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Removing A/C from 1989 Vanagon Westfalia
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All Tiied up
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2015 8:25 pm    Post subject: Removing A/C from 1989 Vanagon Westfalia Reply with quote

Hi,

I am removing the A/C and would like to know what electrics and parts would be needed to take off in order to be considered a complete system in order to offer it up for sale.

Thanks
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Howesight
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Remove:
1. Condenser;
2. Receiver drier (for fitment of new hoses)
3. 3-speed rad fan resistor;
4. Evaporator, together with blower housing, integral blower fan resistors housing, drain hoses;
5. Ambient temp sensor(on the D-pillar);
6. Thermostat/fan speed switches and bezel;
7. All wiring on the left side D-pillar, which includes a relay holder, fuses, relays, etc.
8. All hoses, intact, even if they leak. This allows the person to have new hoses made.
9. Compressor, compressor bracket, wire harness to compressor.

Oh, forgot to mention that I'll pay $100 for this Wink
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BIG JUDGEMENTAL ERROR.
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Paulbeard
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was thinking of the same thing but it was suggested I consider someone else wanting A/C at a later date and leaving in place for later resale.

I'm not sure the $1000 or so it would cost to rehab the factory air wouldn't buy something better. Comfort was low on the list of design considerations, from what I can tell.

I'm having a hard time seeing how this answers the OP's question:
Terry Kay wrote:
BIG JUDGEMENTAL ERROR.


He knows where he lives and whether he needs A/C or not.
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Git 'r DONE!
dhaavers
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I need a Rolls Royce Station Wagon, & I don't have one, and I know what I want.
Doesn't mean it makes any sense.

Foolish acts of scabary are performed here every day--don't make it right.
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tjet
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2015 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe he or she is parting it out?
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All Tiied up
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 9:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The idea is to replace with a unit that is small enough and low enough power consumption so it can be powered by 110v, either at the camp site or through an inverter running from the axillary battery (I am currently looking at some flexible PV panels from the marine / boat industry to stick to the roof of the Westy).

This would enable use for when parked up with not having to run the engine.

Removing the system properly is important, so it can be re-fitted either back into the van or provide enough for it to be a kit for someone else.
Nothing will be 'ripped out'.
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dhaavers
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fill the entire floor of the cargo area with batteries and you might be able
to run a small AC unit for maybe 2 hours, tops.

Sorry - this idea is a tail-chaser. Good luck.

Sad
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kourt
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 110v/inverter idea won't work satisfactorily.

I removed my Westy AC components, sold them for $500 and installed a SmallCar AC system in the dash.

If you want cold air while sitting in camp, you have four choices:

1. run your engine and your van's OE AC system
2. run a generator and a window AC unit sealed to the front passenger window
3. get a block of ice and a DC fan
4. camp in 40 degree ambient air

You'll never have enough battery power to run a 110v AC system on an inverter for any reasonable length of time... the energy demand is stacked too high against you. Forget about that idea.

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All Tiied up
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This adventure for searching for a suitable replacement only started yesterday.

I now understand an inverter needs power for itself, and the larger the inverter the more power it takes, on top of which the consumption of the unit being powered.
The 110v AC units do not come small enough and uses too much power, so I have started to look at RV / marine and custom installations working off 12v DC, which can run off the axillary battery.

Here is an example of what I am looking at..

http://www.cruisencomfortusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/cnc-invisible-air.pdf

If anyone has experienced anything similar please share.

Thank you
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Howesight
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having lived in Southern Ontario for years before moving to BC, I know that Ontario summers are hot and humid. However, the ideas you have mentioned for 12V powered AC will not work due to the very high draw of air conditioning equipment.

If you sleep on the lower bunk, there are devices that hold the hatch back ajar for air circulation, but keep out unwanted entry (people or bears).

If you sleep on the upper bunk get a three-window tent. Nothing cools better than a three-sided breeze.

Finally, using one or two 12V fans makes a huge difference.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What you don't realize is that your going to have to use nothing less than 5000 btu's to keep than van cold.

Marine units operate two ways ;
Water cooled, or air cooled units.
They are powered off of shore power, or a generator.

A 12 volt unit will not have nowhere near the output, or capacity to cool down your van, and keep it that way for any extended time.
You'd have to have a trailer load of batteries to maintain any notable comfort level.

This subject has been covered too many times to count, and with the space limitations of a VW vanagon westfalia, your back to a portable or window unit powered by 110 volts.

It just isn't going to work as your thinking.

Been there, seen it, tried it ,and it just is physically impossible.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh,I forgot.

There is one possible way to get a built in AC unit.

Get ahold of Sportsmoble.
Ask them about their Starcool unit.
It's built in, and you still are lacking the space to squeeze it into your VW.
And it runs off of a pole, or generator.

No 12 volts.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd love to see more info/specs on the system before passing any judgment. It looks very interesting.

http://www.cruisencomfortusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/cnc-invisible-air.pdf
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From their website: Power consumption: 30 - 46 [email protected] VDC (5000-7000BTU model)

My aux battery (22 a/h) would be flat in less than 30 minutes IF it could provide the surge at startup.

Granted, you could have more battery reserve than I do, but then plan on one Group 41 battery for
each 1/2-hour you plan to run off the grid...(with 48 batteries, you run out of power in 24 hours)... Embarassed
$100 for each battery, plus the cost of the trailer...??? Wink

And how fast can your solar put 46 amps back into your battery to keep up? You'll need an acre array
to fold out of another trailer...not very reasonable, I'm afraid...

Sorry to bear the bad news... <shrug>

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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All Tiied up
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Terry Kay for your passionate responses.

What would you suggest as a viable alternative to the original?
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All Tiied up
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The solar panel project is only there for topping up the axillary battery whilst on the move and parked up (if the van roof is tilted facing the sun) not for the supply of current needed by the draw of the AC unit.


I do enjoy how passionate you have been so far, thank you.

Somewhere there will be a good cost effective answer (apart from just rolling the windows down Cool )

I have had a look through some of the other threads regarding air conditioning, what has been the best adaption / conversion for you and could you post the link please.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

>>What would you suggest as a viable alternative to the original?<<

Your going to have to decide when you want AC the most.
While your driving or when your parked.

It just depends on your priorities, when you want to feel like a bowl of melting jello the most.

While your at the wheel, or when your napping.
Two different systems, two different times to be uncomfortable.

I'm covered on in both scenarios, I despise driving feeling like my crotch is melting, I really hate waking up gasping for air.

Your call on this one.
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PDXWesty
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dhaavers wrote:
From their website: Power consumption: 30 - 46 [email protected] VDC (5000-7000BTU model)


My assumption is that it could be viable while driving, and also when powered by a converter when connected to shore power, just like any modern RV. It would never be viable in a stand alone 12v mode run from batteries.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 19, 2015 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most 5000 btu units require 30 amps to start, require 15 amps continuous.

15 amps full time is one heck of a load.

I guess my question would be is how long could the alternator run at this continuous loss, and still provide power to the rest of the accessories, plus keep the batteries fully topped off, plus keep the engine running?

Big deficit.
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