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"NEW" Burley behind-bumper hitch
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j_dirge
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dymaxion2004 wrote:
Around here two points of attachment for safety chains are required.

Thanks for bringing that up.

I began looking into this again after ignoring the issue for many yrs.

When I purchased my trailer (at the time, 5 yrs old.. some 8 yrs ago), it had been built in the state of CA by a reputable builder. Designed to carry up to 3000lbs of sailboat with fixed keel.

I was surprised to see that the builder did not add chain attachment points to the trailer itself (typically welded loops either side of the tongue extention)

I asked the previous owner who trailered it all over CA and parts of Oregon..
"Why no chains?"
He said (paraphrased) "I never felt I needed em".
however, the trailer's surge brake actuator has a "disconnect" brake trip.. which almost needs to the trailer to break free in order to engage the safety braking.
Maybe that factored in.


Well.. I had always used chains, and was aware of the intent. They should be crossed over and of material strong enough to hold the tongue of the trailer off the ground should the hitch fail. They should also be strong enough to keep the trailer attached to the vehicle in the event of hitch failure.

So I went searching for more info thru CA DMV.. and the call line contradicted what is on thier site. And the operator obviously did not know much about trailering.
But ON the DMV site, there is no mention of "2 attachment points required".. Only that the chains must be installed in such a fashion that the tongue does not hit the ground should the hitch break or come apart.

No doubt 2 points helps acheive that cross over install setup.


In honesty, I have driven with a subpar chain setup for many yrs with that trailer (but have not gone HWY more than a mile or two).. counting on that disconnect brake trip to do the job.

And I have not seen a trailer hitch break, nor have I heard of a hitch coming "un-done" in my sailing circle.

So I am wondering if this is a remnant law of when we all drove much less safe vehicles..

No doubt about it, though... 2 chains crossed and short enough to keep tonuge off ground, but loose enough to allow articulation is THE WAY TO GO. I would not recommend anything other.


But that said.. When I see what passes for safety chain installations, I don't think even a modest majority are installed per the intent of the chains. And I'd guess most.. say 75% would fail the intended purpose if put to task.


Had a sheriff friend working a boat patrol (on the water cops) for many yrs.
He said that CHP and thier local sheriff's do not enforce the chain thing.. Its like seatbelts. They won't pull you over for it.. But they may say something if you are already driving erratically, or too fast.. swerving etc.


I've got an email into Burley about it.. and I don't see why he could not add a second point. There is room to do it.
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-89 GL Westy, still humming along under the power of a used "WBXer of mystery"
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"

"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5

danfromsyr wrote:
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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insyncro
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OMG, are you serious....another reason to not live in Cali.

First no Bostig, now this.

Just kidding left coasters Very Happy
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j_dirge
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

insyncro wrote:
OMG, are you serious....another reason to not live in Cali.

It REALLY sucks here.

I can not recommend that ANYone move here.. unless they are female.. and hot.
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-89 GL Westy, still humming along under the power of a used "WBXer of mystery"
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"

"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5

danfromsyr wrote:
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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singler3360
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unfortunately, it happened here last year. A trailer came unhitched and crossed into oncoming traffic, resulting in a fatality. Chains would have prevented this most likely.
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2PLY
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

j_dirge wrote:
outwesty wrote:
Burly did a great thing making these. Any idea if the gowesty swing away tire carrier would work with it?

http://www.gowesty.com/ec_view_details.php?id=4251&category_id=4141&category_parent_id=

I don't see why not.

I would caution, though.. On most hitch mount accessories, there is bound to be some wiggle-waggle due to slop between receiver female and male pieces.

..............and maybe a 1/2" to 1" long receiver so that you have plenty of room to use an anti-wiggle pin.



On my custom built 2" receiver hitch, Dennis Haynes drilled and tapped two "Pinch" bolts into the receiver collar, one on the top and one on the side as an anti-wiggle device and it works VERY well.

I don't see why you couldn't add that to the Burley hitch yourself or request it.

Curt Long
Maple Valley, WA
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j_dirge
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good stuff here!

Keep the ideas and comments coming.


I've been in touch with Burley and we have been discussing things. He's trying to balance the recessed design and best departure angle with the functionality of the hitch.

It looks like he has ideas for dual chain points... and this particular idea of threaded anti-wiggle set bolts is intriguing... Might need some added stock to provide adequate thread bite, so the set bolt does not strip out in the mild steel stock.

There is access to reach set bolts if they were placed top or bottom.. or either side.


And of course all this has to keep in balance with a reasonable price.


cheers,
j
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-89 GL Westy, still humming along under the power of a used "WBXer of mystery"
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"

"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5

danfromsyr wrote:
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are not easy to see in this picture, but I welded two "U" shaped chain brackets on the bottom of the receiver on both sides. They are made from 3/8ths round stock.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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j_dirge
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks rsxsr!


Here's a shot of the Masterlock brand barrel lock in place. (as promised earleir in the thread)

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


It rests against the f/g bumper.. pretty snug in there. But it slips in and out with no problem.
There is a fair amount of flex in the bumper so its not a deal breaker by any means..
Works for me.. (recognizing others may not be happy with any contact there at all).
_________________
-89 GL Westy, still humming along under the power of a used "WBXer of mystery"
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"

"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5

danfromsyr wrote:
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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Volksaholic
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's sweet. My van came with a fixed tongue style behind the bumper hitch. It's solid so it's a little hard to justify replacing it, but I'd love a receiver like this. Then I could easily swap draw bars between the Vanagon and Outback for those rare occasions that I need a 2" ball.

IMO all hitches should have the loops for safety chains. It just doesn't add that much to the complexity or fabrication time but making safety chains easy to clip in may be the difference between someone using them and not. For me, I wouldn't tow without them... I'd find somewhere solid to hook them in.

I would also like to keep my stock tie down loops. I haven't pulled my bumper or really looked at how it's all attached, but I've got the hitch and the loops are unobstructed.

Paul
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pushkick
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 11:28 am    Post subject: how much does that new bumper weigh Reply with quote

i was wondering how much weight that new bumper added to the van
and would i have to change my shocks and springs if i started towing?
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j_dirge
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 12:13 pm    Post subject: Re: how much does that new bumper weigh Reply with quote

pushkick wrote:
i was wondering how much weight that new bumper added to the van
and would i have to change my shocks and springs if i started towing?

Burley lists shipping weight at 35lbs.
Its about the same as the GW hitch I had, prior.

By itself, the hitch does not tax the suspension at all, (IMHO).

However, when you start loading up the gear... the biker racks, tray racks, etc... or when towing, you'll have tongue weight as well as forces pulling and pushing as well as side to side...
There will be some added stresses on the rear suspension (some to the front, too). No doubt about it.

1. Your tires are probably the first place to check. Are they rated properly and inflated properly? I'd be really leary of anything less than XL rated. Preferred C or better yet, D-rated.
2. Second would be shocks.. If they are original (don't laugh.. mine were)or showing signs of leaking and poor rebound.. Replace.
3. Springs are surprisingly easy to upgrade... and not that expensive.

Most of this has been discussed at great length on this forum... and there are many opinions. I think the discussions have been pretty level, overall.


Over the last 5-6 yrs, I've upgraded my springs, gone to bigger brakes upfront. And am still using the Monroe coilover shocks in the rear for a bit extra support.
That was not all done for the sole purpose of imporved towing, however.. I am just a tortured soul who has chosen to pour money into this particular pit for awhile.

My first upgrade was the Monroes.. and at $140, they are very good bang-for-buck. A good place to start if your tires check out.
The Gabrial air-adjusts may be an even better option.. but I do not have first hand experience with them.. yet.
There's a thread.... <search>


I'd recommend you install the hitch if you want to go down this road. Try it out. If the suspension is not up the task, it will be painfully obvious.

I do not believe all vans have to have mega-buck upgrades to tow or carry modest weights... say 100-150lbs on racks.. or 100lbs tongue wieght from a trailer. Much higher? Well.....

Now.. if your looking to tow what I do.. or if you want a dirtbike on a tray rack and want to drive with it off-road Laughing .. then start budgeting.
And watch your wallet!
Its a slippery slope.. and it never ends. Shocked
_________________
-89 GL Westy, still humming along under the power of a used "WBXer of mystery"
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"

"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5

danfromsyr wrote:
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..


Last edited by j_dirge on Fri Nov 12, 2010 12:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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j_dirge
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Volksaholic wrote:
I would also like to keep my stock tie down loops. I haven't pulled my bumper or really looked at how it's all attached, but I've got the hitch and the loops are unobstructed.

Paul

The tie down loops are tow loops.. and unfortunately, as it is, they have to come off with this hitch setup.

The mounts for the Burley hitch replace those OE tow loop mounts which are part of the OE bumper assembly.


I guess, if you have to have them, it is possible to cut them off and weld them onto the new hitch mounts?
Email Burley and ask him what he thinks.

Or just use one of these when you need it:
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200255774_200255774
_________________
-89 GL Westy, still humming along under the power of a used "WBXer of mystery"
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"

"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5

danfromsyr wrote:
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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Volksaholic
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always assumed they were shipping tie downs... but regardless I find them handy. I wonder how my hitch bolts on that the loops are still there too. I swear my memory is shot. I looked at that stuff while I was lying under the van drilling for the rear engine carrier when installing the Subie engine and I can't even visualize it now. In any case... I'm sure I could either install everything the way it is now or weld some loops on the hitch. I especially like them for tying long stuff on the roof like my sea kayak, sailboat masts, or occasionally the Laser sailboat if I can't put it on a trailer.

WRT towing with a Vanagon (or any passenger vehicle); I don't believe you have to go to any extremes with the tires or suspension if you're keeping it within the manufacturer's specs. I can't recall what the Vanagon is rated to tow, but I generally keep things in the Class 1 range (which if I recall correctly is about 2000lbs max trailer weight, 200 lbs max tongue weight). Any 1-1/4" draw bar and 1-7/8" ball I've used meets or exceeds these ratings, although the bolt-on receiver I put on a Toyota Camry was only rated at about 1100 lbs. As with most things... don't exceed manufacturer's specs and don't exceed the weakest link in the chain and life should be good. With good tires, shocks, springs, and brakes and a trans that is up to snuff I've never had any concerns by staying with the vehicle manufacturer's recommendations... I suspect they keep them reasonably conservative. Oh... and make sure you've got your common-sense turned on: pay attention to weather, traffic, cornering, make sure the trailer lights work, and that the trailer is properly maintained and loaded.

Paul
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j_dirge
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

UPDATE:

New fitment.
Set up to align.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



Not happy with how the bumper sat, I ovaled out the lower bolt holes in the f/g bumper.
The original hole is to the lower edge of oval in photo.. about 5/16" round.. ovaled at an angle to shift the bumper slightly to center over the new hitch and sit evenly around the van's corners.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This bought me another 1/4"+/- clearance from pin hole edge to bumper face. It now measures 3/4" from pin hole center to bumper face.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Will be getting an anti-rattle pin in the mail soon.. It should fit with a little room to spare now.

All cleaned up!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This hitch took a little work to get just right. In the end? I am very pleased.
Money well spent!
_________________
-89 GL Westy, still humming along under the power of a used "WBXer of mystery"
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"

"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5

danfromsyr wrote:
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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0to60in6min
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While searching the net for a hitch, I came across this post from my friend Jim here.. I ordered one from Burley and got help from Jim to set it up. On mine the hole on the receiver is a bit too close to the bumper, I need to adjust the bumper a bit to have more clearance. I put on a basket carrier but it tilt a bit downward because the male receiver doesn't go all the way in. I need to drill another hole. Burley is very nice gentleman to do business with... I highly recommend his hitch to anyone who want a serious one.

here are some pictures from my trip to DV at Thanksgiving, right after the hitch and basket carrier set up...

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just finished installing a Burley High Clearance trailer hitch on my van with metal / steel bumpers. Here's the post:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458405
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Last edited by joet on Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:23 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In a post above there's a Harbor freight hook shown for use in a hitch receiver as a recovery point. Made me shiver. So I tracked down a link to something seriously stout which is what I use from Warn. You can find them cheaper than this Warn link, but these are seriously strong and a closed loop so no way for the strap to fall off during the chaos of a typical recovery. The enormous forces generated deserve a quality item in your hitch receiver, where a cheap one can kill if it fails.

The Warn Industries version:

http://www.warn.com/truck/accessories/shackle.shtml
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BillWYellowstone
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 6:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My Burley arrived on Monday afternoon at work, left work at 5PM, got home, (1 mile commute), and figured I would get the bumper removed. That went very easy. Figured I was probably done for the night, but decided to see about removing the oldg bumper mounts. Borrowed friends breaker bar, and couple minutes later they were off. Easy so far. I was actually amazed at how easy they came apart. Still early, so figured I would try a test fit. Slid right in, there was a small amount of play, but nothing requiring sending back for shims. Bolts threaded right in, nice and slid. Well, nice amount of work, but figured I would wait on the bumber install (steel), hmm, still pretty early. Taped the template on after centering. Still early, so got the saw out. Made the cut, needed just a little more clearance on the top. One more cut and perfect. Good amount f work done for the day, hmmm, still early. OK, really just another couple tasks, so drilled the holes for the bumper. The attachment strap was outside the bumber holes by about 1/8 inch, so required drilling a new holes in bumper. Got it done, got it bolted up. Snapped the rubber trim on net. Still early!

Put away tools, slid the carrier in and stoood and jumped at end! SOLID

Cleaned up looked at clock, 7:30PM. 2.5 hours frm leaving work, and having to walk to friends to get breaker bar. plus clean up.

Since install, I have emailed with Burley and he was interested as to how much more he needed to add to the attachment strap. He wants to get it as perfect as possible.

My use is a carrier rack, get some things ut of the van for travel when we camp. Not the amount of weight the rack is rated for, (500 lbs), maybe 100 lbs max.

My old hitch is now available, would work in some applications if anyone is interested.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just an update on the Burley Bumper.

Installed my hitch today. Used the template from Burley, but needed several adjustments to get the cutout correct. This is what I ended up with . . . may help others get dialed in:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I measured the center piece of the rear bumper to find absolute center.

From bottom edge of bumper to top of cut 4 7/8"
Width of cut 2 3/4"

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Now that I have it fitted, I have to clean and paint it. (Done)

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Love the way the extended mounting bars use exisiting holes. Great fit.
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Last edited by LemonCove on Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I copied Burley's idea and welded up my own hitch because I needed a couple tweaks in the design due to my SVX. I also repaired a fibreglass bumper I bought and noticed that there is a LOT of slack/adjustment room in the attachment points where the fibreglass bumper is fastened to the factory VW brackets. Every installation of Burley's excellent hitch will involve some fiddling with the notching in the fibreglass. His template has to be considered a guide. Measure five times, cut four . . . slowly.
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