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mcpudin Samba Member
Joined: December 28, 2008 Posts: 1
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Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2021 12:49 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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I have a '60. Somewhere in the process of having her worked on the passenger foot rest (the plate that is under the mat in the passenger foot well at the front) has disappeared. Are these unique to the convertibles or will one from a sedan also fit?
As I know all of you can relate the restoration has been quite a process but driving her on a summer day makes up for all the past frustration! |
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RUN99 Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2015 Posts: 30 Location: TR
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Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2022 11:41 am Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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Hey guys,
I found a 1958 beetle and it doesn’t have its original body or ID plate.
They swaped the body with a regular sedan beetle in 70’s.
Current owner claims it is an original convertible pan, but how can I confirm whether it is an original vert car or not?
Cheers |
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GüteAndTite Early Convertible Güru
Joined: June 16, 2005 Posts: 2144 Location: Low So Cal
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2022 3:09 am Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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hello to all!
i've come to this wonderful site after having bought by chance a 1958 convertible at an auction. It had been imported from South-Africa in 2013 and thus RHD.Pan and body are rustless and never been welded so hopefully we will share a wonderful future. Nethertheless it has lot of patina the paint not being OG but repainted in all parts sometime in the deep past and the outside obviously repainted again some years ago in a similar hue.
Vin is 1 973 267 but importation documents state a 2 030420. Plate in the spare wheel well shows the former vin but BC from vw describes the relevant item a sedan RHD. So where the convertible body came from? I must believe a mixup has occurred when the older pan was married with a slightly younger body whose vin plate was conserved leading to subsequent registration of the newer vin. PO probably felt the discrepancy when trying to permit the vehicle in germany, so he chose to repurpose the older vin which is marked on the body itself. I guess that the vin plate is not the original one and am waiting for the bc of the vin 2 030420...
Some impressions of the vehicle from auctioneer
and on the spot
As you can see it's lacking the regular decklid and some more original details. semaphores ar working. now i'm beginning to compliment it. motor# is not matching but with its # 3 652 204 likely a 36 hp of the late 1959 (please correct me for this). original color should have been alabaster but up to now i have no intention to renew it.
Hopeful of having some support here when severe questions occur
..and sorry for my stiff english
Many greetings from germany and
always yours kai-eric |
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aa390392 Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2007 Posts: 3602 Location: So.Cal
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:13 am Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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Car shows well, hopefully you can clear the title up, yes, it’s a driver, so do enjoy it. And don’t worry about the small stuff..grab as it comes along. How is the stop? Ez to operate? _________________ .
getting grumpy & less tolerant!
55 ragtop
56 delux sedan
56 Kabriolet |
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2022 3:29 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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yes, it's running
first interventions will consist in checking mechanical functions and lubrification of the whole system as the car was part of a collection and rarely moved (150 km within 3 years). still i'm not familiar with it |
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sinclair Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2004 Posts: 393 Location: New Forest UK
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Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2022 3:50 am Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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Hi.
One more for the register. April 1960.
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2023 4:17 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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great car. do you have some more pics for us? |
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restojohnny Samba Member
Joined: February 13, 2004 Posts: 2763 Location: SPLITSVILLE , SON !!!!
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Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2023 8:22 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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Here’s pics of my December 58 rust free convertible came with original oval convertible rear view mirror and rear convertible banana window and a few other early perohaus accessories
_________________ ** HELL YEAH I'LL SELL IT TO YOU**
O.G. POMONA VULTURE
$$ SWAPMEET MAFIA $$
53 LHD, LH cargo door standard kombi
54 Pre-A Porsche
55 oval ribbed door non-semiphore
56 semiphore ragtop
63 notchback (work in progress)
67 OG black paint beetle sedan empi accessorized
67 original Empi GTV beetle convertible !!
67 euro squareback
67 deluxe walkthru (work in progress)
67 convertible ghia (work in progress)
"STAY OUTTA MY BACKYARD !!! " |
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Karmann Gheezer Samba Member
Joined: April 12, 2006 Posts: 429
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Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2023 9:27 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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Getting closer.
_________________
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 2:30 am Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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it's getting a real beauty!
which are the colours that you chose for the body? and did you get clear about the tint of the roof? |
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 2:55 am Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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and i won't nag but what's about the supports for the rear side overriders? will you drill the holes for them in a final step? |
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 5:15 am Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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would need your appreciated opinion regarding the colour of the accessories in my 7-1958 cab.
in the dark of the past they did revise the body paint including seat frames etc. in the same colour. nos colour had been alabaster for the body and supposedly l471 stone beige for the acessories but they chose a lighter hue for the repaint.
while i will stay with the body colour i was researching the nos colour of the seat frames, column tube, steering while and e-break lever, and made some disturbing discoveries. when i sanded back the surfaces i found different colours on them.
seat frames and wheel were coated in a grey shade much ressembling what is considered l471 stone beige in its darker shade
on steering column,indicator housing and e-brake handle i've revealed a different colour being a rather apricot beige
it's similar to another hue of l471 listed with glasurit as l471 light stone beige
i confered to ral colour chart and found it pretty similar to the ivory hues on it.
as there's no inferior layer underneath i must assume that po has removed all coating to bare metal before respraying.
now i'm wondering if different colours were implemented on '58 convertibles or seats and steering wheel have been swapped in the past.
your conclusions? |
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Karmann Gheezer Samba Member
Joined: April 12, 2006 Posts: 429
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 4:39 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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kaieric wrote: |
it's getting a real beauty!
which are the colours that you chose for the body? and did you get clear about the tint of the roof? |
Kai, the color was chosen to mimic a cabriolet on the front page of Hot Wheels magazine (March 1985). The wheels were painted first (not present on cabriolet right now). However, when my friend painted the body he accidentally chose a lighter color. Disappointed, of course, I could not complain for the price was ridiculously affordable. The top will be the same as the front cover photo. When I purchased the ’60 there were no fenders. I found a set from a ’58 bug at a swap meet. Did not notice the support hole missing until installing the bumpers. A hole will be drilled to accept the supports.
Just like aa390392 says, your car shows very well. You just need to touch up a few places here and there. Drive it as much as possible and enjoy as it is. As much time, effort, and $ I have in my car I will be very cautious when and where I drive it. So I may not get to enjoy the freedom of getting out on the road as much.
GüteAndTite: Notice holes are covered now. Thank you for your advice. _________________
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 5:22 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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thx for thy nice words, karmann gheezer.
hope you will reconsider the way you will use the car as soon as it's ready to be driven. would be a pity to leave it guarding the garage! anyway colours are wonderful!
beside the accessory colour there are some more items to be corrected on my vert: trans,carpets, new top, not to mention the lesser doings like new brake drums and further mechanical revision.
as to my ask for the colour issues i would be interested in knowing who ever stated that accessories in '58+'59 models were executed in l471 stone beige. i never saw any evidence for that.
who can help me out?
Last edited by kaieric on Sun Jan 29, 2023 1:50 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Karmann Gheezer Samba Member
Joined: April 12, 2006 Posts: 429
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 7:43 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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Kai, in the Samba literature archives I'm sure there are brochures that list what your looking for. I am in to Ghia lowlights and have found factory paint brochures there that are very helpful. I would suggest you post your question in a new topic in the forum below. You'll get a much quicker answer. Best of luck to you.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewforum.php?f=2 _________________
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AlteWagen Troll
Joined: February 23, 2007 Posts: 8498 Location: PNW
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Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 1:46 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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Your body/chassis vin is from 6/58, while the 'document' is 8/58. The worst part is the vin plate on the body is a poor reproduction with incorrect rivets and wrong number stamps. The stamped body number under the fake vin plate comes back to as 2/57 which makes sense as VW dropped its use in 6/58. With that you know there was some SERIOUS damage to the front of the vehicle at some point
What might be even worse depending what you find is the VIN on the pan is very suspicious and looks like there might have been weld work done. The stamps do not look VW either.
The side pic is also concerning. No jack point on the support rail and the strange taper length wise show home brew repair. I would not be surprised if it is just angle iron welded to rust.
That car is what we call a frankenbug, a car made from spare parts not actually assembled by VW or Karmann. This is common in most 3rd world countries but surprised it was able to get onto an auction block with all those red flags. On something as serious as VIN tampering you may have recourse against the auction house.
You can send off vin to see if it is a real vert number but if the prior owner is using that VIN on another car you might have an issue in the future.
Do you have a title for ANY of the actual numbers stamped on the car or papers for a car someone else owns?
You mentioned S. Africa, so CKD might come up. No CKD kabrioletts were produced as far as I know.
A better outlook might be that since it looks like it was a vert body converted to RHD using sedan parts you can do what ever you want with it. Incorrect hood, fenders and sedan semaphores welded into the body, no problem. Paint it what ever color you want, slam it, race it burn it with no regrets of harming a real kabriolett. The only problem will be trying to get someone to pay real vert price at time of resale. There is now no investment value in that car other than a nice driver or the sum of its parts (depending how much bondo is holding the rust together).
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but would hate to see you put more money in that vehicle with no possibility of getting it back. _________________ Grapes of Wrath $200 Engine Rebuild
Official Dual Carb Thread
Cylinder Head Quick Reference Sheet |
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 5:51 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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thank you for your estimations. however i'm not interested in selling the car. |
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AlteWagen Troll
Joined: February 23, 2007 Posts: 8498 Location: PNW
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Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 6:12 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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kaieric wrote: |
thank you for your estimations. however i'm not interested in selling the car. |
As a retired deputy my outlook may be a little different than the average hood ride enthusiest. With the story you stated publicly, the paper work you mentioned and the obvious VIN tampering it would be impounded for sure and with no title you would never get it back. It would be destroyed because of the VIN situation.
Maybe the TUV doesnt care about possible stolen, reconstructed, poorly repaired structural rust, etc, etc, over there but from what Ive heard I doubt thats the case.
Just make sure to let your survivors know what the deal is with the car so when they go to sell it after you are gone they are realistic about selling price.
Make sure to post your findings as you peel back all the layers of this onion so that others may learn from your situation. VW Kabrioletts have a STEEP and expensive learning curve. _________________ Grapes of Wrath $200 Engine Rebuild
Official Dual Carb Thread
Cylinder Head Quick Reference Sheet |
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kaieric Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2022 Posts: 87 Location: saarbruecken/germany
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Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 6:19 pm Post subject: Re: 58-60 "Early Big Window" Convertible Registry |
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don't worry - i'm not going to pass into silence.
any idea about the colour request? |
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