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Where should the fuel filter go?
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LONE369
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:57 pm    Post subject: Where should the fuel filter go? Reply with quote

I have read many times that the fuel filter should be moved out of the engine compartment. Where should it go? I am sure I can get my hands on fuel line and make this simple change. The fuel filter is not attached with a hose clamp or anything else. When I move it, should I use clamps or clips?

If anyone could post a picture of the proper relocation and installation, it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.
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JonF
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

alot of people suggest to put it under the gas tank or under the rear of the car where the hardline comes out of the tunnel.
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Habs24x
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Below the tank or at the trans.

Use the sticky http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=131225
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MrVWGuy
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know this may incite some backlash, but I've run a fuel filter in the engine bay of my 400+ horsepower hot rod for years with no problem. But here's the thing: it's attached with HOSE CLAMPS, the nipples have BARBS on them preventing it from coming off, and its made of STEEL, not plastic, and certainly not glass! I would never, NEVER put a plastic fuel filter with no barbs on the nipples, or sans hose clamps, in my engine bay, or ANYWHERE else for that matter!!! Just my humble opinion.
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neil68
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:05 pm    Post subject: fuel filter beside tranny Reply with quote

Here's my fuel filter attached where the fuel line exits the chassis, right beside the tranny. Use a durable filter, so rocks don't cause it to leak:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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arttymac
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey if you are like me you have the old gas tank. Put one under the tank and one at the transmission. I've had no problems ever since.
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mainfr4me
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 8:50 am    Post subject: Re: fuel filter beside tranny Reply with quote

neil68 wrote:
Here's my fuel filter attached where the fuel line exits the chassis, right beside the tranny. Use a durable filter, so rocks don't cause it to leak:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Excellent - I had a similar question. Now I know others have done what I was planning. Very Happy
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candymustang65
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey I love the Skull Mr. V.W. My kidd air brushed somethin similar on a deck lidd messin around one day .
Yeah 500 dollar's worth of Candy and a Double action Iwatta we got over 4 in and he hasnt touched it since ? Go figure !
" Skull's and Flame's for ever Man "
Think that's a qoute from Titus ? Not sure ?
As to your fuel filter location Im with Mr. Vw on this .
One in the pic look's like it will bounce and rubb on the C.V. joint .
No filter in the Engine compartment < has it's valid points as a fire hazard but for the most part is B.S.
I runn mine between fuel pump and carb the reason's and advantage's are many .
Only use the Tear drop plastic fuel filter sold in V.w. shop's around the world .
On stock it's best to use OEM cloth braided fuel line between Pump and carb as no clamp's are needed with Cloth braided fuel line .
Use of metal filter's and clamp's in the vicinity of Pump and Carb and distributor could possibly draw fire from ignition or coil .
Ok Advantage :
Typically stock Vw pump pressure is 3-5 PSI and typically a new fuel pump will often exceeed 5 PSI .
Now the Carb inlett valve on a stock Solex or Bocar carb cant handle any more pressure than 5 PSI or gas will leak past the carb inlett valve createing a Fatt or rich or in the extreme say 6 PSI flooded condition .
(Typically indicated by > )
Irregular or fluctuateing Idle .
Carb unresponsive to carb adjustment's .
stalling out at prolonged Idle .
Badd hesitation when floored from take off .
( Thing's that affect fuel Pump pressure > )
Badd timming !
Hot or cold weather !
Advantage of running a fuel filter between pump and carb are that you can readily see and monitor fuel pump pressure .
I like to see my filter about 1/3rd full on a hott day and 2/3rd's full on a cold day .
If the filter is over 3/4's full too completely full then you know that fuel pump pressure is over rideing the carb inlett valve and need's to be reduced .
Adding a gasket under the fuel pump will reduce fuel pump pressure .
2 gaskets if need be ?
Now posistioning the fuel filter away from coil and ignition so that it is suspended where it cant bounce and rubb a hole in it is tricky at best and if you choose this option ( Cause you think it's more important that your car runn's right ) than worrying about fire hazards ?
You should know that keepin fuel line and filter in good condition changed out yearly is a must .
In 35 year's Ive never had a fire doing it this way but then I dont runn chokin and puke - in , back fire- ing out my Carb cause Im all out of tune due to the fact Im unaware that my tune up problem is due to excessive fuel pump pressure over rideing the carb inlett valve . Twisted Evil
Better yett your motor will last longer if it's not being washed down with gas continuously ! Twisted Evil
Sean
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lupin..the..3rd
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have an electric fuel pump, the filter goes *before* the pump, directly underneath the gas tank.

If you have a mechanical fuel pump, the filter goes *before* the pump, near the transmission.

Yes, you should use hose clamps. Use bolt-drive clamps, not the crappy worm-drive clamps that you get from the hardware store.
http://www.busdepot.com/details.jsp?partnumber=311133515

Also use metric fuel hose. Do not use generic 1/4" fuel hose from the auto parts store, it does not fit properly.
http://www.oeveedub.com/vw/bug-intake-hoses/N-020-355-1.html
http://www.oeveedub.com/vw/bug-intake-hoses/N-020-281-1.html
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79SuperVert
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like this kind of hose clamp. Easy to put on and off and looks a little more "vintage" than the modern kind. Not as nice as the ones in the link above for Bus Depot, though, and they still have the sharp edges instead of the rolled edges.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrVWGuy wrote:
I know this may incite some backlash, but I've run a fuel filter in the engine bay of my 400+ horsepower hot rod for years with no problem. But here's the thing: it's attached with HOSE CLAMPS, the nipples have BARBS on them preventing it from coming off, and its made of STEEL, not plastic, and certainly not glass! I would never, NEVER put a plastic fuel filter with no barbs on the nipples, or sans hose clamps, in my engine bay, or ANYWHERE else for that matter!!! Just my humble opinion.


Yes but the problem with VW's is the fitting going into the side of the carb....the added weight of the fuel filter and clamps vibrates the brass insert out of the pot metal of the carb...the hose pops out of the side of the carb, then engine continues to run as normal from the fuel already in the float bow...fuel then sprays under pressure all over the engine bay as the fuel pump continues to merrily pump away oblivious to what is happening...all the while, the fuel filter remains intact and is in fact filtering the spraying fuel.

It takes seconds for all of this to ignite in a fireball...but it takes more time to burn through something critical enough to stop the engine...thus, the fuel keeps being filtered, sprayed and pumped and you get a nice raging fire going.
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JasonBaker
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:18 pm    Post subject: Re: fuel filter beside tranny Reply with quote

Neil68 has the money shot. Cool

Mine is in the same place.
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dreadpiraterobert
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I took my car to my mechanic who's been driving and working on air cooled engines for years, and he put a filter in my engine bay. In fact, I doubt that anyone who's not on this forum would think twice about putting a filter in the engine bay.

I would guess that the problem is not so much the filter as the fact that people who own Volkswagens cut corners and don't replace their fuel filters or lines regularly. I for one don't want to have to reach way under the car to check or change the fuel filter, so in the engine bay it stays for now.
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neil68
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:15 pm    Post subject: filter location Reply with quote

Another problem is that the fuel pump entry and exit pipes will "fall out" due to engine vibration. I had an engine fire on a '74 Beetle years ago, due to this scenario. Also, caught a similar occurance on time in my '69 Westy; pulled over beside the highway, opened the hatch and saw the fuel line with pipe still attached hanging loose...luckily no fire that time...just fuel smell and gasoline everywhere!! Mopped up the fuel on the tin, let it air out, reinstalled the tube and tied it with wire, until getting back home.

Every time you add a filter, you are adding another component that "vibrates" and after a while the fuel line and entry/exit tubes will work loose.

It's like anything else, you "might" get away with it, but why take the chance, when you've been informed?
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Drag0nHart
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dreadpiraterobert wrote:
I took my car to my mechanic who's been driving and working on air cooled engines for years, and he put a filter in my engine bay. In fact, I doubt that anyone who's not on this forum would think twice about putting a filter in the engine bay.

I would guess that the problem is not so much the filter as the fact that people who own Volkswagens cut corners and don't replace their fuel filters or lines regularly. I for one don't want to have to reach way under the car to check or change the fuel filter, so in the engine bay it stays for now.


as I and others have mentioned...it is not necessarily the fuel filter, the fuel line or the installation that is the problem.

This is a unique and known problem with these cars/vans.

I'll quote myself since you may have missed it...

Drag0nHart wrote:
Yes but the problem with VW's is the fitting going into the side of the carb....the added weight of the fuel filter and clamps vibrates the brass insert out of the pot metal of the carb...the hose pops out of the side of the carb, then engine continues to run as normal from the fuel already in the float bow...fuel then sprays under pressure all over the engine bay as the fuel pump continues to merrily pump away oblivious to what is happening...all the while, the fuel filter remains intact and is in fact filtering the spraying fuel.

It takes seconds for all of this to ignite in a fireball...but it takes more time to burn through something critical enough to stop the engine...thus, the fuel keeps being filtered, sprayed and pumped and you get a nice raging fire going.


Do as you will, but you have been warned.
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julrich366
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drag0nHart wrote:
Yes but the problem with VW's is the fitting going into the side of the carb....the added weight of the fuel filter and clamps vibrates the brass insert out of the pot metal of the carb...the hose pops out of the side of the carb, then engine continues to run as normal from the fuel already in the float bow...fuel then sprays under pressure all over the engine bay as the fuel pump continues to merrily pump away oblivious to what is happening...all the while, the fuel filter remains intact and is in fact filtering the spraying fuel.



Don't have Glenn's picture since I'm on work computer...but this is exactly why the carb inlet/hose should be safety-wired.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

julrich366 wrote:
Don't have Glenn's picture since I'm on work computer...but this is exactly why the carb inlet/hose should be safety-wired.

It's in the Beetles and Fire topic.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

candymustang65 wrote:
as no clamp's are needed with Cloth braided fuel line .


if clamps are not needed on the OEM type cloth braided fuel line, why did vw use band clamps at all the junctions when they built the cars? cloth braided not needing clamps is another one of those widely parroted urban legends...


dreadpiraterobert wrote:
I took my car to my mechanic who's been driving and working on air cooled engines for years, and he put a filter in my engine bay. In fact, I doubt that anyone who's not on this forum would think twice about putting a filter in the engine bay.


Well, Bob, vw "mechanics" for years have been known to throw away necessary parts(like cooling tin and thermostat/control vanes) while adding things to make things "better"(like unnecessary filters after the pump, and things like "hard start" relays, etc)...doesn't mean it's correct, or even smart....(you are in VA, do you have the thermostat on your car, or will you freeze your ass off in a couple months? if the latter, ask your mechanic to put a thermostat on it, see what he says... Wink ) the problem with additional filters, no matter where they are installed, is most folks don't properly install them... they pop them in the fuel line and call it good... it's not, a filter needs to be properly mounted or secured, or bad things *can* happen... doesn't mean they will, many of us(me included) "ran for years" with no problems.... the worst part of gambling, is sometimes your luck runs out... then it's too late to stop it...
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to pour "gas on the fire", so to speak, I like the Fram HPG1 on my daily driven '71 Super and on my '74 Thing.
They are mounted under the fuel tank like this:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Ignore the lower hose; it's for the gas heater fuel pump.

Inside, under the passenger foot rest, it looks like this:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I don't have any photos of the filter mounted on the Thing, but this sketch shows that it is mounted to the front axle beam with 2 stainless steel American style muffler clamps:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Good luck, Mondshine
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mondshine wrote:
Just to pour "gas on the fire", so to speak, I like the Fram HPG1 on my daily driven '71 Super and on my '74 Thing.
They are mounted under the fuel tank like this:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Ignore the lower hose; it's for the gas heater fuel pump.

Inside, under the passenger foot rest, it looks like this:


I don't have any photos of the filter mounted on the Thing, but this sketch shows that it is mounted to the front axle beam with 2 stainless steel American style muffler clamps:


Good luck, Mondshine
adds something to "to-do list"
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