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Universal turn signal issue
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rider307g
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 9:50 pm    Post subject: Universal turn signal issue Reply with quote

I have one of those universal turn signals and I am having an issue, hope someone can help. Wired it like the wiring diagrm, except I did not run the red to the brake switch because I am using seperate amber turn signals that do not use the brake light. When you turn on the signal, the light on the lever flashes and you can hear the relay clicking, but no power to the lights. I checked the wiring for the lights and it is all good, any suggestions? AM I missing something? This is keeping me from driving it to work.
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new-n-old-vdubs
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do the lights have grouchassis.they should be grounded to the chassis.
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Dale M.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

new-n-old-vdubs wrote:
Do the lights have grouchassis.they should be grounded to the chassis.


Ditto....

If flasher is clicking it means front light are probably working ... Correct? ...

If rear are not working its probably grounding issues as "new-n-old-vdubs" mentions..

Dale
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rider307g
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The lights are grounded, I also ran power to them directly to make sure they work and the bulbs work, but the front and backs do not light up. The light in the signal arm blinks, but not the lights on the fenders.
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Dale M.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Umm.... Wired like this....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Tail/marker lamps (filaments) not shown in this graphic...

If all else fails you can still roll down window and use arm signals to drive to work... Of course most people will think you are crazy or will not understand what you are doing....

Dale
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rider307g
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, wired exactly like that.
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Letterman7
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In spite of the way the wiring diagram is... is it remotely possible that the red wire (+) must be connected anyway to provide power out to the lights? Counterintuitive, but that's my first thought. Put power to it and see what happens.
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tinnocker
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had one of those and couldn't get it to work right. Asked for help on here and still couldn't get it to work right. I bought individual toggle switches and never looked back.
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Dale M.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Letterman7 wrote:
In spite of the way the wiring diagram is... is it remotely possible that the red wire (+) must be connected anyway to provide power out to the lights? Counterintuitive, but that's my first thought. Put power to it and see what happens.


No....

Dale
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bruces
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

check your brown,orange green and yellow with a test light .
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Dale M.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IF you find the Chinese junk does not work, here is a few options...

http://www.pmlights.com/products.cfm?cId=5&fId=24&pId=885

Or...

http://signaldynamics.com/index.php?page=shop.prod...;Itemid=77

http://signaldynamics.com/index.php?page=shop.prod...;Itemid=77

Dale
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Letterman7
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dale M. wrote:


No....

Dale


Not having seen one of those units in person Dale, and apparently you're familiar with them, what's the red wire for, then? I'm just asking for clarification, nothing more.

R
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rider307g
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As far as I can tell, the red wire is to light the brake lights when you press on the brake pedal. If you are just running a set of red tail lights, the brake and turn signal share the same filiment. In my case, I am using a set of ambers for the turn signals so I did not connect the red. I have tried the red both grounded as well as powered with no change. Back to chasing gremlins tonight. I need this to be able to drive it daily and trouble shoot any issues before some bigger trips.
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Dale M.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 7:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Letterman7 wrote:
Dale M. wrote:


No....

Dale


Not having seen one of those units in person Dale, and apparently you're familiar with them, what's the red wire for, then? I'm just asking for clarification, nothing more.

R


Yes I am familiar with it, I have one that actually works... But stupid chrome/plastic housing is about to self destruct at steeong column clamp... Not looking forward to under dash wiring work to replace it.... Probably replace it with Peterson unit or GROTE with "lift lever" unit to dim/flash headlamps...

Red wire is for IF you want to have a turn signal lamp function as stop light on side which is not blinking during a turn, or just as stop lamps when not turning at all....

In the case of schematic in response above, red wire is NOT used as there is no stop light function with this configuration of turn signal switch...

Here is two valid configurations using brake light/switch circuit...

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Its a combination of switch contacts (inside turn signal switch) and connection arrangement you decide to use...

Also if using 3 prong flasher... Blue wire operates indicator lamp (only), Black wire operates turn signal lamps, would suggest if NOTHING flashes ( 4 corner lamps) problem may be on black wire in flasher circuit... Check connection at flasher, or maybe bad connection inside switch... Also verify flasher is wired correctly...

IF using two prong flasher, blue and black wire have to be connected together at flasher....

Also **assuming** you are using US style flasher and not a European style flasher.... Yes there is difference...

This graphic below is of "typical" thermal, 3 prong flasher...

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



Dale
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Letterman7
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Think Gotcha. It's always curious to me how manufacturers wire some things to work. I just couldn't (and still can't) figure why they would send a powered brake wire through the turn signal switch. Great explanation on the layouts and flasher units - that should surely help someone else out!
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Dale M.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Letterman7 wrote:
Think Gotcha. It's always curious to me how manufacturers wire some things to work. I just couldn't (and still can't) figure why they would send a powered brake wire through the turn signal switch. Great explanation on the layouts and flasher units - that should surely help someone else out!


ok ... IF you really want to scramble your brain....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This set of relays does exactly same thing as mechanical turnsignal switch.... Just keep in mind only one set of relays is active at any time you are in turn mode.... Observe circuit paths as (normal) and the consider them in "operated" (turn) mode...

Dale
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rider307g
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had some time to goof off with it last night and found that if I ran the red wire to where the blue wire is connected at the flasher, my rear flashers would work correctly, but no front ones. In taking apart the switch itself I could trace the wiring and see why. I then decided that the internal ring made no contact with the power so I used jb weld and solder to make a connection that I thought would fix it. still no go. A toggle switch is looking like a good option. Sad More screwing around tonight.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dale M. wrote:


ok ... IF you really want to scramble your brain....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This set of relays does exactly same thing as mechanical turnsignal switch.... Just keep in mind only one set of relays is active at any time you are in turn mode.... Observe circuit paths as (normal) and the consider them in "operated" (turn) mode...

Dale


I used this diagram from Dale to wire up my buggy turn signals. I built this relay array so that my early 3 wire vw turn signal switch would work with Mustang tail lights (only 1 dual filament bulb) and it works great!!

It's not complicated to build, only to understand!

Tom
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, after undoing all of my Mickey Mouse fixes, I decided to use a two prong flasher, turns out that was the ticket. Thanks everyone for all of your advice. Should be a day or two and I will be commuting in mine. Mounted new mirrors as well, pics to follow.
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