Judson which distributor? |
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This has me curious;
Since you shouldn't get a vacuum signal using a blower, wouldn't the vacuum portion of the distributor essentially not do anything?
Glenn, correct me if I'm wrong, but don't most VW 'vacuum advance distributors' have both the vacuum pot and rod, and mechanical flyweights acting on the timing advancer plate? If I remember right, the vacuum tugs on the rod, rotating the plate mostly at lower rpms, when the vacuu signal is stronger, and the flyweights add advance as centrigugal force increases with rpm, adding advance, over riding any input from the vacuum pot and rod.
I would think you'd want a mechanical advance only type distributor, but limit the advance to 20deg 'all in', as supercharged engines typically like less advanced timing than a NA inducted engine. The turbocharged race vw engines I've tuned on liked the advance locked out completely (but that might be a diffent animal than a slightly pressurized, 3psi maybe, 36hp engine) Maybe using a vacuum advance distributor does the same thing, limit advance to only what the mechanical advance contributes?
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Glenn
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 76949
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 7:01 am Post subject: Re: Judson which distributor? |
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| TomSimon wrote: |
| Glenn, correct me if I'm wrong, but don't most VW 'vacuum advance distributors' have both the vacuum pot and rod, and mechanical flyweights acting on the timing advancer plate? |
From 61 to about 71 VWs had vacuum only. There are exceptions so there is no "set" rule.
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare |
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6371
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:56 am Post subject: |
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| ProjectX wrote: |
Or you could always run a Blue Screamer
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Blue Screamer or black 019, they are the same thing.
_________________
Roads Scholar &
1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018
1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc
1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse |
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6371
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:01 am Post subject: Re: 40hp Judson & fat boy distributor |
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| brisbane6 wrote: |
| John Moxon wrote: |
| Stock out of the box Judson set-up...stock distributor...runs very well. |
Hi team...would appreciate any guidance...connect or disconnect vacuum?? ...I installed Judson in my 1959 bus...I am running zv/pau4r5...the vacuum advance line is connected. 5deg static timing translates to 8deg idle. The idle is sitting about 1000rpm currently. The thing is: Even on no load it rockets to full advance really quickly when the throttle is opened. Also (when warmed up but not so much at all when cold engine) it is inclined to pink/detonate at low rpm picking up load (not at high rpm). I am wondering should I disconnect the vacuum altogether...and aim for some intermediate advance setting. Or swap to centrifugal advance distributor. Or.....?
Would really appreciate any actual experience out there. Oh yes, carb is 28pict. Engine is stock 40hp 1960 engine. Plugs b6hs 25 thou. Points ignition 16 thou / 48 dwell.
Thanks in advance... |
If you are going to run a stock VJU 4 BR 8 with the vacuum line disconnected you might as well run an 019 as the mechanical advance weights are identical.
_________________
Roads Scholar &
1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018
1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc
1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse |
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6371
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:10 am Post subject: Re: Judson which distributor? |
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| brisbane6 wrote: |
Ok...just thinking...010 is centrifugal-only, right? Just to test something with you...: This is my daily driver in traffic etc...ie mostly NOT constant rpm cruising (nor screaming) etc, but rather has to respond through the rev range...knowing that, what do you think, still yes to 010? Also does a few trips a year of say-1000km highway driving each time.
[Definitely does seem that vacuum signalling is not very effective or meaningful when coupled with supercharger...that’s why I thought maybe disconnect it altogether and just choose some mild advance that gives tolerable response whilst avoiding preignition...Silly idea maybe?] |
Sounds like you're riding a race horse in a parade, not criticizing. IF the vacuum advance is still functional even with a supercharger you might be happier with the smoother running VJU 4 BR 8. An 010 might be overkill being known as a race distributor. The 019/VJU 4BR 8 are known as more of a street distributor, you have the choice of a Black or blue suit too 
Aw heck, I for one would not be against painting an 010 in blue, as long as everything else on the distributor is kosher.
_________________
Roads Scholar &
1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018
1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc
1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse |
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6371
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:17 am Post subject: Re: Judson which distributor? |
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| TomSimon wrote: |
This has me curious;
Since you shouldn't get a vacuum signal using a blower, wouldn't the vacuum portion of the distributor essentially not do anything?
Glenn, correct me if I'm wrong, but don't most VW 'vacuum advance distributors' have both the vacuum pot and rod, and mechanical flyweights acting on the timing advancer plate? If I remember right, the vacuum tugs on the rod, rotating the plate mostly at lower rpms, when the vacuu signal is stronger, and the flyweights add advance as centrigugal force increases with rpm, adding advance, over riding any input from the vacuum pot and rod.
I would think you'd want a mechanical advance only type distributor, but limit the advance to 20deg 'all in', as supercharged engines typically like less advanced timing than a NA inducted engine. The turbocharged race vw engines I've tuned on liked the advance locked out completely (but that might be a diffent animal than a slightly pressurized, 3psi maybe, 36hp engine) Maybe using a vacuum advance distributor does the same thing, limit advance to only what the mechanical advance contributes? |
The mechanical weights have no effect upon the vacuum advance plate. They have separate functions.
_________________
Roads Scholar &
1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018
1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc
1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse |
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