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87vanagon
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robw_z wrote:
This is how I solved the latch pin problems. There probably are some better ways as I had to trim the plastic panels a bit to fit around these brackets(if they were more tightly fit and the bolts were countersunk this would not have been necessary).


So the Carat latch pins sit in a different spot then on the GL, are they forward or back and do you or anyone else have that measurement
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insyncro
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

By thinking you are going to trim the panels is not going to fix the fact that the seat back will be at the wrong position when locked and not comfortable to sit in.
IMHO, there is one way to mount all the Carat seats and panels....the way it was done at the factory.
If you want the Zbed to hinge properly and the side table to latch, I see no other way.
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SteveVanB
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could always put the panels in and then mark/measure where the holes for the pins are.
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Mick Ord
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have recently comlpleted a full conversion from westy camper to carat interior. I was lucky enough to find a complete parts van ( engine was blown).

I used all the factory parts etc and copied the exact bracket mouting areas- i cut out all the factory mounts and welded them into my westy.

While this type of converion does not appear too difficult, but is quite involved, i would not want to of done it without a parts/template van to go with.

For sure it could be done without, but would of required a whole load of fabrication and "guess work"- atleast have a carat nearby for reference.
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insyncro
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick Ord wrote:
I have recently comlpleted a full conversion from westy camper to carat interior. I was lucky enough to find a complete parts van ( engine was blown).

I used all the factory parts etc and copied the exact bracket mouting areas- i cut out all the factory mounts and welded them into my westy.

While this type of converion does not appear too difficult, but is quite involved, i would not want to of done it without a parts/template van to go with.

For sure it could be done without, but would of required a whole load of fabrication and "guess work"- atleast have a carat nearby for reference.


I couldn't agree more.
I am trying to help on the thread, but don't have time to measure and photograph every inch of the donor Carats I own.
I appreciate someone with similar experience sharing.
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Robw_z
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

insyncro wrote:
By thinking you are going to trim the panels is not going to fix the fact that the seat back will be at the wrong position when locked and not comfortable to sit in.
IMHO, there is one way to mount all the Carat seats and panels....the way it was done at the factory.
If you want the Zbed to hinge properly and the side table to latch, I see no other way.


If you are implying the panels must be trimmed so the latch pin can be positioned differently, you are mistaken. The brackets I made place the latch pin in exactly the same spot as the factory brackets, they just bolt in rather than weld in. The latch pin sticks through the factory hole in the factory panel. The panels must be trimmed because the bolt heads stick out above the vertical face of the bracket. The trimming required is not visible with the seat latched, only with the bed down and even then nobody would notice.

I agree that the factory way is best, but for those without access to welding and cutting tools/skills a bolt on bracket is a fine way to go. I guarantee those brackets latch and set the seat back in exactly the same position as a factory Carat.

-Rob
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insyncro
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm saying if you use the GL latch position with the Carat rear bench it won't work.
Cutting the opening in the plastic panel won't change a thing.
Moving the pin postion must happen to allow the Carat bench to seat into the correct position.
How you do this is up too each van owner.
I cut and weld as I am set up todo so.
I will happily do this for anyone, but I charge for the service.

dylan
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Robw_z
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

87vanagon wrote:


So the Carat latch pins sit in a different spot then on the GL, are they forward or back and do you or anyone else have that measurement



The two bolt holes you see the brackets fit into exist in the GL from the factory. They should be there and all ready for a bolt to thread into them right now, in your van. The bolts you buy at the hardware store need to be the same size and thread pitch as the latch pin, so just bring the latch pin to the hardware store and purchase matching bolts, and nuts which act as spacers and hold the bracket out. You also need a nut to hold the latch pin to the aluminum stock. I am recalling from memory, but I believe the forward most bolt hole is where the original latch pin is sitting in your GL right now.

To go the bracket route, I bought some aluminum stock from a hardware store, measured where the two holes in the factory van were, and drilled the stock to accept two bolts to thread into those holes.

Now, the carat latch pin set approximately 1" back from the original IIRC, but unfortunately I cannot give you that measurement because the brackets I made were for somebody elses van, otherwise I'd go out and measure it for you.

It is also important to note that with more work and some 90 degree bends the brackets could be made to work without having to trim the panels(again, trimming is minimal as is and not visible with the seat back and latched). The trimming is necessary because the bolt heads that hold in the bracket stick out, and rub against the plastic panels. The factory bracket is welded in and does not have these bolt heads sticking out.

The bracket does hold the seat in the same spot and function just as well as the original welded in bracket.

-Rob
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SteveVanB
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 6:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Carat rear seat is not as wide as the GL Z-Bed. The pins need to be set back and spaced for the Carat int. I think the pins are in the same spot for and aft in the GL just not as far apart?
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87vanagon
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I completely agree that having a Carat here would make this process a lot easier, but I don't have that luxury. I have the skills and tools to do some fabrication but I just need some measurements. I have done a bunch of research and know most of what I need to do, the parts I'm still not quit sure about is the exact position of the latch pins, the upper mounting of the paneling and the table. I know thats quite a bit but I'm in no hurry and will keep searching and asking question till I can get it right.
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Robw_z
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

87vanagon wrote:
the parts I'm still not quit sure about is the exact position of the latch pins, the upper mounting of the paneling and the table. I know thats quite a bit but I'm in no hurry and will keep searching and asking question till I can get it right.


The upper mounting of the panel uses a strip of thin steel which forms an upside-down u channel for the plastic panel to slip into. It is riveted onto the van, where the headliner material ends. When attaching the panel the top side is slipped into the channel first, and then you screw in the remaining fasteners. If you do not have this, you're gonna have to wing it. The steel strips are used in Westfalias as well to hold paneling, but the lengths are not correct, however they could still be utilized.

As far as the table, the first step is do you have all the bracketry? I can't recall how much measuring is needed, but there is riveting involved.

-Rob
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87vanagon
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the large bracket that creates the hinge, the bottom "L" brackets I have but the top support is missing. I figure with the table I can use the paneling as guide.

Thanks for all the help
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