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supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 4020
Location: houston
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supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 4020
Location: houston
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 Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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I should retitle this thread to "how much money can i spend on a type 3?"
so i just sold my bike, now i have all the funds needed to do the type 4 swap.
I scored a 411 air duct, yay for me. thats one less thing to get fabbed up.
buying/bought:
bus 2.0L
72-74 bus heater boxes
" " bugpack header/muffler
gasket set with pulley/flywheels seals
KEP flywheel/clutch
jake raby cam/lifters
bus 1800 rebuild heads from bus depot
megasquirt/walbro fuel pump
type 4 voltage regulator
bunch of misc crap
my pan is so minty fresh it doesn't even have a clutch pedal stop so i found one on here shipped for 5 bucks. all this nickel and dime stuff is killing me.
does anyone know what the diameter is for the rear torsion bars on a notch?
_________________
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/chucky1974/ninja.gif
Nick
Megasquirted Type 4 powered Notch http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=427890&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Blog of Doom http://supaninjanick.wordpress.com/ |
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localboy
Samba Longboarder
Joined: December 06, 2003
Posts: 5153
Location: "Mainland", PNW
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| Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 6:30 am Post subject: |
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| supaninja wrote: |
| ...all this nickel and dime stuff is killing me. |
Wait 'till you get to the required quarters....
_________________
One man's "patina" is another man's cancer...
Black '65 Resto-Custom S Notch 2110 cc powered
original paint Pearl White '66 Westy SO-42
Allstate single-wheel trailer project |
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notchboy
Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 22463
Location: Escondido CA
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supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 4020
Location: houston
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| Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:30 am Post subject: |
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college starts next wednesday, the pace will drop to a crawl. megasquirt has already shipped, i'll have to assemble it, and figure out where i'm going to mount it/run the wire harness. i'm thinking under the drivers side rear seat and it would be super clean if i can run the wires with the factory harness. I'm looking at mounting the fuel pump under the fuel tank. I'm going to have a shift tunnel cover made with mounting points welded on, I won't have to worry about the pump lossing its prime, no holes in the car for it, and it should be somewhat quite too. I still need to order a weld on bung for the return to the tank and a fuel filter, summit-racing.com FTW on that stuff. I'm shooting for one of the cleanest type 4 installs, its looking very doable right now.
_________________
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/chucky1974/ninja.gif
Nick
Megasquirted Type 4 powered Notch http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=427890&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Blog of Doom http://supaninjanick.wordpress.com/ |
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Mr. Unpopular
Samba Member
Joined: September 20, 2005
Posts: 3715
Location: Tampa Florida
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| Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:31 am Post subject: |
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I've wanted to build a T4 powered T3 since 1994. Good luck with your project. I'll be checking in regularly.
_________________
"In any racing engine, the nearer you are to it disintegrating, the better it's performance will be"
-Keith Duckworth, creator of the Ford/Cosworth DFV |
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Randall
Samba Member
Joined: October 03, 2004
Posts: 1403
Location: Orange County, Alta California, El Norte
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| Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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| supaninja wrote: |
does anyone know what the diameter is for the rear torsion bars on a notch? |
On my '63 Notch it is:
diameter: 0.9085" = 23.0759 mm (measured with dial caliper) commonly referred to as 23 mm.
length: 2'+11/16" = 62.7 cm
I would be surprised if it weren't the same as on a '65 since they both are swing axle. |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22431
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| supaninja wrote: |
I should retitle this thread to "how much money can i spend on a type 3?"
so i just sold my bike, now i have all the funds needed to do the type 4 swap.
I scored a 411 air duct, yay for me. thats one less thing to get fabbed up.
buying/bought:
bus 2.0L
72-74 bus heater boxes
" " bugpack header/muffler
gasket set with pulley/flywheels seals
KEP flywheel/clutch
jake raby cam/lifters
bus 1800 rebuild heads from bus depot
megasquirt/walbro fuel pump
type 4 voltage regulator
bunch of misc crap |
Sounds like you should have paid a grand less since the old engine it came with was junk. 
Good luck with the t-4 install, and take some pics, as we love pictures here. Scoring the NLA T-4 wagon cooling boot is a plus, I know as I have one myself that I picked up years ago for doing my own t-4 conversion.  Here's a pic of mine.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 4020
Location: houston
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| Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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Sweet bob, i'll whore up this thread with pics, I love watching your t34's progress so i'll do the same. is that a 914 2.0L? Thats a clean install Bob.
Ya I got the shaft on that deal, I am going to tear the old type 3 motor apart after i pull it and have a look at the damage, but i doubt i'll time or money to spend on it. Got some sweet parts on the way for this type 4 conversion but its looking like the seller is MIA. I had really good communication and bamm nothing now, i guess he doesn't want my money.
thats interesting Randall, i was told by someone else that notch's and fasty's have 22mm torsion bars like bugs and square's have the 23mm ones. Tomorrow i'm going to swoop on some 24mm ones, that should stiffen it up a little, i'll measure the ones i have in it currently but i suspect they are 22mm's since the butt dropped so much when i put the engine in it, and i can get the back tires hopping with just one hand, lol.
i towed the notch to my mothers house where its going to await the new motor.
_________________
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/chucky1974/ninja.gif
Nick
Megasquirted Type 4 powered Notch http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=427890&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Blog of Doom http://supaninjanick.wordpress.com/ |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22431
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:47 am Post subject: |
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| supaninja wrote: |
| Sweet bob, i'll whore up this thread with pics, I love watching your t34's progress so i'll do the same. is that a 914 2.0L? Thats a clean install Bob. |
Thanks for the compliments. It's actually a 1.7L 914 motor. It still has the domed pistons, which bring the compression up a little. It's running on D-jet FI (same as a stock t-3 uses, but with the t-4 ECU, and MPS). I only had to trim the engine tin a little (about a 1/2") along the left side and rear to clear the body work (body side engine surround section). Since it's IRS, I had to fab my own engine hanger, but works just fine, and swaps into the car easy enough. It's set up so I can swap in a t-3 engine in a couple of hours IF needed. One of these days I'll find my short intake manifolds, and see if I can fit a set of carbs on it under the floor, then I could use that engine in any t-3 I have here (I've even got a t-4 flex plate ). I still have my 2.0L, but I need to tear it down and swap the cam and lifters in it, as someone put hydros in a non-hydro case.  Oh well, can't complain too much, as I didn't give a lot of money for it, and it's all brand new.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Randall
Samba Member
Joined: October 03, 2004
Posts: 1403
Location: Orange County, Alta California, El Norte
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| supaninja wrote: |
| thats interesting Randall, i was told by someone else that notch's and fasty's have 22mm torsion bars like bugs and square's have the 23mm ones. |
That "someone else" is correct. I looked in the Bentley Official Service Manual for Type 3, the one with the brown cover originally costing $19.95 covering years '68-'73, and a table showed swing axle models 311-317 (Notchbacks and Fastbacks) had 22 mm bars. Models 361-363 (Squarebacks) had 23 mm bars.
Here is a table of Type 3 Model Numbers.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/modelstype3.php
Several years ago, I had to replace the original torsion bar / frame horn housing in my Notch when the right-side torsion bar housing broke off where it was welded at the factory to the transmission frame horn. Apparently I replaced it with one from a Squareback. I used the torsion bars from my Notch in the replacement housing. That is why the leftover bars, the ones I measured, are 23 mm.
The Bentley table also shows that the IRS torsion bars are 50 mm longer than the swing axle bars. Their diameters are 22 mm for the 311 models and 23.5 mm for the 361 models.
By the way, a member in the Philippines is selling a bunch of rare Type 3 parts. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=298857 |
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Randall
Samba Member
Joined: October 03, 2004
Posts: 1403
Location: Orange County, Alta California, El Norte
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 8:42 am Post subject: |
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I applaud you on your project, Bobnotch. But there's one revealing piece of information in the photo that bothers me.
I will let the following site do the talking for me.  Click here |
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Mike Fisher
Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006
Posts: 17970
Location: Eugene, OR
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:21 am Post subject: |
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Maybe he's 260 lbs like me? 
_________________
https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 4020
Location: houston
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:35 am Post subject: |
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Bob- nice, i was wondering about the 914 tin fitting in a t3 engine bay, seems like minimal trimming. Maybe i'll fix the 1600dp and keep it as a spare, when i wire in the megasquirt i'm leaving the stock wiring harness unmolested so it will be a easy swap between the two engines.
Randall-thanks i just learned something. The PO did a lot of mix and matching on the pan when he went through it. its got the same VIN as the body (early July '65 notch) but he swapped in front discs and 4 lug rear brakes, it also has a swing axle. the rear torsion bars appear to be the longer IRS ones as well. all this is working in my favor, I have some options on torsion bars with the longer ones, the swing axle subframe doesn't require a engine hanger for the type 4 motor(the motor comes with a bus hanger) and i can care less about wide 5 lug pattern, i will gladly have front discs. tonight i'll post up what i'm doing about the torsion bars.
i bought the type 4 motor, waiting on the seller to get back to me with the address so i can ship it here. I got the motor complete for $200, so i'm going to have to go through it. Not a biggie since i was going to split the case and install the RAT cam anyways. I ordered up a weld on bung for the return to the tank and some POR 15 fuel tank sealer, I figured i might as well seal it up so I won't ever have to worry about it rusting out, or rust related injector problems.
I read all of B3rt's build thread last night, NOS fastback its friggin sweet. maybe down the road i'll try and get this thing 100% correct but not right now. its just going to be a nice uncorrect notch w/ a type 4 motor in it.
_________________
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/chucky1974/ninja.gif
Nick
Megasquirted Type 4 powered Notch http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=427890&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Blog of Doom http://supaninjanick.wordpress.com/ |
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supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 4020
Location: houston
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Russ Wolfe
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2004
Posts: 25187
Location: Central Iowa
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:41 am Post subject: |
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Free beer is the best, whether it is lite beer or not.
_________________
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up, you end up with a lot of scum on the top!--Edward Abbey
Gary: OK. Ima poop. |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22431
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Randall wrote: |
I applaud you on your project, Bobnotch. But there's one revealing piece of information in the photo that bothers me.
I will let the following site do the talking for me. Click here |
Sorry you feel that way about it, but I like Michelob light, as it doesn't fill me up like regular Michelob (it seems heavier and more filling) does and it allows me to drink and work at the same time. And bud light tastes like water compared to the Mic light. Just my opinion. Plus I like to keep my weight down, since I have a tendency to drink 6 or more at a sitting.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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| Back to top |
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supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 4020
Location: houston
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supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 4020
Location: houston
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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Here's the list of all the goodies on their way to my house, its going to be like christmas. damn i heart car parts
1977 bus 2L complete engine, includes FI and alternator wire harnesses
200mm type 4 flywheel
pilot bearing/washer/oring/main seal for the flywheel
megasquirt (management for the stock FI)
72-74 bus header with a o2 bung already on it
bugpack muffler for said header
411 air duct
type 4 voltage regulator
front shocks
24mm torsion bars
steering damper
all new exhaust, intake mani, and valve cover gaskets
por 15 for the engine tin and gas tank
por 15 gas tank sealer
por 20 for the exhaust
weld on bung for the fuel return to the fuel tank
FI fuel filter
walbro 255lph inline fuel pump
new jake raby cam, lifters, cam bearings, rod bearings, and rings
i sent my NOS dual circuit master cylinder off to get rebuilt since it only lasted for about 2 pumps
all thats left of the conversion is a set of 72-74 bus heater boxes so i can make j-pipes out of them and have them shortened an inch
I found a porsche 2L long block with the 3 bolt heads thats only $600 shipped. i'm seriously thinking about it, those motors are hot. just those heads go for 250 ea.
i'm still sorting out the details with the seller so i can have the motor shipped. Luckily the engine was dirt cheap. but everything is coming together.
_________________
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/chucky1974/ninja.gif
Nick
Megasquirted Type 4 powered Notch http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=427890&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Blog of Doom http://supaninjanick.wordpress.com/ |
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Russ Wolfe
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2004
Posts: 25187
Location: Central Iowa
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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| supaninja wrote: |
Here's the list of all the goodies on their way to my house, its going to be like christmas. damn i heart car parts
1977 bus 2L complete engine, includes FI and alternator wire harnesses
200mm type 4 flywheel
pilot bearing/washer/oring/main seal for the flywheel
megasquirt (management for the stock FI)
72-74 bus header with a o2 bung already on it
bugpack muffler for said header
411 air duct
type 4 voltage regulator
front shocks
24mm torsion bars
steering damper
all new exhaust, intake mani, and valve cover gaskets
por 15 for the engine tin and gas tank
por 15 gas tank sealer
por 20 for the exhaust
weld on bung for the fuel return to the fuel tank
FI fuel filter
walbro 255lph inline fuel pump
new jake raby cam, lifters, cam bearings, rod bearings, and rings
i sent my NOS dual circuit master cylinder off to get rebuilt since it only lasted for about 2 pumps
all thats left of the conversion is a set of 72-74 bus heater boxes so i can make j-pipes out of them and have them shortened an inch
I found a porsche 2L long block with the 3 bolt heads thats only $600 shipped. i'm seriously thinking about it, those motors are hot. just those heads go for 250 ea.
i'm still sorting out the details with the seller so i can have the motor shipped. Luckily the engine was dirt cheap. but everything is coming together. |
Do not seal a FI gas tank. It has baffles inside the the sealer will clog.
_________________
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up, you end up with a lot of scum on the top!--Edward Abbey
Gary: OK. Ima poop. |
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