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ddye
Samba Member
Joined: July 14, 2010
Posts: 357
Location: Dallas, TX
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 Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:12 am Post subject: |
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I am really looking for dirt roads and camping opportunities that are off the beaten path but close enough to beer to be happy  I think going with the bigger tires, lift will get me through most of what I want. The high lift jack is in the cards as well to be safe.
Destination = anywhere the van is pointed. I really want to do some Arkansas exploring this spring as there are some excellent roads out that way.
_________________
1988 Westy
2.1 Boston Bob Rebuild
"Nelly" |
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ddye
Samba Member
Joined: July 14, 2010
Posts: 357
Location: Dallas, TX
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:19 am Post subject: |
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| buildyourown wrote: |
The moog spring lift for the front is a good budget alternative. Combined with some spacers or airbags for the rear and you can 1.5" safely and for under $100.
Shocks, springs and bigger premium tires. That's were I'd start. |
This is an interesting idea and one that may be the best of both worlds. If you can find an airbag designed for the Westy is it a supplement to the current suspension or does it replace it? Meaning would I remove the current springs and shocks and the airbags would take their place allowing me to raise and lower the van at will? Additionally, would this work for the front as well? Has anyone tried this approach? I would think this serves a duel role and would allow for a lower driving height for freeways but for off road would allow for a more aggressive position. I am sure I am over simplifying this.
D
_________________
1988 Westy
2.1 Boston Bob Rebuild
"Nelly" |
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j_dirge
Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2007
Posts: 4641
Location: Twain Harte, CA
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| ddye wrote: |
I am really looking for dirt roads and camping opportunities that are off the beaten path but close enough to beer to be happy I think going with the bigger tires, lift will get me through most of what I want. The high lift jack is in the cards as well to be safe.
Destination = anywhere the van is pointed. I really want to do some Arkansas exploring this spring as there are some excellent roads out that way. |
Sepaking from the perspective of a guy who has done the whole lift and 16" tire thing...
These mods did not open up any new worlds for me.. I drove my 89 Westy stock 2.1 all over the place for many years before I moved up wheel size.. and only moved up wheel size to fit better brakes.
Sure it handles a little better... but I am nearing the upper limits of what the 2WD suspension can do without much more ($$$) extensive mods.. and am needing more HP and torque to move the thing around.
Remember.. "Law of diminishing returns"
My beater 72 Baywindow and my unmodified 81 aircooled took me just about everywhere my 89 tall Westy has gone.
But the 89 tall Westy is a fun project.. So.. in that sense its worth the money/time/investment.
One thing is for sure.. I would not put off a trip just because I want a spring lift. I'd get good tires.. check my brakes and shocks and GO!
_________________
-89 GL Westy, SVX.. finally.
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"
"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5
| danfromsyr wrote: |
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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r39o
Samba Polizei
Joined: May 18, 2005
Posts: 9800
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:50 am Post subject: |
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| syncrodoka wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Tell when and where will you use that around the San Diego area? |
Maybe he isn't on house arrest and can leave the city/state/country? |
Don't be rude. I work from at home by choice!
(Sort of, some one has to pick up kids from school, etc.....)
Back on topic, though, I have found my 85 2WD Westy at 18 inches has allowed me to go where we want to go. Dragging the family around to the snow once a year and out to the dessert (mostly for Boy Scout related stuff) it has been up to the challenge with no issues. Getting in and out of the dessert area is a challenge power wise. The dessert East of here requires going up and down twisty mountain roads and not to forget the winds that blow too. It is a challenge to get there not drive around out there. (Mud caves coming up in the next weeks!)
I have yet to yearn for a locker or anything more traction wise. But, maybe I just know the limits. I do drive over bushes and stuff from time to time, but only as needed. Not for sport like it seems many do because they "can" with their 4WD. Different strokes....
It is my 1990 Multivan that I must decide what to do. For now, I worry about making it move and not how high it sits. It sits low like any Carat. Not that great for going out to places. We'll see.
Keep having fun
_________________
"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!
1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....
Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently) |
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bugger101
Samba Member
Joined: September 04, 2010
Posts: 1559
Location: orlando
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:19 am Post subject: |
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| joetiger wrote: |
| bugger101 wrote: |
is that near the army ammunition plant  |
 Longhorn Ammo Plant? Why yes it is! My oldest brother was actually the head industrial hygienist on the Superfund cleanup of Longhorn.
(Apologies for going off-topic, but I really didn't think anybody would get this one...)
I don't know where Ddye is heading, but if he goes anywhere due east of Dallas, there's a LOT of dirt, hills, and fun to be had with a 2WD Vanagon. Just be sure to bring your own beer, because in many counties you can't buy it. |
wheres my bonus points  |
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boulderdrop
Samba Member
Joined: February 06, 2008
Posts: 481
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:21 am Post subject: |
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| r39o wrote: |
| boulderdrop wrote: |
Turn that "1 Wheel Drive" stock vanagon into a 2WD with a Locking Limited-Slip-Diff.
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So what that cost?
I sort of recall to get all the parts that was like $2K?
The stock rebuild costs like $1000. I am just having it done.
I have a hard time justifying that mod. |
That sounds about right, I had the work done by Daryl at AA Transaxle and I paid for it in two stages (at the rebuild for the internals then for everything outside of the transaxle). It might have been closer to $2.5k now that I think of it for the rebuild + taller 3rd (bostig) + LLSD.
Like most everyone, I have Syncro envy, but decided to not go that route. So I went with the LLSD. I'm pretty happy with it, but haven't really tested it so much. It's still limited-slip, so it's not like a full-blown-lock between the two rear-tires; but it's worked really well in slightly packed snow 2-3" and pretty good on flat-ice (well, excellent considering I don't think I would have gone far without it last weekend).
I feel like I could now get that 2WD sticker that people have been chatting about here and not feel like a poser. hahah. However, I would never consider it to be a syncro.. real 4WD + locking diffs front/rear would own.
_________________
== My Rides ==
1984 Westy, Bostig, 3rd:1.14, Locker-LSD, Newly Painted
1980 24' J-Boat
1979 Sears Freespirit Moped
1996 Chev S10 4x4 ZR2
2012 Toyota Camry Hybrid (Wife's)
== How I Pay the Bills ==
Windows FTP Server at http://www.bpftpserver.com (PM for a FREE one) |
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Farfrumwork
Samba Member
Joined: October 10, 2008
Posts: 692
Location: Mile High
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:29 pm Post subject: |
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Buy a syncro transmission - one with a selectable locker.
I have one that will go into my van in the next few months. I bought a semi-custom transmission mount from Mike at Rocky Mountain Westy which allows me to bolt the syncro tranny to the 2wd tranny mount points.
~$1800 total for the tranny ('91 model with better 3/4 slider and ~130kmi) and the mount.
Granny gear and locker will be in my '85 weekender. With the EJ22 I installed a couple years ago this beastie will be quite able. I ws thinking of the LLSD, but I may put the $$ into some 930 axles/cv's.
And yes, I need a locker and a low gear. 12,000+ft passes laden with big rocks and loose gravel have possed problems for me in the past. 
-Chad |
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scubabrian
Samba Member
Joined: June 11, 2008
Posts: 117
Location: San Diego, CA
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| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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| r39o wrote: |
| scubabrian wrote: |
| Syncro conversion in my future? The madness! |
Tell when and where will you use that around the San Diego area?
I can think of only one or two times a year around here it "might" be needed. |
Hence the madness! I do like going through Anza Borrego and am still foolish enough to make trips through Baja. Really since I have a Toyota 4x4 as well I need a Syncro like a hole in the head. I think the Westy's are just a money pit that has no bottom.
_________________
Brian
85 Westfalia with 2.2L Subaru
brian-mchugh-uwphoto.com |
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BenT Syncro
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2005
Posts: 1085
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:15 am Post subject: |
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| I haven;t noticed Joel V.K. from Mountain View, CA on the discussion. It's a shame because he goes up and down Baja in his Orly Blue Multivan 2wd with raised suspension and Syncro locker in his 2wd trans. It's no Syncro but I understand it can venture further than any stock 2wd. With a proper winch, it can go off into much Syncro territory. |
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syncrodoka
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2005
Posts: 12008
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:20 am Post subject: |
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I don't know if Joel is even on this board?
| Quote: |
| With a proper winch, it can go off into much Syncro territory. |
That seems like a lot of work plus you need to bring a proper sand anchor as there probably won't be many trees to attach to. Cacti aren't ideal anchors. |
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BenT Syncro
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2005
Posts: 1085
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:25 am Post subject: |
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| syncrodoka wrote: |
I don't know if Joel is even on this board?
| Quote: |
| With a proper winch, it can go off into much Syncro territory. |
That seems like a lot of work plus you need to bring a proper sand anchor as there probably won't be many trees to attach to. Cacti aren't ideal anchors. |
You know Joel. He probably has a battleship anchor stashed under his 2wd spare tire carrier. |
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syncrodoka
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2005
Posts: 12008
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:28 am Post subject: |
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I know Joel , I want his van(and I have told him several times) but I don't know if he hangs out on this board.
2wd locked doesn't help on rainy, snowy or icy roads though- actually that would be downright dangerous.. |
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BenT Syncro
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2005
Posts: 1085
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:37 am Post subject: |
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| syncrodoka wrote: |
I know Joel , I want his van(and I have told him several times) but I don't know if he hangs out on this board.
2wd locked doesn't help on rainy, snow or icy roads though- actually that would be downright dangerous.. |
Yep, you're not telling me anything I didn't already know. Last weekend, I spent some time in the Sierras without a Syncro or a Vanagon for that matter. FWD '00 Routan (aka Dodgy Caravan) with 1000+ of gear in the back plus 2"-3" of ice on the road guaranteed driving excitement. I was thinking of my pair of Syncros, Audi Quattro, and Landrover Tomcat as I turned the wheel full lock to the left whilst the nose was still pointing to the right just past Donner Summit. Thanks to old VW training, I was able to use the throttle to steer straight but not before GF Spicy was screaming in panic. I was calm with only visions of making this drive again next weekend in a Syncro. Hey I can dream, can't I?
BTW, the chains were useless in thick ice with the heavy load lifting the weight off the front end.
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dobryan
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 16508
Location: Brookeville, MD
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 7:22 am Post subject: |
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| syncrodoka wrote: |
I know Joel , I want his van(and I have told him several times) but I don't know if he hangs out on this board.
2wd locked doesn't help on rainy, snowy or icy roads though- actually that would be downright dangerous.. |
That's why it is nice to have a 2WD limited slip WITH a locker. The limited slip is great in bad weather and the locker is great for those occasional off-road times it is needed.
_________________
Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru EJ25 and Peloquin TBD
"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson
MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646
Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371
The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794 |
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j_dirge
Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2007
Posts: 4641
Location: Twain Harte, CA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:15 am Post subject: |
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| dobryan wrote: |
| syncrodoka wrote: |
I know Joel , I want his van(and I have told him several times) but I don't know if he hangs out on this board.
2wd locked doesn't help on rainy, snowy or icy roads though- actually that would be downright dangerous.. |
That's why it is nice to have a 2WD limited slip WITH a locker. The limited slip is great in bad weather and the locker is great for those occasional off-road times it is needed. |
Honestly.. How much more benfit is a locker if you already have LSD?
As SD points out, a locker is a hazard in many conditions if no pull is there from front wheels to compensate the locker's straight push.
Seems to me.. that the biggest advantage of that locker setup, aint the locker.. but is the low gear of the syncro box.. I tossed a few emails towards the rebuilders about this. I want that low gear!...
(Wish there was a transfer case? Then I'd get more serious about a syncro.. But thats another thread...)
For a pretty tough 2WD set up.. I'd go syncro transmission with low gear, LSD, and a nice quality winch.. Air compressor, sand anchor (or 2) and tree protection straps. Don't forget a good long handled shovel, a diggin bar, high lift jack and the other assorted tools of the advneturer.
Though, honestly.. with family aboard.. my days of getting into hairball situations went away with my last 4WD and the Suzuki DR650... kinda miss 'em at times. But I am liking my health.
I will live vicariously through you all.
_________________
-89 GL Westy, SVX.. finally.
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"
"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5
| danfromsyr wrote: |
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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r39o
Samba Polizei
Joined: May 18, 2005
Posts: 9800
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 11:06 am Post subject: |
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| j_dirge wrote: |
| For a pretty tough 2WD set up.. I'd go syncro transmission with low gear, LSD, and a nice quality winch.. Air compressor, sand anchor (or 2) and tree protection straps. Don't forget a good long handled shovel, a diggin bar, high lift jack and the other assorted tools of the advneturer. |
| j_dirge wrote: |
| Though, honestly.. with family aboard.. my days of getting into hairball situations went away |
X2 x 2!
I just got my $1538 bill for my Rancho "stock" (plus extras!) rebuild for my 1990 Multivan. So when I find my ideal transmission, I will have time to build it right.....
_________________
"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!
1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....
Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently) |
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Williamtaylor33
Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2007
Posts: 1545
Location: Arkansas
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 11:57 am Post subject: |
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| ddye wrote: |
I am really looking for dirt roads and camping opportunities that are off the beaten path but close enough to beer to be happy I think going with the bigger tires, lift will get me through most of what I want. The high lift jack is in the cards as well to be safe.
Destination = anywhere the van is pointed. I really want to do some Arkansas exploring this spring as there are some excellent roads out that way. |
there are some great spots in Arkansas.
I need 4 wheel drive anytime it rains much. Like today. 2wd wouldn't mean much trying to come out of my mile long muddy driveway. And a locker on slick surfaces will get you in trouble.
_________________
89 Bostig powered syncro westy |
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boulderdrop
Samba Member
Joined: February 06, 2008
Posts: 481
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Williamtaylor33 wrote: |
| And a locker on slick surfaces will get you in trouble. |
I've heard this said a couple times now. Why is a locker on slick surfaces a bad thing?
_________________
== My Rides ==
1984 Westy, Bostig, 3rd:1.14, Locker-LSD, Newly Painted
1980 24' J-Boat
1979 Sears Freespirit Moped
1996 Chev S10 4x4 ZR2
2012 Toyota Camry Hybrid (Wife's)
== How I Pay the Bills ==
Windows FTP Server at http://www.bpftpserver.com (PM for a FREE one) |
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BlackDogVan
Samba Member
Joined: December 21, 2007
Posts: 855
Location: Vancouver Island
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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| boulderdrop wrote: |
| Williamtaylor33 wrote: |
| And a locker on slick surfaces will get you in trouble. |
I've heard this said a couple times now. Why is a locker on slick surfaces a bad thing? |
Its going around a slick curve that's the issue, touch the gas & you spin out.
_________________
Gone but not forgotten - 1991 Carat - AAZ transmogriffied to mTDi.
Still addicted, looking for Doka... |
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boulderdrop
Samba Member
Joined: February 06, 2008
Posts: 481
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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| BlackDogVan wrote: |
| boulderdrop wrote: |
| Williamtaylor33 wrote: |
| And a locker on slick surfaces will get you in trouble. |
I've heard this said a couple times now. Why is a locker on slick surfaces a bad thing? |
Its going around a slick curve that's the issue, touch the gas & you spin out. |
More than the "power goes to the wheel that slips" of the standard 1wd (smile)?
I thought it performed way better last weekend with it enabled, but I went real slow and barely turned.
_________________
== My Rides ==
1984 Westy, Bostig, 3rd:1.14, Locker-LSD, Newly Painted
1980 24' J-Boat
1979 Sears Freespirit Moped
1996 Chev S10 4x4 ZR2
2012 Toyota Camry Hybrid (Wife's)
== How I Pay the Bills ==
Windows FTP Server at http://www.bpftpserver.com (PM for a FREE one) |
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