Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts  See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Engine number on starts with BZ...
Page: 1, 2  Next
Forum Index -> Beetle - Late Model/Super - 1968-up Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Lilyblue
Samba Member


Joined: January 01, 2012
Posts: 62
Location: NJ
Lilyblue is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:18 am    Post subject: Engine number on starts with BZ... Reply with quote

Hello, First time beetle owner here. I searched and couldn't find anything about the case numbers starting with 'BZ'. Is it brazilian? I just pulled the engine to put a clutch kit in it, main seal and oil cooler seals and such. Just wondering what the BZ means? Thanks
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Ducklips
Samba Member


Joined: December 21, 2011
Posts: 270
Location: S/E GA, USA
Ducklips is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you sure it isn't "B6"? What year is your car?
_________________
Early 1973 Super sedan. 1641 cc (o\_!_/o)

I once won an argument with a women......in this dream I had.
The older I get, the better I used to be.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Lilyblue
Samba Member


Joined: January 01, 2012
Posts: 62
Location: NJ
Lilyblue is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's BZ for sure. The stamping is clean and doesn't look to be altered. It's a 74 standard.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
zombiebug
Samba Member


Joined: August 18, 2011
Posts: 1222
Location: Webster, MA
zombiebug is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know lettering on the block should be either AH or AK. Could it be a replacement block? My replacement has a AD which shows it was a replacement block from the VW factory. But other replacement blocks are out there. who knows their correct lettering.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Ducklips
Samba Member


Joined: December 21, 2011
Posts: 270
Location: S/E GA, USA
Ducklips is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep, Probably a Brazil clone.
_________________
Early 1973 Super sedan. 1641 cc (o\_!_/o)

I once won an argument with a women......in this dream I had.
The older I get, the better I used to be.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Lilyblue
Samba Member


Joined: January 01, 2012
Posts: 62
Location: NJ
Lilyblue is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool, thanks for the replies.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djkeev
Samba Member


Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 21385
Location: North West New Jersey
djkeev is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ducklips wrote:
Yep, Probably a Brazil clone.


Can you please tell us what you base this comment upon? Books, reference work, published material of any kind or is this off of the top of the head thinking?? Maybe it's a Tell the guy what he wants to hear thought pattern?

Dave
_________________
I HATE PHOTOBUCKET!!!!!!

Karmann Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

86 Vanagon Westy "Weekender" 2.1 Auto
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Ducklips
Samba Member


Joined: December 21, 2011
Posts: 270
Location: S/E GA, USA
Ducklips is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

djkeev wrote:
Ducklips wrote:
Yep, Probably a Brazil clone.


Can you please tell us what you base this comment upon? Books, reference work, published material of any kind or is this off of the top of the head thinking?? Maybe it's a Tell the guy what he wants to hear thought pattern?

Dave

Only in the depths of my own psyche. A guess. I suppose it may come from looking at the subject "BZ", and then looking at the name BraZil. Also Brazil has been known to be a country that has made VWs, VW parts, etc. What's the answer?
_________________
Early 1973 Super sedan. 1641 cc (o\_!_/o)

I once won an argument with a women......in this dream I had.
The older I get, the better I used to be.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
ashman40
Samba Member


Joined: February 16, 2007
Posts: 10733
Location: North Florida
ashman40 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are there any other markings on the side of the case? Below the pushrod tubes.
_________________
AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle {project car that never made it to the road Sad }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Lilyblue
Samba Member


Joined: January 01, 2012
Posts: 62
Location: NJ
Lilyblue is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, there are. I didn't see them right away with the 'tins' covering the pushrod tubes. Its a as21 Brazilian. I feel kinda embarassed for not seeing that but since i pulled the engine it was sitting on a piece of carpet on the garage floor(after I removed it from the jack). I guess the bz6xxxxx number under the alt stand is pretty much unimportant at this point, right? Either way, thanks for the replies.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djkeev
Samba Member


Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 21385
Location: North West New Jersey
djkeev is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ducklips wrote:
djkeev wrote:
Ducklips wrote:
Yep, Probably a Brazil clone.


Can you please tell us what you base this comment upon? Books, reference work, published material of any kind or is this off of the top of the head thinking?? Maybe it's a Tell the guy what he wants to hear thought pattern?

Dave

Only in the depths of my own psyche. A guess. I suppose it may come from looking at the subject "BZ", and then looking at the name BraZil. Also Brazil has been known to be a country that has made VWs, VW parts, etc. What's the answer?


I don't know what the BZ means nor do any of books in my small mountain of VW books give a clue.

Not knowing a verifiable answer I chose to remain silent rather than put forth a guess or a gut feeling that could be interpreted as fact. I only spoke up when a definitive answer appeared with no reference or hard back up information was attached to the answer. I was genuinely interested in what reference exists that I'm unaware of.
Using the BZ = BraZil logic, wouldn't Mexican engines be stamped MX or all German engines stamped DE ??

Besides, the proper two letter designation for Brazil is BR,
BZ is Belize.

It would help greatly if the PO posted a photo of this stamping. That alone could rule out it being a factory stamping or the work of some "johnny's VW garage" personal numbering system on his own rebuilds.

Dave
_________________
I HATE PHOTOBUCKET!!!!!!

Karmann Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

86 Vanagon Westy "Weekender" 2.1 Auto
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Lilyblue
Samba Member


Joined: January 01, 2012
Posts: 62
Location: NJ
Lilyblue is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Ducklips
Samba Member


Joined: December 21, 2011
Posts: 270
Location: S/E GA, USA
Ducklips is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lilyblue wrote:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

The only thing close to answering your question is that it maybe some type of code for an "exchange case, or replacement engine".
Information from a 5/73 USA service bulletin issued 5/73:
Engines with the re-manufactured symbol, a letter, a number and ending with X, indicates a VW Exchange engine. Before Oct., 1968 the X was not stamped onto the block.

From April of 1972 Shortblocks were sold with the VW remanufacture symbol followed by a letter. No numbers were used, you were to stamp in the old engine number.
There is a German mechanic that worked for my family for many years that may know for sure. If I can get in touch with him I'll try to find out and get back with you.
_________________
Early 1973 Super sedan. 1641 cc (o\_!_/o)

I once won an argument with a women......in this dream I had.
The older I get, the better I used to be.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djkeev
Samba Member


Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 21385
Location: North West New Jersey
djkeev is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lilyblue wrote:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


That's a very original looking number stamping. The shape of the numbers and the straightness of stamping. It will be interesting to follow this and see if others in other areas have encountered a BZ case before.

Thanks for posting this!

Dave
_________________
I HATE PHOTOBUCKET!!!!!!

Karmann Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

86 Vanagon Westy "Weekender" 2.1 Auto
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Lilyblue
Samba Member


Joined: January 01, 2012
Posts: 62
Location: NJ
Lilyblue is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, i thought the stamping looked clean enough to be 'original'. I also read about an 'X' indicating a replacement case or something. Either way I appreciate the help so far and I'm interested in finding out if anyone else has a BZ code. In the meantime I'm going to replace the clutch kit after I get the glazed flywheel turned down(or whatever the proper term is, lol). Then i might see about reindexing the rear torsion bars to correct the sag. Considering i just bought my first air cooled vw about a month ago I sure have enough to keep me busy!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Gary
Person of Interest


Joined: November 01, 2002
Posts: 16972
Location: 127.0.0.1
Gary is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lilyblue wrote:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Since there is no VW stamped near the number I would hazard a guess that it was a blank case and someone stamped that code (ie, dealership).
_________________
West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624 (1943)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djkeev
Samba Member


Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 21385
Location: North West New Jersey
djkeev is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, it's been bugging me that this BZ engine looks so nice and with factory stamping! I've been home sick and have logged a significant amount of time trying to find the answer. Trouble is, our view of VW is so limited, we mainly look at ACVW's from a point of view as Americans that they all came from Germany until the end and then they came from Mexico.
Truth be told, they've come from around the globe and finding information about product in other countries is difficult at best!

I stumbled upon this post on this site.... http://justacarguy.blogspot.com/2011/05/vw-engines-identification-info.html

"VW engines identification info
REMOVED FROM MANUAL: TECHNICAL DATA FOR SERVICES IN THE WORKSHOP - VW OF BRAZIL - 1979 EDITION

POSTED BY THE END OF THE TOPIC Ednei:

GAS-Gasoline / Alcohol-ALC

BA - 1600 - BRASILIA (1976)
BD - 1600 BEETLE GAS
BG - 1600 GAS AND KOMBI KOMBI EXP
BJ - 1300 BEETLE GAS
BK - 1300 LAC BEETLE BRASILIA
BM - 1300 LAC GOL
BN - BRAZIL GAS 1600
BV - 1600 GAS VARIANT
BX - 1600 LAC KOMBI KOMBI EXP
BY - 1300 GOL GAS
BZ - 1600 GAS VAN
UF - 1600 BEETLE GAS
UG - 1600 GAS VAN
UJ - 1600 LAC BEETLE
UK - 1600 LAC VAN

Motors above 90

UFA - 1600 BEETLE GAS
UJA - 1600 LAC BEETLE
UGA - 1600 GAS VAN CARAT

This info was pulled from, and only a small part of engine id post at http://carrosehistorias.blogspot.com/2010/08/numeracao-de-motor-boxer.html"

This linked into this site (it's in Portuguese) .... http://carrosehistorias.blogspot.com/2010/08/numeracao-de-motor-boxer.html

and as much as it pains me to post this considering a previous off the cuff remark about the BZ code being Brazilian, it seems that if this information can be trusted there is a PILE of Brazilian engine codes that to date, I've known NOTHING about!!

In particular.... the BZ engine asked about....

"TIPO: 2 - 1600
LETRA: BZ (1)
FABRICAÇÃO: DESDE OUT/75
CILINDRADA: 1584CC
TAXA DE COMPRESSÃO:7,2 "

So My guess is that this is a Genuine original VW engine made at one of VW's facilities, in Brazil.
I'm not bothered it is Brazilian at all...... (damned lucky guess) I am THRILLED to be able to verify that it is by using quotes, and posting their sources. I can only assume this this is somewhat reliable information from VW lovers in that part of the world.

I'd still love to find some verifiable printed material on this but I'll accept this information as valid until proven other wise.

It's interesting the links they have to other clubs, Chevrolet, Ferrari, Puma, Simca among others.
Some of the articles are interesting such as VW almost pulling out of Brazil in 2007 but today are planning to invest Billions of dollars (2010- 2014) to modernize and produce a million vehicles per year (I'm Assuming worldwide??)

Anyway, it seems that we have a factory Brazilian engine out of a Van here folks! How it made its way here to my State of New Jersey is anyones guess!! Wink

Dave
_________________
I HATE PHOTOBUCKET!!!!!!

Karmann Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

86 Vanagon Westy "Weekender" 2.1 Auto
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Gary
Person of Interest


Joined: November 01, 2002
Posts: 16972
Location: 127.0.0.1
Gary is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

djkeev wrote:
Well, it's been bugging me that this BZ engine looks so nice and with factory stamping! I've been home sick and have logged a significant amount of time trying to find the answer. Trouble is, our view of VW is so limited, we mainly look at ACVW's from a point of view as Americans that they all came from Germany until the end and then they came from Mexico.
Truth be told, they've come from around the globe and finding information about product in other countries is difficult at best!

I stumbled upon this post on this site.... http://justacarguy.blogspot.com/2011/05/vw-engines-identification-info.html

"VW engines identification info
REMOVED FROM MANUAL: TECHNICAL DATA FOR SERVICES IN THE WORKSHOP - VW OF BRAZIL - 1979 EDITION

POSTED BY THE END OF THE TOPIC Ednei:

GAS-Gasoline / Alcohol-ALC

BA - 1600 - BRASILIA (1976)
BD - 1600 BEETLE GAS
BG - 1600 GAS AND KOMBI KOMBI EXP
BJ - 1300 BEETLE GAS
BK - 1300 LAC BEETLE BRASILIA
BM - 1300 LAC GOL
BN - BRAZIL GAS 1600
BV - 1600 GAS VARIANT
BX - 1600 LAC KOMBI KOMBI EXP
BY - 1300 GOL GAS
BZ - 1600 GAS VAN
UF - 1600 BEETLE GAS
UG - 1600 GAS VAN
UJ - 1600 LAC BEETLE
UK - 1600 LAC VAN

Motors above 90

UFA - 1600 BEETLE GAS
UJA - 1600 LAC BEETLE
UGA - 1600 GAS VAN CARAT

This info was pulled from, and only a small part of engine id post at http://carrosehistorias.blogspot.com/2010/08/numeracao-de-motor-boxer.html"

This linked into this site (it's in Portuguese) .... http://carrosehistorias.blogspot.com/2010/08/numeracao-de-motor-boxer.html

and as much as it pains me to post this considering a previous off the cuff remark about the BZ code being Brazilian, it seems that if this information can be trusted there is a PILE of Brazilian engine codes that to date, I've known NOTHING about!!

In particular.... the BZ engine asked about....

"TIPO: 2 - 1600
LETRA: BZ (1)
FABRICAÇÃO: DESDE OUT/75
CILINDRADA: 1584CC
TAXA DE COMPRESSÃO:7,2 "

So My guess is that this is a Genuine original VW engine made at one of VW's facilities, in Brazil.
I'm not bothered it is Brazilian at all...... (damned lucky guess) I am THRILLED to be able to verify that it is by using quotes, and posting their sources. I can only assume this this is somewhat reliable information from VW lovers in that part of the world.

I'd still love to find some verifiable printed material on this but I'll accept this information as valid until proven other wise.

It's interesting the links they have to other clubs, Chevrolet, Ferrari, Puma, Simca among others.
Some of the articles are interesting such as VW almost pulling out of Brazil in 2007 but today are planning to invest Billions of dollars (2010- 2014) to modernize and produce a million vehicles per year (I'm Assuming worldwide??)


I found something similar but didn't dig that deep. One of the pages I found broke down the letter codes so that, when assembled, the "B" stated it was for the Van and "Z" indicated Gasoline Engine. The "BZ" theory meaning BraZil was beyond ludicrous considering the correct spelling for the country in Portuguese is Brasil.


Quote:


Anyway, it seems that we have a factory Brazilian engine out of a Van here folks! How it made its way here is anyones guess!! Wink

Dave


That's not too difficult to deduce considering Brazil was a supplier of parts for quite some time after production ceased in Germany. No doubt it came from dealer inventory or even an aftermarket company that bought its inventory from Brazil.
_________________
West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624 (1943)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Ducklips
Samba Member


Joined: December 21, 2011
Posts: 270
Location: S/E GA, USA
Ducklips is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good job on finding the info. It's good to know. I remember the last time I bought VW parts-in the early 80s, everything seemed to be from Brazil.
_________________
Early 1973 Super sedan. 1641 cc (o\_!_/o)

I once won an argument with a women......in this dream I had.
The older I get, the better I used to be.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djkeev
Samba Member


Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 21385
Location: North West New Jersey
djkeev is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ducklips wrote:
Good job on finding the info. It's good to know. I remember the last time I bought VW parts-in the early 80s, everything seemed to be from Brazil.


Thanks, it wasn't easy or quick!!
Really the only thing I don't fully understand is the date of the engine. It has "FABRICAÇÃO: DESDE OUT/75 "
I think this mean "from 1975" ??? My Portuguese is weak!

Dave
_________________
I HATE PHOTOBUCKET!!!!!!

Karmann Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

86 Vanagon Westy "Weekender" 2.1 Auto
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Beetle - Late Model/Super - 1968-up All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2018, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB