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traviswx1
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:05 am    Post subject: Ball joint beam question... Reply with quote

I am in the planning stages of a cut and turn on my front end and I already have one adjuster. I was wondering if anyone has used only one adjuster and how did it work out???

I was thinking about cutting and turning the bottom tube 1/2 inch and putting the adjuster in at the top!?

I was already gonna do a cut and turn with no adjusters but I found one soo letme know what you guys think!

Thanks!
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58Dub
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't see any advantage of only one. If anything, it will throw the two preloads off....and probably cause it to ride bad or bind
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traviswx1
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it would just give me less of an adjustment range..
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

traviswx1 wrote:
I think it would just give me less of an adjustment range..

ok Confused
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txdunebuggy101
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wink use 2 adjusters or just do cut n turn. Your plan could be detrimental to the health of your ride. ...
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blitzschnell racing
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

you can cut and turn one tube hten the adjuster on the other. thatd allow you to soften the front end for street and stiffen it for off road? It would work. Some racers cut and turn one more than the other
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joemama
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would think it would work well, adjusting so the 2nd set of torsions come in later, kind of like progressive springs, start out soft, and stiffen as you come into the 2nd torsions.
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traviswx1
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

txdunebuggy101 wrote:
Wink use 2 adjusters or just do cut n turn. Your plan could be detrimental to the health of your ride. ...


I was wondering how it could be bad for the ride.? I wouldnt think it would hurt the torsion bars at all. Please fill me in on more detail if you got it..

I would hope to get some info from someone who has done it! But maybe they are far and few between.

Any input helps though Thanks guys!
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petrol punk
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An adjuster on just one beam tube wouldn't give you much height adjustment, you'd just be preloading it on the other spring which would probably just change your spring rates a bit.
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blitzschnell racing
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont use adjusters sooo I dont know. Not gona give secrets but yah you can turn one more than the other so a cut and turn on one and the adjuster on the other would work fine.....
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chubby53
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

it may just be me, but wouldn't it cause the springs to fight each other? cause one set is pushing more than the other? making for stiffer ride?
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motorbreath53
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My personal experiance (take it as you will)

Adjusters, when used on a lifted beam with stock torsions, are just not necessary.

Once they are set, you won't move them often... if ever...

If you plan on running the car hard in the dirt, cut/turn 1/4"... but that WILL make it somewhat stiff... Thats what I ran on my last BJ beam...

Go a bit less for a car that will see mostly street.

OH! and with stock leafs, preloading one set more than the other will only cause the tighter set to fatiuge faster. Cool idea... but the stock parts won't hold up that way for too long if your playing in the dirt...
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blitzschnell racing
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you looked at the stock location of the torsion bars as they sit? You should tell that to VW cause there not the same setting. I dont play with my car I race it, beat the crap out of it. You can cut and turn over a half an inch and not break leafs if there real german ones. I know that turning one more than the other works cause i do, also depends on what you do as far as swapping in Sway away or thing bars to the set. Theres alot of variables, try it and see? You can get another beam if you dont like it. Adjusters suck cause when you break the adjuster bolt off your screwed and yah, usually you adjust and dont ever change it. If I had a street/play car id try cut and turn on one and adjuster on the other. Your not gona ruin anything, Ive raced the 1000 with one set completely broken and the other set holding the car up.....think outside the box, thats how 11 racers have all the tricks. And 1/4 turn is nothing on a offroad beam.
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blitzschnell racing
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chubby53 wrote:
it may just be me, but wouldn't it cause the springs to fight each other? cause one set is pushing more than the other? making for stiffer ride?


fight each other? theyd have to be going backwards to do that? and its a softer ride with one set turned less. youll have to figure out which one to turn less it took alot of time to get it right....
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traviswx1
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ive heard (on this site) that it would be best to have the bottom bars turned more than the upper because of the ball joint placement it puts more pressure on the joints.

So ill go with 1/2 inch turn on bottom and the adjuster on top. I plan on driving the car a little on and off road but I wanna drive REAL hard when i do go offroad Twisted Evil And id rather have it too stiff than too soft because of clearance issues aka low car!

Any more input on the amount of the turn!? lemme know..
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traviswx1
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

blitzschnell racing wrote:
chubby53 wrote:
it may just be me, but wouldn't it cause the springs to fight each other? cause one set is pushing more than the other? making for stiffer ride?


fight each other? theyd have to be going backwards to do that? and its a softer ride with one set turned less. youll have to figure out which one to turn less it took alot of time to get it right....


What do you use on your class 11 car??
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motorbreath53
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like I said.. my personal experiance... "take it as you will"

Blitz- i'd put a lot more stock in your experiance with the race car...

...but my $.02, even with my 1/4 cut turn (both tubes), my car was stiff enough in front that the front end hardly compressed with me and a friend hanging on the bumper...

...and I sagged out a set of stock VW torsions in only 5 or 6 trips to the desert.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This out of the VW "Without Guesswork booklet"
Ball joint 1966 and later
Upper beam setting 44degrees +/- 30minutes
Lower beam setting 35degrees30minutes +/- 30minutes
30 minutes is a half of degree.
They are all ready set to work progessively.
The early Select A Drop used to lower bugs before adjusters became available pulled or pushed the upper beam against the lower beam.
If you want to try it go ahead.
You may find it making the front end stiffer then you would like. That was one of the problems with the Select A Drop.
They did work great for the people that liked to Autocross, the type of racing around pylons in a parking lot.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have ran a baja with a set of adjusters on the top and stock on the bottom and it just sit higher it rode fine. The PO did it. It wasn't stiff or soft it sit perfectly fine
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chubby53
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 06, 2011 12:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

never really thought about it, but i had adjusters on my old baja. at first i would adjust here and there if i was going wheelin or not, but after a while i never touched them. The only real benefit i could see of adjusters is that once all together you can fine tune your ride height/stiffness to your liking so you don't go too much or not enough when you would cut and turn. Just my .02.
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