Riviera Pop Top

[sdgenxr]

This past weekend we pulled the top off our 77 Riviera in order to replace the canvas and repair a crack in the fiber glass.

I've got the old frame and plywood completely removed and a new wooden frame with a nice birch panel in the works to install (pics coming soon). I figured that while I'm here, I'll recondition the aluminum cross members and replace the hardware with stainless steel.

One of the items that I cannot locate are new springs to replace the corroded stock ones, the other items are the rollers. I've found a really nice set of full stainless rollers at Country Homes Campers.com but they are on the pricey side when you consider that I'll need 6 of them. They also have a little write up on installing gas struts that I would like install as well. Has anyone removed the springs and installed just struts?

Another question I have is the general consensuses on adding an additional layer of fiber glass to the top. Overall it seems to be in good solid shape and holds its shape well, so I don't really see the need or additional cost. I figure with the installation of a new wooden frame, it will strengthen things up considerably.

[BusterBrown]

[sdgenxr]

Thanks for the links BB. Some good information over on those threads.

[MadMax78]

I'm looking forward to see your pictures of the refurbished frame and crossmembers.

I also have an ASI top and the idea of installing gas struts has been haunting me for a long time, never got around to doing it yet, though. If you find suitable struts I'd very much like to see pictures of them installed. The rivi roof can be a bit heavy when lifting the first inch or two.

Some time ago one of my poptop's rollers failed, I also came across the link you posted for new ones, but eventually got a couple of good used ones. They hold up pretty well and i still have some spares in case I need them. Replacing them only takes a minute.
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[redbus Steve]

Here is the write up I posted when I changed the springs on mine.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=417602&highlight=springs
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Steve
1970 Westy with a Riviera Top
1969 Beetle

"Her shaft is bent and the rear end leaks, you can fix her quick with an oily rag, use a nail to start her I lost the key. Don't pay any mind to that whirring sound. She uses a little oil but outside of that she's cherry." -- C.W. McCall

[sdgenxr]

Steve: what is the pull strength or weight of those springs? I want to call around to see if anyone makes a strut that will retract instead of extend with the proper pulling strength to lift the top.

As for the rollers, I've measured the track and have a lead on some bearings on eBay that I would like to use. My only hurdle is how to attach them with a flush or thin bolt so that it doesn't rub on the inside of the track.

Here's a bit of a teaser pic of the new frame and panel. It took some hunting down in my neck of the woods to be able to find matching 5x5 and 4x8 sheets of plywood. I ended up choosing a red birch that has lot's of nice growth rings that looks really nice with some polyurethane.

I still need to do a final sanding and poly coat to give it a nice shiny finish, but it's looking good so far.

Does anyone know where I can pick up some stainless steel hood latches to hold down the top? The only ones I can seem to find don't have the 90 degree bend in them so that both the latch and catch can be mounted on the same plane. Most of the latches that I've seen are for Jeeps and I don't think will work for this application.

[redbus Steve]

I don't know the strength of the springs. I bought several until I found some that worked well. The top is pretty easy to lift now, but doesn't take a herculean effort to close, either. The key is the thickness of the coils. Lowe's/Ace/True Value, etc sold several springs that were the correct length (visually exact) but not strong enough.

I have seen the exact hold downs that were originally used by Riviera new in a catalog from a local RV parts supplier. The only difference is now they are stainless or chrome instead of being painted. I believe they were $15 each. I don't have a catalog anymore, but I'll dig up the number for the RV place if you can't find them at one local to you.
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Steve
1970 Westy with a Riviera Top
1969 Beetle

"Her shaft is bent and the rear end leaks, you can fix her quick with an oily rag, use a nail to start her I lost the key. Don't pay any mind to that whirring sound. She uses a little oil but outside of that she's cherry." -- C.W. McCall

[Franklinstein]

Here is a post I put up about restoring the fiberglass on a Riviera.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=469731&highlight=

I am also interested in what you guys are doing about the spring issue. I replaced one with a home depot and it WORKS but that corner droops slightly still.
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1979 Riviera Poptop - 1.8L VW 93' Fox watercooled

Opinions are like A$$holes, everybody has one and yours all stink!!!

[sdgenxr]

Ok, it's been a bit hectic around the house this past week and slow on the bus work. This weekend provided me some time to get back to work on what's important. The BUS!! Today I got the wood frame installed back into the fiberglass top. Just need to add a couple of layers of glass to ensure there is a good bond between the frame and the top. I'm not sure how others have attached the top to the frame, but I used construction adhesive instead of fiberglass resin like the factory did.

As for using gas struts, the best way that I can think of is to use one that pulls instead of extends. These are called tension gas springs and from what I have found, a bit on the pricey side. Since Riviera's use two scissors to lift each side of the top, there isn't much room to install a strut that can extend and push on the scissor since the other one is right there. Hope I'm making sense. Basically, the way I was thinking about how this would work is to install a tension gas strut between the roller side of the scissor and the fixed point at each corner. This kind of strut would pull the roller closer to the fixed point and therefore extend the top. Like I said before, the only ones I could find are pretty pricey at about $100 a piece.

The other thing we need to figure out is how much does one of these tops weigh since this will help determine how much pressure a strut would need to exert on the scissor to lift the top without being too strong to make it hard to pull down.

I'm hoping someone might have another idea on how to use a gas strut that extends and installing in a different location as to push on the movable side of the scissor assembly. Unfortunately, since my top is off, I can't take a pic and photochop up an example of what I'm talking about. But it does provide me the opportunity to weigh my top, which will be a bit on the heavy side since I replaced all the wood framing with new plywood and a new plywood panel top.

[busdaddy]

10 years ago there was one of those old rowing machines on the side of the road somewhere almost weekly, they used pull shocks.

The push ones would work if you mounted them on a similar angle to the scissors between the bus and roof (separate from the scissors), they'd look like an X extended.
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[DougB]

Sorry to resurrect an old thread...just wondering if anyone ever determined the bearing number that would fit inside the aluminum track that the rollers travel within? I just bought an otherwise great Riviera top, but one set of the rollers is broken and I'd like to create a better version for all of the rollers. I know about the CHC rollers, but a full top = 10 sets of rollers and I don't relish spending $320 on CHC parts I can make myself.

If nobody knows the right ball bearing number, any chance someone knows the roller dimensions (in mm)?

Many thanks in advance!

- Doug
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'75 Campmobile (tin-top to SpaceRoof)
'73 Fastback
'52 BMW R67/2
'41 Zundapp KS600
'55 Puch SGS250
A very, very understanding wife

[sdgenxr]

I was able to find bearings that fit, but don't remember the size off the top of my head. However, the challenge I found was attaching the bearings without having anything on the inside to rub along the track. If you can figure that part out, then go for it!

I'll see if I can dig up the size bearings that I used.

[DougB]

I was thinking that I might use a countersunk screw (e.g. Allen head) with a head just larger than the inner diameter of the bearing. On the other side I'd use a stepped spacer with the step fitting inside the inner diameter of the bearing. So the screw head would hold the bearing in place and the step would keep it aligned. I have some brass stock and aluminum stock at home and a small Unimat lathe that works well for this kind of stuff.

The bearing number should be printed on the outside edge of the outer race, somewhere.

Thanks in advance!

- Doug
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'75 Campmobile (tin-top to SpaceRoof)
'73 Fastback
'52 BMW R67/2
'41 Zundapp KS600
'55 Puch SGS250
A very, very understanding wife

[sdgenxr]

Ah, digging through my eBay history showed that the size is a "626-ZZ Ball Bearing 6x19x6mm".

I'd like to see a picture of how you end up mounting the bearings as what you have in mind sounds interesting.

[DougB]

Will do (once I figure out the details myself Thanks for the info!

- Doug
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'75 Campmobile (tin-top to SpaceRoof)
'73 Fastback
'52 BMW R67/2
'41 Zundapp KS600
'55 Puch SGS250
A very, very understanding wife

[DougB]

The bearings arrived and I think they're the right size, maybe a tad shorter than what I expected but still right. I ordered the "2RS" spec with dual black rubber seals on the sized ("ZZ" means two metal shields which are not suite as water tight as the rubber seal...either one should work well, though). An M6 bolt/screw is the right size for the bearing's inner diameter.

Looking at the roller assembly I removed from the top I have, I can space out the bearings to the desired distance using an M6 nut. So here's my plan:

- I go through the bearing on one end with an M6 x 20mm countersunk Allen-head screw

- on the other side of the bearing I use an M6 lock washer, an M6 nut (Loctited on there), and another M6 lock washer to achieve the correct spacing (I'm working with the rear lower roller right now...that's the one that failed for me).

- screw the whole assembly into the roller plate, from which I've removed the rivets for the stock rollers and tapped those holes for M6x1.0 threads

So far my costs have been:
- Around $20 for twenty 626-2RS ball bearings (eBay)
- Around $19 for the stainless steel M6 countersunk screws, lock washers and nuts (eBay and Amazon)

I'll be replacing the rollers at the same time I'm cleaning the mildew from the intact, original canvas and painting the fiberglass top (using Rustoleum Topside Fiberglass paint from Amazon).

Hope this helps others in need of roller rejuvenation...pics to come when they're available!
_________________
'75 Campmobile (tin-top to SpaceRoof)
'73 Fastback
'52 BMW R67/2
'41 Zundapp KS600
'55 Puch SGS250
A very, very understanding wife

[danfromsyr]

ok looking for the 5yr update.

i'm going to R&R my top and rollers this fall.

how are they holding up after 5 years.
what was your final mounting plan.
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[DougB]

Response to the PM sent, but re: the roof I ended up going with a SpaceRoof and selling the ASI top and parts I had. The SpaceRoof came with a great set of instructions that I was able to follow well (and even enhance) and I'm now very comfortable with the outcome. Yes, I cut a big hole in a tin-top...but the roof looks like a Westy top, works like one, and gave us so much more camping capacity in a bus I'd already done so much work to that it just didn't make sense to "just find an existing pop-top Westy". This year alone we've had it to every state on the east coast of the US, and can not camp with up to 5 people and a dog (though it's usually just 4 and a dog).

- Doug
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'75 Campmobile (tin-top to SpaceRoof)
'73 Fastback
'52 BMW R67/2
'41 Zundapp KS600
'55 Puch SGS250
A very, very understanding wife