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Pedal Cluster Removal?
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Destructo
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 8:43 am    Post subject: Pedal Cluster Removal? Reply with quote

So I'm in the middle of my Auto to Manual transmission swap and I have everything transfered over to the new van, except for the clutch/brake pedal cluster. Here's an idea of where I'm at.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

btw, I stole this shot from ben, but this is exactly what I'm looking at now in my van.

The bentley doesn't do a great job at explaining how to remove these Items. I was hoping to remove the booster, master cylinders, resevoir and pedals all together. Is this possible? Any help is much appreciated. Once we figure this out, I'll take some pictures of the process.
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r39o
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unless you have the front windshield out, I do not think you can get all that stuff out at once.

If you lift it all out at once it will likely still drip. The fluid is nasty. Eats paint and stains carpet.

The booster is held in place with 4 nuts. Both masters are held in place with 2 fasteners each.

I would take it apart, but leave the pedals in place, if possible. Peddles are best done in a vise. Under the dash is not pleasant.
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Destructo
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So here is my plan then.

1. Remove Brake Master Cylinder with resevoir still connected.
2. Remove Booster
3. Remove Clutch Master Cylinder
4. Remove Pedal Cluster

So how hard is it to remove the pedal cluster? Am I going in from the top once the Booster is out of the way? Boy do I have some fun ahead of me this evening.
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D Clymer
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I saw your PM to me, but I'm really slammed today, so I thought I would just answer your question on here. It is possible to remove the pedal assembly with the booster and reservoir still attached. I just did this recently on my Subaru transmission conversion. I unbolted the brake master cylinder from the booster and left all the brake lines attached. The pedal assembly and booster can be pulled upwards to remove. You have to get things just right, but the pedals will fit between the crash member and the front of the van. The windshield does not have to be out of the van for this to work.

Let me know if I can answer any other questions.

David
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squeegee_boy Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Take the pedal pads off to buy yourself an extra couple of mm.

Robyn
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FrankenSubySyncro
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

X2 on not removing the windshield. I did this when converting to a syncro. Remove the booster and the pedal assembly comes out from the top, it took many tries to get it in the right position so it would come out. Twist and turn it till you hit the sweet spot.
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Syncroincity
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have a drip tray handy when you do this. I was rudely suprised by about a half quart of ancient brake fluid pouring out of the vacuum hose hole of the booster can... remove or shift the carpet before you start.

Two hyd lines on the brake cylinder, one down below on the clutch cylinder.

+1 on taking off the pedal pads, it does help.
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edgood1
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

on a somewhat related question.. can one remove/replace the brake master cylinder without the need to bleed the clutch? it seems possible if you just drain the reservoir and not the line going to the clutch master....
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Destructo
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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

edgood1 wrote:
on a somewhat related question.. can one remove/replace the brake master cylinder without the need to bleed the clutch? it seems possible if you just drain the reservoir and not the line going to the clutch master....


edgood, I'm going to say Yes on that. Turkey baster used to take out the fluid from the reservoir. Then just disconnect the braided rubber feed line to the clutch master and pinch the end off so it doesn't lose fluid. Swap out the brake master, reconnect the clutch master feed and refill the reservoir. Pinch the feed line a few times to get the air up into the reservoir. I think that should do it. Cool
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Destructo
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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, so that was way easier than I expected! Surprised

First I removed the two support bars that run across the whole assembly from the windshield to the steering column. These are the ones that the sheer bolts hold onto. This will make the two bolts under the booster easier to get at.
Then I took off the four 13mm bolts that surround the booster. Two up top and two below.
Next I disconnected the clutch feed line from the reservoir, the two hard lines connected to the brake master, the wiring connected to the brake master and finally the clutch master exit line.
After all that I just tilted the booster towards me and with a little twist here and there the whole thing came out!!
Thanks for the tip on taking off the pedal pads first, I can see now how they would hinder the process. I'll post a couple pictures later tonight for some visual stimuli.
Right now I'm a little vexed concerning the clutch master line. It looks as if I'm going to have to build a new one since the connections under the van are all corroded and keep me from bringing it up through the floor. I was thinking about having a hydraulic shop make me a line with flex hose, but that may be unnecessary.
So next up is getting this all into the other van and seeing if it works, but I think I'll post the results in my other post
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=502804&highlight=tale+westies
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Ahwahnee
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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't done this (but it's fascinating reading)... but if I had those pedals out & on the bench I would check for wear/slop where the clevis pins fit -- if the hole in the pedal arm is ovalled it can be welded and re-drilled for better action (and the clevis replaced of course).

More details + pics in this thread:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=500810&highlight=clevis
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Destructo
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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're right there with me Ahwahnee! Before this project started, I was feeling the clutch pedel flop around on me, ever so slightly. So I'm gonna check that clevis pin for sure. Cool
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Syncroincity
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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Time to grease it up too, my pedal axle was bone dry and getting polished. I flipped the axle over and drove the keeper pin thru to the other side.
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Destructo
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just because people like pictures...

Here's what I started with; dash out, cross members removed. You can see one of the 4 bolt holes above the booster that needs to be removed.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


In this one I'm pointing to one of the lower bolt holes under the booster. I had to use two extensions on my ratchet to get in there.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


After removing the fluid lines, booster vacuum line, and brake master wire connectors; all I had to do was tilt it away from the windshield and up and out!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here's the whole unit after removal

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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bryguth
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quick question... did you have to disassemble the peddle assembly/brake booster before it would come out of the van? I am having a hard time getting the unit out without taking it apart....
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Destructo
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope, no need to take it apart. Just remember to take off the pedal pads as they can get hung up. When I did this I remember I had to tilt it toward myself, lift the whole unit, twist/rock it back and forth, side to side, drop it back down a little and try again. the pedals just need to clear through the small opening. Keep at it and you'll get it. Cool
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bryguth
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 8:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Took a break and installed a new stainless RMW coolant exchange tower, then got back to the brake booster/peddle assembly....rock it that way, this way, pull, push and pop I got it out!!!! Thanks for the encouragement and technical support!!!!

Cheers
Bryan
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vanagon1991
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK...tbis is an old post but I have leaky clutch cylinder too and can't for sure find where the leak is coming from. i have the whole dash and heater blower off now anyways to replace motor. Might as well pull clutch/brake assembly and replace master cylinder. I need to add clutch spacer anyways because of smallcar conversion and its a pain to get too.

Thanks for the write up and pics. Not a mechanic but you gave me the confidence to do it.
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Destructo
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whoah!! Blast from the post past!! I forget that there was a time where I was neck deep in Vanagon projects. I'm happy this post still serves it's purpose as a helper for those neck deep in their own projects.
Good luck and post here if you have any more problems or questions regarding this procedure.
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vanagon1991
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks...will post update. I'm in spring grove IL!!
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