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indytriple Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2009 Posts: 710 Location: Brownsburg, Indiana
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Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:50 am Post subject: Time for Front Suspension Work, Need Advice |
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Good morning, Samba folks. I'd like some input and advice on my upcoming front suspension project, please. It's on my '91 pass van with just under 200,000 miles on it. I don't know the age or origin of the current suspension parts. I have already done substantial searching and reading here. The questions below are the result of that research.
I have a distinct "clunk" in my right/front suspension. After having my VW mechanic look at it he says that I need an upper ball joint, inner tie rod end and strut rod bushings.
Questions:
1) Besides the three things that he says I need to replace, should I replace any other suspension parts while we're in there?
2) Should I do the same things on the left/front simultaneously, as I'm assuming that it is in slightly better, but similar condition as the right?
3) My front shocks are really old and really bouncy. I think that I can replace the shocks myself with little difficulty. Am I stupid to do it myself to save a little money, or should I just take the mechanic the shocks and have him install them while he's doing all of this other stuff to the front suspension?
4) Am I in danger of some type of catastrophic failure if I drive the van in the meantime with the "clunk"? On a scale of one to ten, I'd say the clunk is a 5. I realize that this is hard to gauge without seeing the van. Sorry. I promise not to hold anyone accountable for their opinion.
5) Should I let my mechanic source the parts, or should I source them myself? If so, where is the best place to source these parts?
Sorry for all of the detailed questions. I've been formulating this post for a few months. I will very much appreciate any thoughtful responses. Thanks in advance. _________________ "See The Glass As Already Broken."
87 Vanagon Westy Auto Bostig
www.bluegrassbicyclecompany.com |
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RCB Samba Member
Joined: September 05, 2005 Posts: 4143 Location: San Francisco-Bay Area
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Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:14 am Post subject: |
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Opinions are like chins...everyone has one, so heres my take on the matter. Purchase the absolute best quality parts you can afford and take them to your trusted mechanic for installation.
If you need part numbers or the names of the parts, check out vagcat.com...This site will give you a complete diagram of your front end and the part numbers for each part.
Once you have a part number, the fun begins. Note the country of origin B4 ordering the part. |
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RHawk Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2006 Posts: 32 Location: Goshen, Indiana
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Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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happy to see my old van getting so much love! |
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tencentlife Samba Member
Joined: May 02, 2006 Posts: 10078 Location: Abiquiu, NM, USA
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Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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Purchase the absolute best quality parts you can afford and take them to your trusted mechanic for installation. |
If he's your trusted mechanic, discuss your parts preferences and then trust him to get the parts. Let the guy make his markup, without that he doesn't stay in business and there goes your trusted mechanic. _________________ Shop for unique Vanagon accessories at the Vanistan shop:
https://intrepidoverland.com/vanistan/
Please don't PM here, I will not reply.
Experience is kryptonite to doctrine. |
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WSideWitneSS Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2010 Posts: 163 Location: Seattle
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Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 9:56 pm Post subject: |
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I broke a sway drop link a few months and in replacing that I started looking around and all the bushings were really worn out. I replaced pretty much everything except lower ball joints and put in new shocks. I think it's my favorite upgrade. It drives amazing now.
If you trust the guy, I would ask him to put it on the lift and look under there with him. You can decide together what to replace and what to leave. _________________ '87 Syncro Westy
'91 BMW 325iX - SOLD!
'02 Subaru WRX Wagon |
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Tom Powell Samba Member
Joined: December 01, 2005 Posts: 4855 Location: Kaneohe
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Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 11:21 pm Post subject: |
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With 200,000 miles you can expect everything on both sides to be worn and need, or about to need replacing. Do all of it at one time and it will cost you more for parts, but you won't be replacing other worn parts in a few months. In the end you'll be you'll be spending less money for labor, time on the rack, wheel alignment, tires, ... If you fix only the one clunk now, you'll be hearing other clunks in the future and you'll be back on the rack again. At the minimum replace the upper ball joints on both sides and the other parts as needed at this time. A lot of discussion on shocks on TheSamba. Perhaps you should research those for recommendations. Driving in the present condition with the clunk may not be dangerous, but might result in abnormal tire wear. You might consider rotating the tires front to rear during the repairs. This is also a good time for a front brake inspection for pad and rotor wear and a check of wheel bearing play. If your mechanic is good he will have considered all of the above and make his recommendations. Good and trustworthy VW mechanics and parts are becoming more difficult to find.
Aloha
tp |
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indytriple Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2009 Posts: 710 Location: Brownsburg, Indiana
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Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:46 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the great advice so far. It's exactly what I was looking for. I appreciate all of the thoughtful responses.
RCB wrote: |
If you need part numbers or the names of the parts, check out vagcat.com...This site will give you a complete diagram of your front end and the part numbers for each part. |
RCB, thanks for the vagcat.com recommendation. I had never seen it before. That's a great resource.
RCB wrote: |
Purchase the absolute best quality parts you can afford and take them to your trusted mechanic for installation. |
tencentlife wrote: |
If he's your trusted mechanic, discuss your parts preferences and then trust him to get the parts. Let the guy make his markup, without that he doesn't stay in business and there goes your trusted mechanic. |
Good advice, gentlemen. I believe STRONGLY in taking good care of my VW mechanic. I only take him parts when he doesn't wish to source them himself or they're specialty parts he can't get. I never pick up the van without taking him two six packs of good beer. As a general manager of an independent bicycle shop, I treat my mechanic the way that I want to be treated. That golden rule thing is really handy, ain't it?
Tom Powell wrote: |
A lot of discussion on shocks on TheSamba. Perhaps you should research those for recommendations. |
I've been researching shocks for several months, and I've settled on the Bilsteins.
Tom Powell wrote: |
This is also a good time for a front brake inspection for pad and rotor wear and a check of wheel bearing play. |
I just finished putting all fresh pads on and bleeding all the brakes. I checked the bearings during the process and they feel good. The rotors are questionable, so they'll probably get replaced. Check! Thanks for all of the other great advice, Tom.
WSideWitneSS wrote: |
If you trust the guy, I would ask him to put it on the lift and look under there with him. You can decide together what to replace and what to leave. |
That's a good idea. So...point of order...Is it appropriate etiquette to ask to go in back and under the lift? How do most mechanics react to this request?
RHawk wrote: |
happy to see my old van getting so much love! |
Dude, you'd be proud. So far fuel lines and filter, 20W50 and German filter, coolant distributor tower, brake light wiring, brake pads front, brake shoes rear, wheel cylinders, bled brakes/new fluid, Hankook tire, left rear window and vent, CD player/radio, Jetta interior lights, Mann air filter, hole in driver's step pad fixed/painted to match, engine ground strap and cleaned grounds, battery, reattached accelerator pedal and wiper blades.
It even saved my Westy with a swapped ECU, and it's been my daily driver 10 miles each way to work since I got it a few months ago. It just made its second trip 2 hours south to Brown County in hilly Southern Indiana. Since everyone loves pictures, here it is last weekend at our favorite remote cabin destination. We even did a *little* off-roading.
_________________ "See The Glass As Already Broken."
87 Vanagon Westy Auto Bostig
www.bluegrassbicyclecompany.com |
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Tom Powell Samba Member
Joined: December 01, 2005 Posts: 4855 Location: Kaneohe
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Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:58 am Post subject: |
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indytriple wrote: |
So...point of order...Is it appropriate etiquette to ask to go in back and under the lift? How do most mechanics react to this request?
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Depends on the shop and the mechanic. For many shops, they will not let you in the shop or under the car because of insurance and liability. At an owner/operator shop they tend to be less restrictive. If you find more work/profit for them you may be welcomed and encouraged. Be polite and ask and don't bang your head or slip on the floor. As an owner I think it is appropriate and, if respect and etiquette are used, will be allowed
Aloha
tp |
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j_dirge Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2007 Posts: 4641 Location: Twain Harte, CA
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Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 10:00 am Post subject: Re: Time for Front Suspension Work, Need Advice |
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indytriple wrote: |
Should I replace any other suspension parts while we're in there? |
Depends how deep you want to go.
I, like several others on this forum, replaced ALL the rubber bushings up front.
The improvement in handling was an eye-opener.
To put it another way, I never realized just how poorly the van was handling until I rebuilt the front end. Or.. How much better the Vanagon handles than older generation buses.
Part of that, I am sure, was just new rubber.. part of it was bolting it all up "fresh".. then getting aligned by a pro Vanagon guy.
In many ways the differences are subtle. But the steering is much more responsive. There are no jiggles or bounces or thunks.. And when a thunk does start, its very easy to sort and diagnose.
Van Cafe has a complete bushing kit.
I did not purchase the kit myself.. but ended up buying it all over a period of 6 months, anyway. Now I've added a couple upgrades.. and am going to Loogy's urethane steerig rack bushings.
(Your shop will need a large press to do that lower ball joint properly.. the upper was easy). _________________ -89 GL Westy, SVX.. finally.
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"
"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5
danfromsyr wrote: |
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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