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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69809 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Posted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 4:23 pm Post subject: Front door handles, recesses, and mechanisms |
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Here is a breakdown.
This thread is now in the Bus FAQ. If anyone has any further input, feel free to add it.
There are two, well three kinds of icepick doors.
Barndoor:
3/55 through VIN 705 xxx, larger finger recess:
the 61-12/63 kind has an indent where the door handle base goes.
64-67: (there are variations in push button doors as well, but general idea)
the door mechanism is completely different from icepick to push button.
icepick door mechanism:
push button back part of door mechanism (one of two kinds):
The above mechanism is '67 only but those can be fitted to earlier doors by filing the door's opening down to accommodate it.
This is the rotary latch from introduction up to the '67 improvement.
The ice pick pull handle door mechanism for 55-60 is different than 61-early 1964:
Driver's side:
211 837 015A/B up to chassis # 705 619
(A is earlier version)
211 837 015C from chassis # 705 620 to 1 222 025
211 837 015F from chassis # 1 222 026
(D/E also used, F superceded them)
Passenger side:
211 837 016A/B up to chassis # 705 619
(A is earlier version)
211 837 016C from chassis # 705 620 to 1 222 025
211 837 016F from chassis # 1 222 026
(D/E also used, F superceded them)
The ice pick pull handle door handle base is also different 55-60 than 61-early 1964 due to the change from flat door to recessed front doors.
The left mechanism is different than the right, passenger locks from inside, drivers doesn't. You don't want to accidentally lock the bus from the inside on the drivers side, cause then you can't open it from the outside. It is important to use a driver side mechanism on the drivers side, though they will fit the other way.
Exterior handles:
Barndoors use various handles dependent on the year, this thread covers some details
55-early 1961 front door handles:
Driver's side: 211 837 205 B
Passenger side: 113 837 206
(There may be some variations, such as 205A instead of 205B, more information welcome)
Early 1961-mid-64:
Driver's side: 211 837 205 E/F
Passenger side: 211/221 837 206A
(There may be some variations, such as 205D or 205D/E instead of 205E/F, more information welcome)
Example:
211 837 205D:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=1281392
64-66:
Driver's side: 211 837 205 F/G
Passenger side: 211 837 205 F/G
67:
Driver's side: 211 837 205 K
Passenger side: 211 837 205 K
These handles are secured to the door by 2 M5x20 screws.
Inner Door Handles:
Early Buses, up to 16 Mar. 1960 VIN # 584674 used a chrome handle with a rib down the center as seen below.
Exception:
1959 Deluxes use the large chrome handles seen below as "60-65" Buses.
More photos:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_search.php?search_keywords=Ribbed+front+inner+door+handle
60-65 non-Deluxe Buses use a larger plastic door handle.
59-65 Deluxes were chrome.
Push-button front doors use an inner handle with a screw in the center.
Examples:
66-67 Buses use a small "flipper" front inner handle:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=860772
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=860771
The small flipper inner door handle was introduced at VIN 216 046 096 on Oct 19, 1965. Early 66s have the larger inner door handle
When the flipper was introduced, the doors got the door pull at the top.
The door pull takes up two of the spot that were used by the door clips, so an early 66 takes 21 door clips, and late 66 takes 19.
The door pull is attached with two screws that go into little metal bracket (speed clip?) that clips onto the door, as on this door
(This is a later 66 door on a Sept 65 built bus)
this door has the pressings for the clips, but is early 66 and never had the clips installed
If you are installing door pulls, put the metal speed clips in before you install the door panels.
IIRC, the earliest push button doors do not have the square pressings, though I am not sure when the pressings were introduced. They were introduced before the door handle change.
Thanks to Clara, EverettB, BarryL and others in this thread for the details. _________________ How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
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Last edited by EverettB on Mon Jun 25, 2018 9:06 am; edited 11 times in total |
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madcitymcflyer Samba Member
Joined: February 18, 2005 Posts: 134 Location: Madison, WI
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Posted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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Everett--
Could somebody show a photo/diagram of how the 66-67 door handle
interior reinforcement piece goes into the cab doors? When my Westy
was restored, the body shop neglected to reinstall them. I've never seen
a photo/diagram of how they go back in.. |
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DropgateLefty Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2011 Posts: 134 Location: Auburn, CA
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Posted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:16 am Post subject: |
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Thanks, Everett- this helped clear up some questions I had about my 59. Seems the PO reversed the handles (locking handle on pass side) because the lock cylinder was nice and frozen up. When I got the truck there was no way to lock the driver's door. Now I know I need a lock cylinder and need to swap 'em back to their rightful places. _________________ April '59 dove blue single cab, coast to coast run Dec 2011 -
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=488658&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
[o \/ o] |
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Snoop Bob Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2003 Posts: 2687 Location: Florida
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Posted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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ohana59single wrote: |
Thanks, Everett- this helped clear up some questions I had about my 59. Seems the PO reversed the handles (locking handle on pass side) because the lock cylinder was nice and frozen up. When I got the truck there was no way to lock the driver's door. Now I know I need a lock cylinder and need to swap 'em back to their rightful places. |
We can probably free up that cylinder. _________________
BarryL wrote: |
Put your lips onto the little tit with the hole in it inside and make a good seal. You can suck and blow but with a little resistance. It gets better after it's wet. |
EverettB wrote: |
I would be interested in knowing the sizes of the various shafts. |
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mjknight71 Samba Member
Joined: September 27, 2009 Posts: 12 Location: Weymouth UK
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Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:23 am Post subject: |
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A
couple of icepick handles
Recess(top)/non recess(bottom)
Non recess (left)/Recess (right)
Lock barrel on the non recess is slightly longer I think too, will try to post picture |
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splitscreendreammachine Samba Member
Joined: February 27, 2005 Posts: 145
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Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:47 am Post subject: |
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can anyone tell me what year these part numbers are for ?
211 837 016C , 211 837 016B
split door mechanisms apparently
thanks in advance |
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Jacco Verveer Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2010 Posts: 399
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Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:44 pm Post subject: |
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splitscreendreammachine wrote: |
can anyone tell me what year these part numbers are for ?
211 837 016C , 211 837 016B
split door mechanisms apparently
thanks in advance |
211 837 016B is non recess
3/55 through VIN 705 xxx
211 837 016C is recess
the 61-12/63
not sure if both are left or right |
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splitscreendreammachine Samba Member
Joined: February 27, 2005 Posts: 145
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Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 8:37 am Post subject: |
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thank you so much jacco
i managed to get a 211 837 015A today from a Vw meet
can anyone tell me what year that fits ?
It's a BUM part |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69809 Location: Phoenix Metro
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splitscreendreammachine Samba Member
Joined: February 27, 2005 Posts: 145
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Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 7:06 am Post subject: |
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Thanks Everett this page has helped me immensely |
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zuggbug Samba Member
Joined: June 17, 2008 Posts: 3479 Location: Anderson SC
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Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 7:06 am Post subject: |
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splitscreendreammachine wrote: |
thank you so much jacco
i managed to get a 211 837 015A today from a Vw meet
can anyone tell me what year that fits ?
It's a BUM part |
Let me know if you want to sell it, I am looking for an "A" or "B" _________________ SOUTHERN INTEGRITY AIRCOOLERS
58 15 window
56 westy |
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splitscreendreammachine Samba Member
Joined: February 27, 2005 Posts: 145
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Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 7:11 am Post subject: |
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Door mechanisms ?
Does it matter which one i use for a locking and non locking side ?
can i use a 'b' part for the drivers side ? bearing in mind i have a RHD bus
( zuggbug if i cannot get it to fit i'll be in touch ) |
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Lind Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000 Posts: 9915 Location: idaho
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Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 8:36 am Post subject: |
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splitscreendreammachine wrote: |
Door mechanisms ?
Does it matter which one i use for a locking and non locking side ?
can i use a 'b' part for the drivers side ? bearing in mind i have a RHD bus
( zuggbug if i cannot get it to fit i'll be in touch ) |
the two sides are different. both lock, but in different ways. you can tell which side it is by the parts number. generally it is odd for left hand side, and even for right hand side. the letter is a modification of a previous part number.
I would highly recommend to anyone trying to emulate a parts department, get a parts list and learn the VW parts numbering system. _________________ .
Wanted:
Idaho VW license plate frames or other dealership items.
VWoA literature and early dealership or distributor literature/pictures/information
. |
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Clara Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003 Posts: 12400
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Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 10:25 am Post subject: Re: Front door handles, recesses, and mechanisms |
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Yes, for the icepick doors you can put a drivers mechnism on the passenger side, and vise versa. They will fit in the doors.
But the left mechanism is different than the right. Passenger side locks from inside, drivers doesn't.
You don't want to accidentally lock the bus from the inside on the drivers side, cause then you can't open it from the outside.
(Push button doors are different from ice pick. Left mechanism is left, right is right) _________________ The Obsolete Air-Cooled Documentation Project http://oacdp.org/ |
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J Rad Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2003 Posts: 41
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Posted: Sun Dec 01, 2013 6:53 pm Post subject: door date codes |
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on a pair of '63 doors and a '67 door, I have noticed a date code stamped into the door in between the spot welds at the lower door hinge, but I could not find a similar date code stamp on the doors of my '58, '60, or '61. Were these date code stamps placed in some other spot on earlier doors, or were they there at all? These date codes were inside a circle much like the date code stamp on wheels. I haven't noticed if cargo doors or engine lids have a similar date stamping. |
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64+65doubledoor Samba Member
Joined: August 25, 2009 Posts: 165 Location: Bowral
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Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:08 am Post subject: |
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Nice info _________________ March 55 Wolfsburg bus
march 54 barndoor s.c
58 beetle |
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BarryL Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004 Posts: 14258 Location: Casa de Oro, California
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Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 9:43 am Post subject: Re: Front door handles, recesses, and mechanisms |
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Fwiw that ^^^^^ picture is '67 only but those can be fitted to earlier doors by filing the door's opening down to accommodate it.
This is the rotary latch from introduction up to the '67 improvement.
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Clara Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003 Posts: 12400
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Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 8:54 am Post subject: Re: Front door handles, recesses, and mechanisms |
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FWIW, the small flipper inner door handle was introduced at VIN 216 046 096 on Oct 19, 1965.
Early 66s have the larger inner door handle
When the flipper was introduced, the doors got the door pull at the top.
The door pull takes up two of the spot that were used by the door clips, so an early 66 takes 21 door clips, and late 66 takes 19.
The door pull is attached with two screws that go into little metal bracket (speed clip?) that clips onto the door, as on this door
(this is a later 66 door on a Sept 65 buildt bus)
this door has the pressings for the clips, but is early 66 and never had the clips installed
IIRC, the earliest push button doors do not have the square pressings, though I am not sure when the pressings were introduced. They were introduced before the door handle change.
If you are installing door pulls, put the metal speed clips in before you install the door panels.
_________________ The Obsolete Air-Cooled Documentation Project http://oacdp.org/ |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69809 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Big Bill Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2005 Posts: 1782 Location: Santa Rosa, Ca
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Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:44 am Post subject: |
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Yes a very good thread, never knew there where two ice pick handles(recessed and non). I have been looking for a recessed door for my 63, found a few but way too expensive. (800 for two bare doors, they were very nice) But I guess since they were produced for a shorter time they would be harder to find good ones. |
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