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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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 Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:15 pm Post subject: Vanagon Gas to 1.6 Turbo Diesel Conversion |
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I have used TheSamba for a lot of information in the past and I thought I would give back by posting about my 86 Turbo Diesel Vanagon Conversion.
The van was purchased from Ludwig from here on TheSamba (Thanks again for a great van)
The van started life with the 2.1 gas engine. I drove the van for about 3 months then the engine developed a rod knock and I decided an engine conversion was needed.
I purchased a German Vanagon 1.6 turbo diesel from the VWdiesel king
The diesel engine bolted to the automatic transmission with the help of the KEP adapter and a few minor modifications.
The engine was installed in a few hours. The wiring harness, with glowplug relay that came with the engine plugged in to the stock Vanagon wiring. I wired the glowplug light to be the OXY light on the dash. A high torque starter was needed to turn the diesel engine. I used a IMI 101N High Torque Starter.
Link
Link
Link
Some people have had a bad experience with VWdieselking http://www.qualitygermanautoparts.com/
but this engine has been great.
I did have to rebuild the turbo (mostly my fault because the wastgate was stuck shut and I kept boosting up to 20+ psi. It did make for a fast van but the turbo was not up to that high of boost levels and started to leak oil through the turbo) The first turbo rebuild shop, a shop that is recommended on some diesel forums, did a very poor job and the turbo lasted less than 100 miles. Northeastdiesel in Springfiled MO on the other hand did a great job of rebuilding the turbo and it has been trouble free for over 6000 miles. I also replaced the oil pump when the second rebuild turbo was installed to make sure that this was not the issue with the short life of the first rebuild but the original pump was in great shape and so was the engine. I did have one other issue with the engine and that was one of the injectors was cross threaded in the head and leaking compression. I removed the injector, cleaned up the threads and carefully reinstalled the injector and all was fine.
Here is a list of some details about the van and what I have done to it:
Replaced the front brakes and calipers, replaced the brake lines, replaced the rear brake shoes
New larger oil cooler
Replaced power steering lines with hydraulic hose
Installed boost gauge and EGT gauge pre-turbo
Tachometer operating off of the w terminal of the alternator using the stock tach rewired with the help of a post on vwdiesel.net
http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=6477.0
Power steering bracket from Groschi a great German seller here on thesamba
The van has good power (very similar to the 2.1 gas) and is very comfortable to drive at 50 to 55 mph. Interstate speeds of 65 to 70 mph are in the upper rpm range, around 3800 to 4000 rpm. EGT max at 1300F and max boost (with blow off valve blocked and wastegate adjusted) about 16 psi max. Fuel mileage is around 24 to 26mpg
The automatic/Diesel combination is very nice, the turbo spools up quickly and the automatic just holds at about 3000 rpm up through the gears.
This picture shows driving on level ground at 65mph 3600 rpm boost is 9 psi and the EGT is 825F
This is full throttle up an incline 65 mph 3800 rpm, boost is 16 psi EGT is 1200F
I hope you have enjoyed the pictures and this helps some other van owners
More pictures are located at my Picasa page
https://picasaweb.google.com/116740220905306898456/Vanagon16TurboDieselConversion
Last edited by kendalwoolf on Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:59 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:56 pm Post subject: Re: Vanagon Gas to 1.6 Turbo Diesel Conversion |
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_________________
Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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airsweden
Samba Member
Joined: June 17, 2011
Posts: 119
Location: Honolulu
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| Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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_________________
1982 1.6 NA Diesel Westy
1982 AHU MTDi CHC
1984 1.9 WBX Westy
1985 1.9 WBX Westy
1986 2.1 WBX Syncro Westy |
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purplepeopleeater
Samba Member
Joined: July 23, 2005
Posts: 3117
Location: E. Washington
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| Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Very nice, why did you get the 1.6 and not the AAZ he sells for a little more? I am looking at both of these. |
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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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| Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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purplepeopleeater,
The 1.6td was a plug and play unit with the oil pan, intake, all the motor mounts and wiring on it. Also the price was lower. If the van was a diesel to start with and I had the conversion pieces already I would have looked closer at the AAZ.
Check out this post for some discussion on the subject, U.S. Diesel common sense: 1.6TD vs 1.9TD? http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2...highlight=
_________________
-Kendal-
71 VW Super Beetle, 74 VW Bus, 85 Jetta GLI, 89 Whitestar
86 Vanagon, 1.6TD http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=499268
86 Vanagon, 1.8 Digifant http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=513537
"but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal." Matthew 6:20 |
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Syncroincity
Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2007
Posts: 1557
Location: New York City
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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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AndyBees
Samba Member
Joined: January 31, 2008
Posts: 2332
Location: Southeast Kentucky
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 6:58 pm Post subject: 1.6 Turbo engine |
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Wow! This is a nice project. Very good work too! I'm impressed with the auto tranny doing so well!
Amazingly, you are only about an hour's drive south of me.
Here is a link to my TDI transplant into an '84 Vanagon!
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=276798
I have a 1.6 turbo engine and most of the goodies to install it in a Vanagon. When I get the TDI project finished I may look into doing a project similar to yours!
_________________
'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003. |
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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:08 pm Post subject: Van Trips |
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Here are some pictures from the Vanagon trips. The Vanagon has been on the road as a Diesel for 3 and a half years.
The first long trip was from Athens Ohio to Cleveland Ohio.
The Van made the trip fine, but a few days after the trip the turbo started using a lot of oil (20+ lbs of boost on the interstate was too much), so it was rebuilt.
Also installed the EGT gauge (pre turbo) to keep an eye on the temperature.
[/img]
_________________
-Kendal-
71 VW Super Beetle, 74 VW Bus, 85 Jetta GLI, 89 Whitestar
86 Vanagon, 1.6TD http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=499268
86 Vanagon, 1.8 Digifant http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=513537
"but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal." Matthew 6:20 |
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Alan F
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Joined: March 30, 2004
Posts: 179
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| Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 3:46 am Post subject: |
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| Is it truly "plug and play"? Did the engine carrier bars etc come with the motor? What about exhaust etc? Looks like it did in pics. Is the wiring harness really just a "plug in" to existing? So KEP adapter instead of traditional diesel bellhousing bolts right up (to automatic)? What "slight modifications" were needed? Did you have to buy "diesel king's" conversion kit ("non-synchro" version on his website I notice - $695). Seems like a no brainer if it's as simple as that. What am I missing here? Total cost around $1700-2300 plus labor? A decent WBX is more. This sounds to good to be True? No? |
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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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| Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Alan F wrote: |
| Is it truly "plug and play"? Did the engine carrier bars etc come with the motor? What about exhaust etc? Looks like it did in pics. Is the wiring harness really just a "plug in" to existing? |
My engine came ready to bolt in (to a standard transmission that is). Compete with the carrier bars, coolant lines, air cleaner, exhaust (but the muffler was rusted out so I replaced it), etc... The wiring that came with the engine included the glow plug relay circuit and replaced the stock plug box in the back of the van and the signal/power plug plugged directly in.
I did have a hard time getting the power steering hooked up. I used original Vanagon Diesel brackets from Germany but making brackets could also work.
Also you have to find a Diesel filter mount, and some other small engine conversion parts, like coolant bracket and throttle cable. But if you have good mechanical skills and some tools it is quite easy.
| Quote: |
| So KEP adapter instead of traditional diesel bellhousing bolts right up (to automatic)? What "slight modifications" were needed? |
No removable bellhousing on the automatic so to mount in the stock position you have to use an adapter plate. The modifications that are made to the automatic bellhousing to attach the KEP adapter plate mainly involves grinding and drilling of a taped hole on the bellhousing to take a through bolt. A small angle grinder works great for this. I believe the instructions on where to grind come with the adapter plate and flexplate from KEP.
| Quote: |
| Did you have to buy "diesel king's" conversion kit ("non-synchro" version on his website I notice - $695). Seems like a no brainer if it's as simple as that. What am I missing here? Total cost around $1700-2300 plus labor? A decent WBX is more. This sounds to good to be True? No? |
Like I said above no need for the kit it all came on the engine because I bought the 1.6 turbo from a Vanagon.
*NOTE* Not all of the Vanagon turbo diesel engines that "diesel king" (quality german autoparts) sells are as complete as the one I bought. I would recommend contacting them to determine exactly what will come on the engine. I know some may be missing the coolant bottle, air cleaner and wiring may be cut not unplugged. And keep in mind these are used engines so some maintenance may be needed, Like the turbo rebuild and exhaust I had to do.
I find it to be a good conversion that has similar power to the waterboxer. As with any conversion I had some issues to work out but once those were sorted out it has been very reliable.
The diesel may hold you back on interstate cruising but that is not what I use this van for, it is mainly a short trip van and great around town in stop and go traffic.
_________________
-Kendal-
71 VW Super Beetle, 74 VW Bus, 85 Jetta GLI, 89 Whitestar
86 Vanagon, 1.6TD http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=499268
86 Vanagon, 1.8 Digifant http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=513537
"but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal." Matthew 6:20 |
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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:33 pm Post subject: Vanagon Trip to Grandfather Mountain NC |
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Diesel Vanagon made the trip to Grandfather Mountain NC
The Vanagon made the trip up the hills with no problems.
Also made a stop by the Sandblast Rally
No Volkswagens but a few Audi quattros
_________________
-Kendal-
71 VW Super Beetle, 74 VW Bus, 85 Jetta GLI, 89 Whitestar
86 Vanagon, 1.6TD http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=499268
86 Vanagon, 1.8 Digifant http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=513537
"but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal." Matthew 6:20 |
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volkswagatron
Samba Member
Joined: January 26, 2008
Posts: 215
Location: French Creek ,WV
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 7:35 am Post subject: |
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| i am looking at an 82 vanagon right down the road its diesel...i wanted to put this engine in my 86 syncro since the 2.1 is blown up.....your thread is very helpful in what im thinking but has anyone out there done that yet i was wondering what the syncro bell housing is like compared to the deisel..im getting the whole 82 so i will have everything |
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MarkWard
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Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 17155
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 9:41 am Post subject: |
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The Vanagon diesel bellhousing should be interchangable between the diesel transmisson and the 4 speed air cooled, the 4 and 5 speed 2wd wbx, and the syncro transmission. If you have the diesel bellhousing, no need for an adapter plate. As stated, only the automatic has the bellhousing cast into the case and is not removable. This will lay the engine over at around 50 degrees.
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danfromsyr
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Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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you will need to either change the Syncro fuel tank or the Diesel bellhousing/starter for a KEP adapter.
the Vanagon Diesel starter interfers with Gas Syncro fuel tanks.
you should be able to sell the Diesel Bellhousing/starter/flywheel/clutch for near the KEP adapter pricing. then it's a bolt in situation.
*you would need the 83 Diesel engine carrier bars or modify your 82 units to accomodate the engine position in a syncro vs stock 82 diesel.(trans length is differant)
the Naturally aspirated Diesel will be a DEAD PIG in a Syncro, the Diesels had special gearing in the Trans to accomodate the 48hp.
it's only if you go 1.6TD or greater that you'll get any sort of driveability out of a Diesel Syncro conversion.. most go 1.9TDI with Mods.. but you can get a 1.6TD moded for more h, but possibly less reliability.. (ymmv)
| volkswagatron wrote: |
| i am looking at an 82 vanagon right down the road its diesel...i wanted to put this engine in my 86 syncro since the 2.1 is blown up.....your thread is very helpful in what im thinking but has anyone out there done that yet i was wondering what the syncro bell housing is like compared to the deisel..im getting the whole 82 so i will have everything |
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AndyBees
Samba Member
Joined: January 31, 2008
Posts: 2332
Location: Southeast Kentucky
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| Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 6:44 pm Post subject: Intercooler |
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Have you considered installing an Intercooler? I'm guessing an Intercooler would improve performance a little.
Great project!
_________________
'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003. |
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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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| Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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| volkswagatron wrote: |
| i am looking at an 82 vanagon right down the road its diesel...i wanted to put this engine in my 86 syncro since the 2.1 is blown up.....your thread is very helpful in what im thinking but has anyone out there done that yet i was wondering what the syncro bell housing is like compared to the deisel..im getting the whole 82 so i will have everything |
I am glad that this was helpful. I believe the previous posts answer your questions, I am not a syncro expert.
_________________
-Kendal-
71 VW Super Beetle, 74 VW Bus, 85 Jetta GLI, 89 Whitestar
86 Vanagon, 1.6TD http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=499268
86 Vanagon, 1.8 Digifant http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=513537
"but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal." Matthew 6:20 |
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kendalwoolf
Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Fayette, MO
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| Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 8:44 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler |
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| AndyBees wrote: |
Have you considered installing an Intercooler? I'm guessing an Intercooler would improve performance a little.
Great project! |
I have thought about it but it is always a space issue in the engine compartment and finding a new air filter.
All my intake is stock Vanagon Turbo Diesel and fits very well in the van. May do it some day but not now.
_________________
-Kendal-
71 VW Super Beetle, 74 VW Bus, 85 Jetta GLI, 89 Whitestar
86 Vanagon, 1.6TD http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=499268
86 Vanagon, 1.8 Digifant http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=513537
"but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal." Matthew 6:20 |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 10:34 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler |
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| AndyBees wrote: |
Have you considered installing an Intercooler? I'm guessing an Intercooler would improve performance a little.
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If by improving performance, you mean helping to reduce EGTs, then yes. But, unless you're increasing the fueling, the intercooler doesn't really add much power by itself. I think it would be fun to tweak a 1.6TD, which shouldn't be too difficult. I'd definitely add a pyrometer, no matter what you're planning on doing to the engine.
_________________
Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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