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Type 877 Kommanduerwagen
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vwhelmot
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2016 1:42 am    Post subject: Re: Type 877 Kommanduerwagen Reply with quote

Stunning
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Magion
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2016 11:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 877 Kommanduerwagen Reply with quote

I thought you guys might enjoy this. Although its a Czech web no words needed for the pics
http://auto.idnes.cz/kdf-60l-cah-/auto_ojetiny.aspx?c=A151006_231247_auto_ojetiny_LHR
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D-train
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 11:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 877 Kommanduerwagen Reply with quote

Digging up an old thread but any progress on the 20yr build?

And who's goin to reproduce these?? Love to have something like this in Australia..
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Kapt. Q
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

anmilsurp wrote:
Found a picture of an original type 877 differential
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

from here
http://superbeetle.kaeferpiloten.de/bilder/index.p...amp;page=3

Nice picture, it's the Porsche museum in Gmund, this is displayed next to a complete one, this one is a total waste of parts in my opinion, finish it! Then use it!
It appears to be a different casting than my 166, it's missing the VW logo and the strengthening web ilooks different to.
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anmilsurp
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Found a picture of an original type 877 differential
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

from here
http://superbeetle.kaeferpiloten.de/bilder/index.p...amp;page=3
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Rich's 50
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crazy ^^^^^^
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Kapt. Q
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a picture of the 166 frame
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
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Kapt. Q
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, the counter bores in the flange are for rubber inserts that are part of the sealing gasket that, I think, may actually allow tiny movement , I'm not sure on this, I suppose that might relieves stress, takes some impact forces out. If you look at the above photo you will see two little holes for locating pins in the mating flange.
As for the 'thats why they made so few', nonsense, they made over 15,000 166's, the most mass produced amphibious car to date! They produced a few hundred of the 87/7's, production being limited due to time and materials I think.
I don't think there was any revision in this casting since the 128/166's introduction so I doubt there was any weakness, my casting has a 41 part#, not the date of manufacture, but design date, It is an original not a reproduction, not sure you can get a reproduction of the main part the differential goes in, you can get one of the front cover that connects to the axle beams, the part you can see with the six bolt heads in.
Don't forget that the suspension absorbs many loads, forces (whatever) before they ever get transmitted to the diff casing, etc.
The casing is iron/steel? and about 17kg, that's with out the side covers, another fair few kilo's there too.
OUB, you are right this is a 166 casing, in what ways are the 87/7 casing different? I know the speedometer cable comes out at 90 degrees instead of 180 but was unaware of any other difference, it would be intresting to know. The differences in the transfer box are very apparent in your photo's and I was unaware of them. How did you get the information and parts to make your 87/7 replica?


Last edited by Kapt. Q on Sat Jun 04, 2011 12:45 am; edited 4 times in total
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johnshenry Premium Member
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ninamashr wrote:


I agree there is allot of shear force along that flange. Did you notice the counter bores around each bolt hole? Maybe the tunnel flange has projections around each bolt hole that fit into these counter bores -or- there is a small sleeve that fits around each bolt and it's installed between the 2 flanges?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Can't see any projections in the tunnel pic, but it is not that detailed. That would be very plausible and make for a very good design.
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Ninamashr
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnshenry wrote:
Great pics!

I find it even more curious that there doesn't seem to be anything to support the shear force along the face of the flange. Unless the bolt bore clearances are very tight, the diff would want to slip upward on the flange when the beam is loaded. I don't think I see any kind of lip on the tunnel flange to support this.


I agree there is allot of shear force along that flange. Did you notice the counter bores around each bolt hole? Maybe the tunnel flange has projections around each bolt hole that fit into these counter bores -or- there is a small sleeve that fits around each bolt and it's installed between the 2 flanges?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the grey museum car you see a reinforcement on the underside of the floorpan. I think the setup is strong enough for the frontdiff. The house is bolted to the frame....On a normal beetle the head is welded on the tunnel. Not that big difference to me. The bolt holes are probably welded tubes trough the Napoleon hat on the frame.

Kapt , Is that a new cast front house?
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnshenry wrote:
Great pics!

I find it even more curious that there doesn't seem to be anything to support the shear force along the face of the flange. Unless the bolt bore clearances are very tight, the diff would want to slip upward on the flange when the beam is loaded. I don't think I see any kind of lip on the tunnel flange to support this.


Perhaps thats why so few were made? The design didn't hold up?

I look at that radial bolt pattern where the whole assembly attaches to the frame head and think it should be pretty strong. unlike the rear of the car, the front has very little weight. How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootise pop? The world may never know.

too bad I don't have one so I can do a little testing.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great pics!

I find it even more curious that there doesn't seem to be anything to support the shear force along the face of the flange. Unless the bolt bore clearances are very tight, the diff would want to slip upward on the flange when the beam is loaded. I don't think I see any kind of lip on the tunnel flange to support this.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

what material was used to cast the front diff and frame head? is it cast iron? steel? aluminum alloy? an approximative weight in kg?

thanks
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:03 am    Post subject: Re: Front differential Reply with quote

Because I don't know English plus use translator, so I think, that the symposium is about it whether is tunnel in front enough reinforced. I'm not sure, whether is that a rather reinforced but because these rolling stock be not doing in series so it is possible, that the in using come to some problems. It will catch sight of.
Photograph fore final drive housing are nice to, but this final drive housing is from type 166. Don't belong to on type 877. I I have on photographs this final drive housing, but this to the wagon will not come. Shall I original that the there belongs to.
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Kapt. Q
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 3:08 am    Post subject: Front differential Reply with quote

Heres my diff casing in the raw, it's very strong and heavy, what you see here is two pieces and you can clearly see how it attatches to the front beams/torsion tubes.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I doubt its weak where it attatches to the body because as you can see there are many bolts that attatch it the body and that area is reinforced and it is also attatched to the body via the front beams.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KäferKrieger wrote:
Okay, torque is a measurement so that equation wasn't trying to teach a physics lesson. And weight at ( a certain moment) in motion around an axis would have been a better way for me to put it in laymans.
But where is your axis ? Very Happy


Quote:
axial toque along the tunnel axis

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KäferKrieger
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, torque is a measurement so that equation wasn't trying to teach a physics lesson. And weight at ( a certain moment) in motion around an axis would have been a better way for me to put it in laymans.
But where is your axis ? Very Happy
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KäferKrieger wrote:
johnshenry wrote:
I would just think that bolt up area would be under some pretty hard stress (and axial toque along the tunnel axis) as the thing was driven off road.


I dunno John...

Weight+Motion=Torque and that car wasn't very heavy or fast. Wink


Uh no, weight plus motion = inertia.

Torque is a force acting on an object causes that object to rotate. Such as the the car hitting a big rut with one of the front wheels (even at a moderate speed) and it wanting to twist and rip that bolted flange of the framehead.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnshenry wrote:
I would just think that bolt up area would be under some pretty hard stress (and axial toque along the tunnel axis) as the thing was driven off road.


I dunno John...

Weight+Motion=Torque and that car wasn't very heavy or fast. Wink
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