| Author |
Message |
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20267
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
 Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:28 pm Post subject: International Harvester trucks |
 |
|
Anyone on here into corn binders? I am looking at a '70 1100 1/2 ton pickup for a work truck/wood hauler. I know next to nothing about them, and it needs some mechanical love. It apparently has the 304 engine, 727 Dodge trans, and it's 4WD. It needs a rear main seal badly, and I was hoping that it was one of the easy ones. Turns out I have to drop the trans to replace the seal. Damn.
I feel a slight connection to IH as my grandpa worked at a dealer in MN for many years as a mechanic. He's long gone, or I would be calling him right now.
Hoping for advice, links to relevant sites for information, and maybe some fellow enthusiasts to post up there experiences and friendly advice.
Thanks, Corey
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
chickengeorge
Samba Member
Joined: August 18, 2004
Posts: 5634
Location: Spokompton Warshington
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
No advice other than to find a binder with an updated (read: Chevy, Ford or Dodge) drive train. I wouldn't want to be stuck trying to find parts for that thing. I love IH's as well. I used to have a clean little '48 KB1 that was an old forest service truck. There's an orange KB1 around here that has lengthened running boards (like IH should have done) and a few other cool mods. I have a collection of Slammed scout photos on my PC at home. I'd love to undertake that project. A slammed half-cab scout is one of my dream cars.
There is a guy here in Spokane, with a shop up off of Francis, that does nothing but IH. He lives off of Market St, right around Euclid (I think) SW of the Zip's restaurant. He's got some cool stuff. He's got a light green SWB early 70's pickup that's slammed. His kid has a white one slammed with reverse wires on it. Don't know who he is, but he'd be a great source. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20267
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks. I have a local mechanic friend that has a few IH rigs around, and he drives a scout all the time. I talked with him at length yesterday and was able to glean a lot of good info. He said that parts are not that difficult to find, you just need to know where to look. He also said that they only had four V8's, and they all used the exact same exhaust manifold. And they fit either side. IH built them for farmers, so they were tough, and simple.
He had examples of all four engines sitting on the floor of his shop. He was just about to install a fresh 354 (?) into his wife's purple coffee bus. (she has a coffee delivery business) It was nice to be able to see the very subtle differences, which are tough to spot.
It seems they are bit like old VW's, in that they are simple, but different than anything else out there. I'm just trying to decide whether I need to learn the idiosyncrasies of yet another make of vehicle to maintain.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
notchback
Insensitive Jerk
Joined: December 16, 2003
Posts: 7024
Location: Behind the Zion Curtain
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I had an IH Loadstar 1700 with a 16' dump bed. It was powered by the 345. The thing just wouldn't stop running. Way underpowered for that size of truck (especially when hauling several tons of grain), but reliable as can be.
I also had a '61 Scout with the half cab several years ago. I ended up selling it when I needed some cash, and I've regretted it ever since.
_________________
| zeen wrote: |
| Arguing with johnnypan is like mud-wrestling a pig. After a while you realize he just enjoys playing in the mud, winning the contest is not the point. |
FU#3 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnnypan
Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2007
Posts: 7431
Location: sackamenna
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Cut the 345 in half and you have the 4 cyl scout motor...172 cuin 4 cyl.
Rear mainseal in the 304 should be a one piece lip seal...you might get lucky replacing it and putting a speedisleeve on the crank...but odds are the main bearings are hammered.
International Harvester manufactured everything in house except for automatic transmissions...the loadstar series mid range trucks were the best in class hands down IMO..especially those mated with the DT466 six cylinder diesel....bullet proof.The solid lifter gas v-8's were engineered durably but were nowhere near efficient...built for torque and gas @30cents a gallon.. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
notchback
Insensitive Jerk
Joined: December 16, 2003
Posts: 7024
Location: Behind the Zion Curtain
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| johnnypan wrote: |
Cut the 345 in half and you have the 4 cyl scout motor...172 cuin 4 cyl.
|
Wouldn't that be a 172.5 CID engine?
_________________
| zeen wrote: |
| Arguing with johnnypan is like mud-wrestling a pig. After a while you realize he just enjoys playing in the mud, winning the contest is not the point. |
FU#3 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mattcuddy
Samba Member
Joined: October 22, 2003
Posts: 2036
Location: Philly, PA
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| notchback wrote: |
| johnnypan wrote: |
Cut the 345 in half and you have the 4 cyl scout motor...172 cuin 4 cyl.
|
Wouldn't that be a 172.5 CID engine? |
You lose a little in displacement when cutting it in half due to the thickness of the saw blade.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20267
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| johnnypan wrote: |
Cut the 345 in half and you have the 4 cyl scout motor...172 cuin 4 cyl.
Rear mainseal in the 304 should be a one piece lip seal...you might get lucky replacing it and putting a speedisleeve on the crank...but odds are the main bearings are hammered.
International Harvester manufactured everything in house except for automatic transmissions...the loadstar series mid range trucks were the best in class hands down IMO..especially those mated with the DT466 six cylinder diesel....bullet proof.The solid lifter gas v-8's were engineered durably but were nowhere near efficient...built for torque and gas @30cents a gallon.. |
So, do you figure that if the engine pours oil out of the rear seal when warm and at higher RPM's, that I would be able to just replace the seal or will I be looking at a bottom end rebuild?
Not familiar with the speedisleeve. Is that something that bandages the sealing surface where the seal lip rides on the crank?
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnnypan
Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2007
Posts: 7431
Location: sackamenna
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| cdennisg wrote: |
| johnnypan wrote: |
Cut the 345 in half and you have the 4 cyl scout motor...172 cuin 4 cyl.
Rear mainseal in the 304 should be a one piece lip seal...you might get lucky replacing it and putting a speedisleeve on the crank...but odds are the main bearings are hammered.
International Harvester manufactured everything in house except for automatic transmissions...the loadstar series mid range trucks were the best in class hands down IMO..especially those mated with the DT466 six cylinder diesel....bullet proof.The solid lifter gas v-8's were engineered durably but were nowhere near efficient...built for torque and gas @30cents a gallon.. |
So, do you figure that if the engine pours oil out of the rear seal when warm and at higher RPM's, that I would be able to just replace the seal or will I be looking at a bottom end rebuild?
Not familiar with the speedisleeve. Is that something that bandages the sealing surface where the seal lip rides on the crank? |
speedisleeve looks like a razor blade bent in a circle,it presses over the existing crank (it comes with an installation tool)to give the seal a new surface to ride on if the existing surface is grooved.
That scout slant four motor looks just like they cut the 345 in a band saw...it uses a single 345 head and it sits at the same angle as one bank of the 345 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bajaherbie
Samba Sooner
Joined: November 27, 2003
Posts: 2985
Location: altus, oklahoma
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 6:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
lots of int'l trucks here in SW oklahoma..... some running and some not.
i grew up on a cotton farm but my dad was a ford man, i learned to drive in a 1957 ford truck when i was 12 or so.
we did have an international harvester deep freeze though 
_________________
blank |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Endicott jb
Bondo King
Joined: February 17, 2008
Posts: 1902
Location: Havre, MT
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
How bout some fricken pictures????????/
_________________
Josh
OORAH!!
1965 vw beetle(Mayble)
1968 vw beetle(Caroline)
1974 VW Panel Bus
2003 Dodge 2500 5.9 Cummins(Katey)
.|_____|.
(0\_!_/0)
.||......||.
Don't drink and post
http://i540.photobucket.com/albums/gg353/endicott_jb/IMG_20110113_085237.jpg
When life throws you curveballs switch to boomerangs. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iowegian 
Samba Curmudgeon
Joined: February 16, 2005
Posts: 9829
Location: Somewhere between Dubuque and Keokuk
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| bajaherbie wrote: |
lots of int'l trucks here in SW oklahoma..... some running and some not.
i grew up on a cotton farm but my dad was a ford man, i learned to drive in a 1957 ford truck when i was 12 or so.
we did have an international harvester deep freeze though |
Those suckers were HUGE---and heavy. I had to help my father-in-law move theirs a couple of times.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20267
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I am not set up to post pictures from anywhere but the samba gallery.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20267
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 9:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| johnnypan wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
| johnnypan wrote: |
Cut the 345 in half and you have the 4 cyl scout motor...172 cuin 4 cyl.
Rear mainseal in the 304 should be a one piece lip seal...you might get lucky replacing it and putting a speedisleeve on the crank...but odds are the main bearings are hammered.
International Harvester manufactured everything in house except for automatic transmissions...the loadstar series mid range trucks were the best in class hands down IMO..especially those mated with the DT466 six cylinder diesel....bullet proof.The solid lifter gas v-8's were engineered durably but were nowhere near efficient...built for torque and gas @30cents a gallon.. |
So, do you figure that if the engine pours oil out of the rear seal when warm and at higher RPM's, that I would be able to just replace the seal or will I be looking at a bottom end rebuild?
Not familiar with the speedisleeve. Is that something that bandages the sealing surface where the seal lip rides on the crank? |
speedisleeve looks like a razor blade bent in a circle,it presses over the existing crank (it comes with an installation tool)to give the seal a new surface to ride on if the existing surface is grooved.
That scout slant four motor looks just like they cut the 345 in a band saw...it uses a single 345 head and it sits at the same angle as one bank of the 345 |
So do you figure that if the seal is bad, it is because the crank is floating around on worn main bearings? I am just trying to decide whether to buy the truck or not. If it needs a bottom end rebuild, I'll keep looking.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cjjunkie
Samba Member
Joined: February 05, 2009
Posts: 89
Location: michigan
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
did you check the binder bulletin board?
I had IH axles under one of my jeeps, held up well. compared to more mainstream domestics their engines are very heavy, but its industrial/farm grade stuff.
it was indeed the first commercial SUV
_________________
[IMG]http://www.vw-mplate.com/mcode_draw_mplate.php?mod=1&id=5410[/IMG] |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnnypan
Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2007
Posts: 7431
Location: sackamenna
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| cdennisg wrote: |
| johnnypan wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
| johnnypan wrote: |
Cut the 345 in half and you have the 4 cyl scout motor...172 cuin 4 cyl.
Rear mainseal in the 304 should be a one piece lip seal...you might get lucky replacing it and putting a speedisleeve on the crank...but odds are the main bearings are hammered.
International Harvester manufactured everything in house except for automatic transmissions...the loadstar series mid range trucks were the best in class hands down IMO..especially those mated with the DT466 six cylinder diesel....bullet proof.The solid lifter gas v-8's were engineered durably but were nowhere near efficient...built for torque and gas @30cents a gallon.. |
So, do you figure that if the engine pours oil out of the rear seal when warm and at higher RPM's, that I would be able to just replace the seal or will I be looking at a bottom end rebuild?
Not familiar with the speedisleeve. Is that something that bandages the sealing surface where the seal lip rides on the crank? |
speedisleeve looks like a razor blade bent in a circle,it presses over the existing crank (it comes with an installation tool)to give the seal a new surface to ride on if the existing surface is grooved.
That scout slant four motor looks just like they cut the 345 in a band saw...it uses a single 345 head and it sits at the same angle as one bank of the 345 |
So do you figure that if the seal is bad, it is because the crank is floating around on worn main bearings? I am just trying to decide whether to buy the truck or not. If it needs a bottom end rebuild, I'll keep looking. |
Coupla reasons for bad rear main seal...tired dried out old seal,groove in crank cut by seal,main bearings hammered out and the crank is moving around...good news is you can do an endplay test just like a VW engine...stick a prybar under the front crank pulley and try to pry the crank in and out...if it has endplay,its probably has hammered bearings. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20267
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| cjjunkie wrote: |
did you check the binder bulletin board?
|
Is that a website? I will do some searching. Thanks.
EDIT: Found it. http://www.binderbulletin.org/
_________________
nothing
Last edited by cdennisg on Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:40 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20267
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| johnnypan wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
| johnnypan wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
| johnnypan wrote: |
Cut the 345 in half and you have the 4 cyl scout motor...172 cuin 4 cyl.
Rear mainseal in the 304 should be a one piece lip seal...you might get lucky replacing it and putting a speedisleeve on the crank...but odds are the main bearings are hammered.
International Harvester manufactured everything in house except for automatic transmissions...the loadstar series mid range trucks were the best in class hands down IMO..especially those mated with the DT466 six cylinder diesel....bullet proof.The solid lifter gas v-8's were engineered durably but were nowhere near efficient...built for torque and gas @30cents a gallon.. |
So, do you figure that if the engine pours oil out of the rear seal when warm and at higher RPM's, that I would be able to just replace the seal or will I be looking at a bottom end rebuild?
Not familiar with the speedisleeve. Is that something that bandages the sealing surface where the seal lip rides on the crank? |
speedisleeve looks like a razor blade bent in a circle,it presses over the existing crank (it comes with an installation tool)to give the seal a new surface to ride on if the existing surface is grooved.
That scout slant four motor looks just like they cut the 345 in a band saw...it uses a single 345 head and it sits at the same angle as one bank of the 345 |
So do you figure that if the seal is bad, it is because the crank is floating around on worn main bearings? I am just trying to decide whether to buy the truck or not. If it needs a bottom end rebuild, I'll keep looking. |
Coupla reasons for bad rear main seal...tired dried out old seal,groove in crank cut by seal,main bearings hammered out and the crank is moving around...good news is you can do an endplay test just like a VW engine...stick a prybar under the front crank pulley and try to pry the crank in and out...if it has endplay,its probably has hammered bearings. |
Thanks, I will give that a try.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dunebubby
Samba Thread Killer
Joined: October 12, 2006
Posts: 882
Location: In my den,throwing darts at a picture of my ex-boss
|
| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 4:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
OK so a little off topic,but does anybody know if IH used the same wheel bolt pattern "forever"? I Have a 1937 international trailer I want to put some 15" wheels on (Did they ever use a 14",I know I'd probably have to start chopping drums or do other mods), and block the springs so the thing sits low enough to be able to be easily loaded.
Off topic but at least I added a pic. 
_________________
"We buy things we don't need,..with money we don't have,...to impress people we don't even like". |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20267
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 5:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
So, I called the guy yesterday morning to see if I could come by and check out a few more things on the truck, and to fire it up and hear it run. He sold it Friday. Shit. He had had it for sale for a few months with no buyers. Then, right when I am ready to do the deal, someone comes along and buys it. Oh well, the search continues.
Thanks for all who gave advice. It is appreciated.
I have no idea about bolts pattern on these trucks, but I would bet some of the previous posters will know.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
