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RalphWiggam Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2018 Posts: 905 Location: SouthEast
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Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:46 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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When my Rockford boots decide to split open I will most likely just buy some of the Empi axles. I mean $100 for something that is positively reviewed on a few different forums is worth it to not spend a whole day or 2 cleaning and rebooting my original axles. |
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udidwht Samba Member
Joined: March 06, 2005 Posts: 3777 Location: Seattle, WA./ HB, Ca./ Shizuoka, Japan
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Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2020 6:57 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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RalphWiggam wrote: |
When my Rockford boots decide to split open I will most likely just buy some of the Empi axles. I mean $100 for something that is positively reviewed on a few different forums is worth it to not spend a whole day or 2 cleaning and rebooting my original axles. |
2 years on my Rockford boots and they look great still. _________________ 1972 Westy Hardtop/Type-4 2056cc
96mm Biral AA P/C's~7.8:1CR
Headflow Masters New AMC 42x36mm heads w/Porsche swivel adjusters
71mm Stroke
73 Web Cam w/Web solids
Dual 40mm IDF Webers - LM-2 - 47.5 idles/125 mains/190 air corr./F11 tubes/28mm Vents - Float height 10.45mm/Drop 32mm
Bosch SVDA w/Pertronix module (7.5 initial 28 total @ 3400rpm)
Bosch W8CC plugs
Pertronix Flamethrower 40K coil
S&S 4-1 w/Walker QP 17862
3 rib 002 Trans
185R14 Hankook tires |
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type36 Samba Member
Joined: July 21, 2015 Posts: 22 Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:44 am Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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VW made a white opaque plastic boot for the front outer of the T25 16" syncro to solve the boot tearing issue, no idea what they were made of but it looked like a nylon from memory, have fitted these to a syncro in the far distant past, they were expensive and I have never seen one since. but would agree that a 'plastic boot would be ideal, who's going to make some? |
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cdennisg Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004 Posts: 20217 Location: Sandpoint, ID
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Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 9:30 am Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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type36 wrote: |
VW made a white opaque plastic boot for the front outer of the T25 16" syncro to solve the boot tearing issue, no idea what they were made of but it looked like a nylon from memory, have fitted these to a syncro in the far distant past, they were expensive and I have never seen one since. but would agree that a 'plastic boot would be ideal, who's going to make some? |
I would love to see a photo of that. _________________ nothing |
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vwwestyman Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004 Posts: 5680 Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
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tristanblue Samba Member
Joined: May 30, 2019 Posts: 291
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 10:49 am Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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I am in need of CV joint boots for my 70 bus. Came to search for what is the best current ones available and seems I have walked into a quagmire of a thread that spands years. Can someone give me a short, concise list or run down of what is currently available and good or bad details of each?
I see there are Rockford, Empi, and a certain stock VW part that might possibly work and perhaps a grease recommendation as well?
BTW my bus is a 1970, thank you.
T |
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vwwestyman Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004 Posts: 5680 Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
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tristanblue Samba Member
Joined: May 30, 2019 Posts: 291
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:22 am Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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vwwestyman wrote: |
I can say for certain that the stock VW part that you can get from a dealer right now, does fit. Beyond that it's hard to know, but I know it fits because it's on my Bus right now. |
So the Dealer sells stock CV boots for a 70 bus?! or is this the Golf, Jetta Tiguan inner boot someone mentioned?
Would still like a list and possible critique of what is available as well if anyone has the info. |
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vwwestyman Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004 Posts: 5680 Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:53 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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tristanblue wrote: |
vwwestyman wrote: |
I can say for certain that the stock VW part that you can get from a dealer right now, does fit. Beyond that it's hard to know, but I know it fits because it's on my Bus right now. |
So the Dealer sells stock CV boots for a 70 bus?! or is this the Golf, Jetta Tiguan inner boot someone mentioned?
Would still like a list and possible critique of what is available as well if anyone has the info. |
I'm referring to the Tiguan, etc part that is discussed in the past two or three pages of this thread.
I guess there are no guarantees in life at all, but it does make sense to me that buying an actual OEM part from a dealer is going to be the best bet for getting a part that will actually last. Ray's comments on this matter make a lot of sense to me, anyway.
From that Vanagon thread, it seems that maybe the quality of materials has possibly changed with the Rockford boots. Or at least maybe they got a bad batch. _________________ Dave Cook
President, Wild Westerner Club
1978 Champagne Edition Westy, repowered to '97 Jetta TDI
1973 Wild Westerner
My Thing |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21462 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:18 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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vwwestyman wrote: |
tristanblue wrote: |
vwwestyman wrote: |
I can say for certain that the stock VW part that you can get from a dealer right now, does fit. Beyond that it's hard to know, but I know it fits because it's on my Bus right now. |
So the Dealer sells stock CV boots for a 70 bus?! or is this the Golf, Jetta Tiguan inner boot someone mentioned?
Would still like a list and possible critique of what is available as well if anyone has the info. |
I'm referring to the Tiguan, etc part that is discussed in the past two or three pages of this thread.
I guess there are no guarantees in life at all, but it does make sense to me that buying an actual OEM part from a dealer is going to be the best bet for getting a part that will actually last. Ray's comments on this matter make a lot of sense to me, anyway.
From that Vanagon thread, it seems that maybe the quality of materials has possibly changed with the Rockford boots. Or at least maybe they got a bad batch. |
Another possible.....HIGHLY possible issue that is the wild card in whether a known good quality boot might fail for some and not for others......is that few people in these discussions are posting WHAT GREASE they are using.
I keep saying it.....with modern rubber compounds......grease selection is important. Ray |
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ivwshane Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2011 Posts: 1920 Location: Sacramento ca
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:40 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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Well you are the expert here about that so how about giving us some recommendations on grease that's easily obtainable (IE from your local auto parts store)?
raygreenwood wrote: |
vwwestyman wrote: |
tristanblue wrote: |
vwwestyman wrote: |
I can say for certain that the stock VW part that you can get from a dealer right now, does fit. Beyond that it's hard to know, but I know it fits because it's on my Bus right now. |
So the Dealer sells stock CV boots for a 70 bus?! or is this the Golf, Jetta Tiguan inner boot someone mentioned?
Would still like a list and possible critique of what is available as well if anyone has the info. |
I'm referring to the Tiguan, etc part that is discussed in the past two or three pages of this thread.
I guess there are no guarantees in life at all, but it does make sense to me that buying an actual OEM part from a dealer is going to be the best bet for getting a part that will actually last. Ray's comments on this matter make a lot of sense to me, anyway.
From that Vanagon thread, it seems that maybe the quality of materials has possibly changed with the Rockford boots. Or at least maybe they got a bad batch. |
Another possible.....HIGHLY possible issue that is the wild card in whether a known good quality boot might fail for some and not for others......is that few people in these discussions are posting WHAT GREASE they are using.
I keep saying it.....with modern rubber compounds......grease selection is important. Ray |
_________________ 77 westy 2.0 FI
69 ghia coup 1600dp
70 single cab |
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vwwestyman Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004 Posts: 5680 Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:44 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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Fair enough, Ray.
I used the grease that came in the box with the new VW boot that AlmostHeavenWV_VW sent me. I'd have to presume that VW would include grease that was compatible with their boot! Again, for the mileage/warranty reasons discussed.
I think I've always bought boots that came with a tube of grease, so I've always cleaned out the old grease and used the fresh that came with it anytime I've redone boots. Again I'd assume that compatible grease would always come with a boot, but I suppose you never know. It's probably nearly impossible to know for sure what material is in the inner layer of a boot you buy from any supplier. _________________ Dave Cook
President, Wild Westerner Club
1978 Champagne Edition Westy, repowered to '97 Jetta TDI
1973 Wild Westerner
My Thing |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21462 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 4:43 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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vwwestyman wrote: |
Fair enough, Ray.
I used the grease that came in the box with the new VW boot that AlmostHeavenWV_VW sent me. I'd have to presume that VW would include grease that was compatible with their boot! Again, for the mileage/warranty reasons discussed.
I think I've always bought boots that came with a tube of grease, so I've always cleaned out the old grease and used the fresh that came with it anytime I've redone boots. Again I'd assume that compatible grease would always come with a boot, but I suppose you never know. It's probably nearly impossible to know for sure what material is in the inner layer of a boot you buy from any supplier. |
Thats what I wish they would all do.
The problem is that I dont KNOW which grease.
I guess its been.....almost 3 years now.....I did piece of work for a major automotive parts mfg......a grease test.
The boot samples they sent were split in two, each had a grease applied to a section. I had six sample sets.....they sent 6 greases....unmarked. Only numbered. I added two more of my own to the test .
The boot sections were alternately heated , frozen and exposed to xenon light in a smapp chamber which produces a shit ton of ozone. Then sunlight.
I had these mounted on quartz plates....and just cycled them for about 4 months. Virtually all of the 8 greases had some effect.....from mild swelling or puckering to....damn!
I noted that each piece of boot was split in two. One piece had grease applied and the other was clean. All pieces when through the same weathering cycles. The secondary object was of course to see how much destruction the weathering would do.
The primary objective was to see if certain greases accelerated the damage....and they did.
From looking at rubber type....and testing it in sulfuric acid.....it was Viton. I also tested some dual material boots (for shocks) and some fluorosilicone during the same grease testing for my own stuff.
So on the greases. Two of them were variants of the classic gray, stinky metallic CV greases. One appeared to have more graphite and one appeared to have more moly, was finer grained and darker. They were definately NOT synthetic. The darker moly grease did better with only slight swelling. The grittier graphite grease....think like coastal "moly-graph"....was exuding a lot of oil and was softening the rubber.
One was dark black.....smelled slightly petroleum...looked similar to Bosch distributor grease. I am thinking it was a semi-synthetic blend. It had swelling and some drying on the outside of it like it was pulling something out of the rubber.
The other 3 had to be synthetic. One was greenish blue and had that waxy look like synthetic ball joint grease. One was bright red.....and looked like Redline CV-2 which is one of the two I used. I know they had to be the same.
The last one was slightly transparent, dark green with some blackness dissolved in it.
The bright red one....probahly CV-2....worked fine. Very slight swell. But definately reactive with other greases.....so make sure your stuff is spotless when you use it.
The other two synthetics...did not "swell" the rubber.....but you could tell they were going through it. The rubber was getting gummy on the outside.
In all the greases that appeared to be going through....the two synthetics and the moly graph looking grease.....where they softened the rubber on the outside......they rubber eventually started cracking from the weathering.
The other grease I used....in my test....was GKN.....standard....current VW. I think BMW and honda use it as well.
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-volkswagen-aud...MkQAvD_BwE
It did just fine. Slight swelling. Its metallic....ranges from amber to amber gray.....but "may" be a semi synthetic blend. Its also what Lobro uses.
My takeaway....and one that viton manufacturers state....is DO NOT use viton with ESTERS. It can be used with olefin based synthetics.....but ester based oils....like motor oil.....do jot do well.
Also avoid greases that seperate excessive oil.
Thats all I got. So.....I use what VW and lobro sell....cause they worked in my testing.....and they are working jn my Golf......182,000 miles now on original boots.
The redline has great reviews and is synthetic....but I do not yet know the synthetic oil base. Ray |
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chimneyfish Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009 Posts: 881 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 2:57 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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Just a quick update on my experiments with CV boots, as I noticed I last posted in this thread in April 2018:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...;start=220
The brand new (not NOS) set of genuine VW German made boots I fitted (expiry date on the box was May 2018) are still going strong. They are worth the extra money.
I fitted my first one back in February 2016, as a free replacement for a failed NOS VW one. (Famous last words, but awesome! This has given me more time for driving the bus rather than laying underneath it covered in Moly grease!).
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...;start=160
_________________ 1965 Type 1 Deluxe (1200cc)
1976 Type 2 T2b Microbus L (1800cc Type 4)
Previously...
1972 T2 Camper (Devon), 1988 Golf, 1972 Type 1, 1984 Polo, 1972 T2 Camper (Danbury) |
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markd89 Samba Member
Joined: November 04, 2005 Posts: 657 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:06 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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Chimneyfish, that's interesting. I searched vwheritage.co.uk but doesn't look like they have those anymore. Am I missing something?
Thanks! _________________ 78 TDI Sunroof Bus
Los Angeles |
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tristanblue Samba Member
Joined: May 30, 2019 Posts: 291
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Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2020 11:56 pm Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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[quote="vwwestyman"]
tristanblue wrote: |
vwwestyman wrote: |
So the Dealer sells stock CV boots for a 70 bus?! or is this the Golf, Jetta Tiguan inner boot someone mentioned?
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I'm referring to the Tiguan, etc part that is discussed in the past two or three pages of this thread.
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Thanks...I just recall someone mentioning (be it correct or not) that the small end of the Tiguan boot is 32mm where as the original bus small end is like 27mm. Is this true and if so what did you do to resolve the issue?
Thanks |
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chimneyfish Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009 Posts: 881 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 4:24 am Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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markd89 wrote: |
Chimneyfish, that's interesting. I searched vwheritage.co.uk but doesn't look like they have those anymore. Am I missing something?
Thanks! |
You are right, they appear to be out of stock:
https://www.heritagepartscentre.com/uk/211598201-cv-boot-kit-including-grease.html
On that page, you can sign up for an email notification for when they are back in. I hope they haven’t stopped making them.
I also couldn’t find anything on https://www.volkswagen-classic-parts.de/en/ but thats not unusual, I have found VW don’t list everything. VW dealerships might be able to source them. If you look at the box it has dual part numbers, 251-598-201 for the T3 as the primary part number, and for the T2 part number 211-598-201 stuck on the box by VW Heritage. _________________ 1965 Type 1 Deluxe (1200cc)
1976 Type 2 T2b Microbus L (1800cc Type 4)
Previously...
1972 T2 Camper (Devon), 1988 Golf, 1972 Type 1, 1984 Polo, 1972 T2 Camper (Danbury) |
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markd89 Samba Member
Joined: November 04, 2005 Posts: 657 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 5:21 am Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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chimneyfish wrote: |
markd89 wrote: |
Chimneyfish, that's interesting. I searched vwheritage.co.uk but doesn't look like they have those anymore. Am I missing something?
Thanks! |
You are right, they appear to be out of stock:
https://www.heritagepartscentre.com/uk/211598201-cv-boot-kit-including-grease.html
On that page, you can sign up for an email notification for when they are back in. I hope they haven’t stopped making them.
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38 GBP = $50 USD per boot is spendy too... _________________ 78 TDI Sunroof Bus
Los Angeles |
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vwwestyman Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004 Posts: 5680 Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
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Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 5:49 am Post subject: Re: CV Boot Best Brand and Supplier FAQ |
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[quote="tristanblue"]
vwwestyman wrote: |
tristanblue wrote: |
vwwestyman wrote: |
So the Dealer sells stock CV boots for a 70 bus?! or is this the Golf, Jetta Tiguan inner boot someone mentioned?
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I'm referring to the Tiguan, etc part that is discussed in the past two or three pages of this thread.
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Thanks...I just recall someone mentioning (be it correct or not) that the small end of the Tiguan boot is 32mm where as the original bus small end is like 27mm. Is this true and if so what did you do to resolve the issue?
Thanks |
I suppose it was almostheavenWV_VW who provided the measurements. I didn't measure the boot or the axle when I installed it. I can tell you it still needed to be stretched over the splines a little bit, and was slightly loose on the axle. It also needed to be slightly stretched over the ridge that is meant to hold the boot end in place.
So while slightly loose on the axle, it was easily clamped with the clamp provided in the box, and wasn't a large enough amount to have ended up looking like it was pinched or anything concerning at all. Was totally fine. I was/am confident that this wasn't/isn't any issue.
I think I saw someone in one of the Vanagon forums bought a set of the Tiguan boots, so hopefully soon there'll be more perspective to read. _________________ Dave Cook
President, Wild Westerner Club
1978 Champagne Edition Westy, repowered to '97 Jetta TDI
1973 Wild Westerner
My Thing |
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vwwestyman Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004 Posts: 5680 Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
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