Sat 1 month now no start

[Oettingerdiesel]

Hey guys,

My van started up fine very day since i had it. then its been sitting for 1 month now and it wont start,

1. Fuses all look good
2. Battery is fully charged.
3. Gave the starter a wack
4. Fuel in van
5. Can hear fuel pump prime.

Any other ideas?
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Driver Found!

[Destructo]

You say you gave the starter a whack, but you don't state whether it turns over or not. Couple questions to start with:

1. Does your starter engage?
2. If it doesn't, can you hear it at least click when you turn the key?
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1985 Wolfsburg Edition Westfalia Camper Bostig conversion

Dude, where's your van?

[dhaavers]

Here's a great link from UK vans website:
http://wiki.club8090.co.uk/index.php/Petrol_engines_Not_starting_diagnostic_flow_chart

STEP 1: MOST IMPORTANT!

Good luck...
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86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS>

[Oettingerdiesel]

Hey guys,

1.Yes the starter clicks but it wont turn over or engage.(crank)
2. Key is mine
3. Plug behind ignition is snug
4. Terminals on battery are tight.

????
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Driver Found!

[DAIZEE]

Is your van as diesel as your name implies?

That website was about petrol which I think may refer to gasoline but I'm never sure with the British vocabulary.
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'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)

[DAIZEE]

Is your van as diesel as your name implies?

That website was about petrol which I think may refer to gasoline but I'm never sure with the British vocabulary.
_________________
'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)

[snowsyncro]

A good heavy click tells you the starter solenoid is functional. So, likely culprits are poor voltage at starter, check it if you can, should be 8 or 9 volts at least to get any starter action -- more is better obviously. Sometimes sitting can make an already bad situation worse. Or, Solenoid electrical contacts are not making a good connection, maybe sluggish solenoid action is not driving the pinion out hard enough. Or, starter brushes are stuck in a bad spot. Requires some coordination with some buddies, but you can sometimes unstick it by rolling the van a bit and engaging the starter.

The fact that it worked before usually points to a poor electrical situation that has been pushed over the edge. Can you bump start (rolling start) your van?

RonC

[Oettingerdiesel]

Thanks for all the responses.

1. No its a petrol (my MK4 is a diesel)
2. Cant do rolling start its automatic.

I was thinking of maybe sticking a screwdriver between the solenoid and starter to see if it will engage ?

I checked the wires on the starter they are all snug and not corroded.
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Driver Found!

[snowsyncro]

You can try the screwdriver. If you are careful you can't really hurt anything (well maybe your elbow). If you use the screwdriver to short terminal 50 (the big cable from the alternator/battery) to terminal 30, then you are acting like the ignition switch. This should engage the solenoid (the big click is the solenoid driving out the pinion gear to engage the flywheel). But, the starter motor still might not turn, if the solenoid electrical contacts are failed.

If you use the screwdriver to short terminal 50 to the other big nut just below it (on the other side of the plastic barrier) then the starter motor should turn, but the pinion won't be engaged, so the starter motor will just spin. Be careful not to short the screwdriver to the starter body, or you will very likely hurt you elbow, or your head when you react.

If the motor spins with the second test, but not the first, and if the solenoid engages the pinion on the first test, then you can start your van by doing both shorts simultaneously. Requires a bit if coordination -- it is also a good way to weld screwdrivers. Maybe get a friend to do that one, or get a friend to short the big terminal while you engage the solenoid using the ignition switch.

RonC

[Vanagon Nut]

[Destructo]

I agree that it is probably weak voltage to the starter. However, it also could be a stuck starter. If your tests for voltage come up normal, than try taking the starter out and reinstalling. I don't believe it is this though since you said it started fine before sitting.
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1985 Wolfsburg Edition Westfalia Camper Bostig conversion

Dude, where's your van?

[Randy in Maine]

Usually an automatic will have an interlock to make sure the engine will not start when it is gear. I have no idea of whqat it looks like on a vanagon though. The Bentley should help.

Be sure that is hooked up correctly to be sure that is not the problem.

[Inlet]

Try jumping it anyways, this happened to me recently, I measured the voltage, it seemed fine. Went to jump it, it took awhile but it started... Looked at the date of the battery, 4 years old. That was the problem.

[ithinkso]

When my starter solenoid gave me troubles the starter would click when turning the ignition but it would not engage. Giving the solenoid (not the starter) a few whacks would free it up. The problem always got worse with heat because the solenoid would expand and stick. Ultimately the solution was to pull the starter out, take the solenoid apart and clean/regrease it.

A few tips if you decide to pull the starter apart:

The solenoid is held together by a few flat-head machine screws but there is also a spring inside it that pulls against these screws. I tried a bunch of different things to get these screws out but ended up stripping them and having to drill them out. I think they stuck so bad because of the spring and had I known it was there I would have tried to clamp the solenoid to compress the spring and take the pressure off of the screws. Without the pressure there I bet they would have come out easily.
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“May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds.”
- Edward Abbey

1985 Westy, Zetec powered

[Oettingerdiesel]

thanks for all your advise guys,

In about two hours im off work and im rushing over to the van to see what i can do. Ill update you guys late tonight to check what i found if i fixed it or if im still stuck! Not looking forward to this unbearable heat and damn squiters. Man sometimes i hate Florida!
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Driver Found!

[Oettingerdiesel]

Goodmorning,

Well last night i walked a path around my van 3 feet deep while trying to figure out what it could really be. Then suddenly i had the great idea of hey just try to start it again. So i jumped in the driver seat ( minus the seat) and slowly turned the key 1 position to positions. fuel pump primed sounded like twice and then i cranked it, but there was only a low spinning sound. i tried it one more time and suddenly she came to life!!!!!! But only for a minute or so. ( the air box was off and so was the airflow sensor as i was trying to mess with the starter. Reinstalled everything and thought hey everything is fine. Only to find that on the third, fourth, and fifth attempt it wasn't gonna start again.

So does the scratching whiny sound i hear sometimes come from the starter mean its in need of replacing?
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Driver Found!

[snowsyncro]

I assume the "low spinning sound" and the "scratchy whining sound" are the same thing. That is the starter motor spinning, but the starter pinion has not engaged the flywheel teeth, so the motor is just spinning free. That is good, in the sense that the starter motor is working. It sounds like the solenoid operation is sluggish -- the power is being supplied to the motor, so the solenoid is working, but it is too slow in getting the pinion to the right place before the motor begins to turn. The "scratchy" part can be the pinion rotating against the flywheel teeth, but once it is spinning it cannot engage.

So, you may need to service the starter, get rid of the old grease, clean it up and re-grease etc. But first, you really need to know what the voltage is at the starter when it is drawing current. It is not enough to know the battery is good, and charged, it is the voltage at the starter that is important.

A fully charged battery and clean battery connections are just a starting point. You need to make sure that all connections and cables in the circuit are good. This is often a symptom of bad ground connections. To check this, take a battery jumper cable and connect the starter housing directly to the negative battery terminal. Since there is nothing really on the starter housing to connect to, get somewhere close on the transmission or motor case (starter is grounded through these) and make sure the connection is good and clean (take a file to it if necessary). You want a good electrical connection. Then, even better if you can, connect the battery positive terminal directly to the top connection on the solenoid, the one with the big red cable from the alternator.

These connections will ensure you have full battery voltage and current capacity at the starter, where you need it.

Now try to start it using the key. If it works fine, the problem is electrical. If it doesn't. the problem is mechanical, and your starter need to be serviced, or replaced.

Hope this helps.

RonC

[thummmper]

ground cables, lockout [play with shifter while starting]
the clicking is low voltage -either you have low voltage or a voltage delivery problem [cables] the screwdriver crossover tells a story but is difficult to reach.
have you cleaned the ground cable contacts and put dielectric grease on them yet?
this could be another of bens mysterious ignition switch episodes

[Oettingerdiesel]

well guys everything was tight all wires had the right volatge. All fuses and relays where good. I ordered a new Starter/solenoid. Im a little upset because i have a nice BOSH setup and dont really want the crappy china stuff from advance auto parts. but im on a budget.
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Driver Found!

[Randy in Maine]

I use the local "alternator/generator/starter rebuilder "guy myself and he did me a nice job for about $50-75 about 6 years ago.

That solenoid has been known to go bad internally and no longer supply current to the fuel pump.