Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts New!  See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics)
Page: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Forum Index -> Vanagon Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Ronzo_volvo_guy
Samba Member


Joined: December 31, 2015
Posts: 76
Location: Connecticut
Ronzo_volvo_guy is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Feb 13, 2021 9:44 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Guys;

If Sodo took that picture, it would seem to me that a can of spray lithium or white grease, equipped with a snoozle should be able to get it there even better than Sodo's fat, greasy finger (with apologies to Sodo about the fat, greasy finger remark!).

...and regarding which is better...oil or grease...dry and under high bearing force is the killer...ANY lube is an improvement! ...notably NOT including WD, which sucks as a lube (unless of course you'd like to have to reapply it in a week!) Apologies for that remark also, but I absolutely stand by it!

Cheers
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
Sodo
Samba Member


Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 6400
Location: Western WA
Sodo is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:54 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

If you can get some help from someone who understands this pic, and has small hands....its more likely.
I tested this finger-packing pivot lube method Ēon the benchĒ with an extracted clutch/brake pedal cluster. Packing the clevis with grease then wiggling it appeared to suck the grease into the clevis joint. I took a video but YouTube hates me so canít post it easily. Anyway it seems possible to get grease in there without removing the clutch pedal.

============= From other thread: ==========
How to make clutch disengage higher up?


Sodo wrote:
vanis13 wrote:
Eventually I'll check the clevis pin but some posts with 200+K mile vans with perfect pins could mean mine is just fine.


1/4" is nothing, you don't need to do anything.
But to ensure it stops wearing.....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


If you get back in there, maybe remove your master cylnder bolts etc for a little wiggle room and and pack grease into the clevis pivot.
You can just barely get a finger up there.
If you get any grease in there the wear will stop, and you won't have to deal with it for a long time.
Maybe around year 2050. Wink

_________________


EJ25, Peloquin diff, locker, transaxle oil cooler/filtration system
....KTMs, GasGas, and a Stumpjumper
Gear oil is like underwear.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Nuthin2It Premium Member
Samba Member


Joined: December 31, 2011
Posts: 252
Location: Marietta, GA
Nuthin2It is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2021 5:31 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

I have wondered about this for a while: Will grease work its way into the pivot or, short of disassembling it to apply grease, is it more effective to use oil?
_________________
1985 1.9L Westfalia
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Sodo
Samba Member


Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 6400
Location: Western WA
Sodo is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

I bet youíre right about cable operation.
Dang, now I feel like I callously obscurred a relic of my vanís classic roots.Wink

Quote:
Putting a bronze bushing in there to massively increase the bearing area is a sweet upgrade, but please don't forget to lube that also...I know bronze is self-lubricating, and "Oilite" bushings are even impregnated, and said not to need oiling, but a drop of lube


It seems that the factory let some vans go out ďdryĒ.
If it was greased at the factory, the pins last 30 years with no wear.

Putting in a bronze bushing is obviously a good method to restore an ovalized hole, but if you lube the danged thing now youíre gonna have to wait 60 years to note zero wear.
_________________


EJ25, Peloquin diff, locker, transaxle oil cooler/filtration system
....KTMs, GasGas, and a Stumpjumper
Gear oil is like underwear.


Last edited by Sodo on Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:21 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Ronzo_volvo_guy
Samba Member


Joined: December 31, 2015
Posts: 76
Location: Connecticut
Ronzo_volvo_guy is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:34 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Forum;

I realize this is an older thread, but I read the entire thing with interest and couldn't resist making a couple of comments:

1. Periodic service might not call for it, but if that pivot wears after many miles of service, it clearly would benefit from a dab of grease or drop of oil for lubrication. Putting a bronze bushing in there to massively increase the bearing area is a sweet upgrade, but please don't forget to lube that also...I know bronze is self-lubricating, and "Oilite" bushings are even impregnated, and said not to need oiling, but a drop of lube in this heavily loaded bearing spot will never hurt! As a newby here, now that I know about it, you can bet I'll be lubing ours!

2. Regarding the unused pivot on the other side of the Pedal pivot...if the Westy configuration is to PUSH a rod into the Clutch Slave Cyl, I must ask...were there any configurations of this chassis or even other VW/Audi platforms, where that pedal was fitted, but a clutch cable was used, because on the other side of the pedal pivot, it would obviously be a PULL action...I know from vintage Volvos, they went from hydraulically actuated clutches, to cable actuated in '67, so the pedal config also had to change.

Cheers
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
T3TRIS
Samba Member


Joined: October 30, 2017
Posts: 230
Location: Portland, OR
T3TRIS is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Sodo wrote:
I see you have an adapter plate, so some of this pic doesn't apply to your van
But the pic shows cutting off that un-used appendage that makes it much more difficult to reassemble.

So you will be ready for "van season 2020"?
I'm working hard too.
I won't get any of the aesthetics done, but I've been under the van for a week now. Wink
Tomorrow it comes down off the ramps and I get up on the roof for #vanlife poses (working on 'solar' next).


I'm not sure which adapter plate you're talking about. That photo showing the tab is just a stock GoWesty clutch pedal photo.

Yeah, whenever that 2020 season stars! We've finally been able to use our van and actually experience what the (semi) 4WD feels like. No problem driving in relatively soft sand for instance, fun!! Feels like we've tackled the the very main issues, hopefully everything left will be somewhat easier. Solar is far down the line for us! Good to hear you're making progress too.
_________________
Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Sodo
Samba Member


Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 6400
Location: Western WA
Sodo is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I see you have an adapter plate, so some of this pic doesn't apply to your van
But the pic shows cutting off that un-used appendage that makes it much more difficult to reassemble.

This pic is from a thread about removing the pedal to modify the leverage ratio to match a Golf slave cylinder that's used in the Smallcar bellhousing.
Smallcar bellhousing clutch options

So you will be ready for "van season 2020"?
I'm working hard too.
I won't get any of the aesthetics done, but I've been under the van for a week now. Wink
Tomorrow it comes down off the ramps and I get up on the roof for #vanlife poses (working on 'solar' next).
_________________


EJ25, Peloquin diff, locker, transaxle oil cooler/filtration system
....KTMs, GasGas, and a Stumpjumper
Gear oil is like underwear.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
T3TRIS
Samba Member


Joined: October 30, 2017
Posts: 230
Location: Portland, OR
T3TRIS is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Sodo wrote:
Cut that un-used tab off the other side and it will be easier to reassemble.
I wonder what that tab is for?


Are you talking about this tab? Opposite of where the pin slides?

I guess it definitely isn't connected to anything, maybe that pedal just fits in different vehicles.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Sodo
Samba Member


Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 6400
Location: Western WA
Sodo is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Quote:
Thanks for the input. I'm sure it'll take me much longer to get that thing back in!


Cut that un-used tab off the other side and it will be easier to reassemble.
I wonder what that tab is for?
_________________


EJ25, Peloquin diff, locker, transaxle oil cooler/filtration system
....KTMs, GasGas, and a Stumpjumper
Gear oil is like underwear.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
T3TRIS
Samba Member


Joined: October 30, 2017
Posts: 230
Location: Portland, OR
T3TRIS is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Sodo wrote:
You did not show a pic of the pin, was it worn?

You don't have to do anything to that clutch pedal hole, it's perfect.
Bend that rod back to straight, grease the clevis and re-assemble.
Should be good for another 30 years....


The pin is slightly worn. I measured it at about 7.6mm in diameter. The hole is 8.6mm on the longest side so there's about 1mm of play. It's not nearly as bad as the other photos shared here, but might as well fix it right while it's out.

I'll definitely grease everything per your recommendations!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


MarkWard wrote:
2nd gear grinding is probably not the clutch. A clutch problem would be more noticeable trying to shift into first or reverse from a dead stop. Clutch pedal in a half hour sounds very ambitious. Maybe after the 10th one. For that rod to bend, something had to have been hung most likely at the clutch end where the hydraulics dead headed and something had to give. Could have happened many moons ago.


Thanks for the input. I'm sure it'll take me much longer to get that thing back in!
_________________
Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Sodo
Samba Member


Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 6400
Location: Western WA
Sodo is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

sodo wrote:
My 1990 was greased from the factory and had no wear at all in that clevis/pin joint.
It was like new, at 199k miles, the grease lasted 30 years
I suspect the problem was..... that for some years, they were assembled DRY by VW.
You WILL be greasing it this time, thus the wear will stop where it is.
Set your calendar to re-grease it in year 2050.


You did not show a pic of the pin, was it worn?

You don't have to do anything to that clutch pedal hole, it's perfect.
Bend that rod back to straight, grease the clevis and re-assemble.
Should be good for another 30 years....
_________________


EJ25, Peloquin diff, locker, transaxle oil cooler/filtration system
....KTMs, GasGas, and a Stumpjumper
Gear oil is like underwear.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
MarkWard
Samba Member


Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 14120
Location: Palm Beach County, Florida
MarkWard is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

2nd gear grinding is probably not the clutch. A clutch problem would be more noticeable trying to shift into first or reverse from a dead stop. Clutch pedal in a half hour sounds very ambitious. Maybe after the 10th one. For that rod to bend, something had to have been hung most likely at the clutch end where the hydraulics dead headed and something had to give. Could have happened many moons ago.
_________________
1982 Vanagon Camper with ALH TDI.
1990 Vanagon Camper Syncro.
In Car https://youtu.be/5hbfdUJR88Q
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
T3TRIS
Samba Member


Joined: October 30, 2017
Posts: 230
Location: Portland, OR
T3TRIS is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Dang I wish I had read through this entire thread before getting my hands all bloodied! Once I saw the first post saying "you can remove the clutch pedal without taking the dash out," I found the first instructions and ran with it. If it serves anyone tackling this, make sure you browse through this thread to find the info that people have gathered, don't use JUST the first instructions you find.

Anyhow, there was some play in our pedal (feels like about 1/2" to 3/4" at the pad) and a mechanic told us that it could contribute to some grinding in our newly rebuilt syncro transaxle (which has happened a couple times, especially in second gear). He mentioned that our clutch might not disengage fully, creating potential issues.

I got the pedal out and can still count to 10 (the sheet metal in there is not always forgiving when your prybar/screwdriver slips and your thumb drags along the rough edges... gloves darn it!). The hole doesn't seem that bad actually, neither does the pin though the hole is definitely slightly oval and the pin is also a wee bit grooved. I have replacement parts on order from Van Cafe. I bought the bushing solution.

I wonder if I even need to weld the hole shut, or if I could just drill the whole bigger to fit the bushing, any suggestion?

I'm pretty sure that if I just drill this bigger for the bushing, the hole will be centered in the oval shape and not the original location. Given the geometry, I imagine it means that the clutch pedal pad might sit about 1/2" higher than stock, meaning I could have a 1/2" more of travel. Our clutch pedal has always stopped on the van's floor, I wouldn't want to be able to push the clutch in so far that I slowly damage the master cylinder.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


One thing I did notice, is that the piece that pushes into the clutch master cylinder was bent. I have no clue how that happened (I certainly didn't force anything to the point that the pin would bend). I'll have to straighten that.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


On the plus part, I finally found why our horn hasn't been working. It had nothing to do with the horn itself nor the contact ring after all. It looks like the ground wire terminal at the bottom of the steering column had just disintegrated and was flopping around. Silver-lining to contorting yourself and having your face smashed into the pedals I guess!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Ahwahnee
Samba Member


Joined: June 05, 2010
Posts: 9069
Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
Ahwahnee is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Well I got the pedal out😅 Reply with quote

My 84 showed no sign of wear on either the pedal or the pin when I had it apart around 250,000 miles. Probably greased initially and then I squirted some sticky lube in the general direction every Olympiad or so.

Sodo wrote:
...Everyone should CHECK the slop in your clutch pedal because a pedal that wears thru will leave you stranded...


Not quite stranded - you can start and drive without a clutch and shift thru all gears. It is a skill worth learning against the day when you will need it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
strawman
Samba Member


Joined: August 23, 2007
Posts: 86

strawman is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 5:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Thanks Sodo for your reply.
Youíre right every thing measures out at 5/16Ē. I bought a new pin and have decided to drill the hole out larger and press a brass bushing in. Iím looking forward to a nice quiet clutch pedal👍.
Thanks
Dan
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Selsk
Samba Member


Joined: January 17, 2015
Posts: 101
Location: LA
Selsk is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 3:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Oh man this thread gave me flashbacks. Thanks again to iceracer for his original post. I remember when I started having clutch issues I went to 3 different shops and they ALL REFUSED THE JOB. All were "well known VW Shops". One guy that was the local "vanagon master" told me how insanely difficult to do the job and that you had to cut a whole in the body near the headlight in order to get to the problem. Then thesamba came to my rescue. I ordered the Gowesty refurbished pedal and took my seat off. About an hour or so later I emerged victorious.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Sodo
Samba Member


Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 6400
Location: Western WA
Sodo is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 10:52 am    Post subject: Re: Well I got the pedal out😅 Reply with quote

sodo wrote:
My 1990 was greased from the factory and had no wear at all in that clevis/pin joint.
It was like new, at 199k miles, the grease lasted 30 years
I suspect the problem was..... that for some years, they were assembled DRY by VW.
You WILL be greasing it this time, thus the wear will stop where it is.
Set your calendar to re-grease it in year 2050.


You did not show a pic of the pin, was it worn?

You don't have to do anything to that clutch pedal hole, it's perfect.
Bend that rod back to straight, grease the clevis and re-assemble.
Check it again in 2050.
_________________


EJ25, Peloquin diff, locker, transaxle oil cooler/filtration system
....KTMs, GasGas, and a Stumpjumper
Gear oil is like underwear.


Last edited by Sodo on Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:47 pm; edited 3 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
jimf909 Premium Member
Samba Member


Joined: April 03, 2014
Posts: 5074
Location: Seattle
jimf909 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 11:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Sodo wrote:


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.





Goodness. Nighttime. A pile of tools collected but not returned. Gravel pushed up, away and into the earth. Clevis pins unpinned.

The struggle in pictures.
_________________
Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.

Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
strawman
Samba Member


Joined: August 23, 2007
Posts: 86

strawman is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:50 pm    Post subject: Well I got the pedal out😅 Reply with quote

First off, many thanks to all the people whoíve posted regarding this subject. I looked at this project last winter when my van was in storage. Couldnít see how I could do it from below so shelved the idea.

So another winter, vans in storage so itís time. Decided to take dash off which was really easy. Glad I did as I found two broken heater cables.

Wow was the large pin a bear to push back. I donít think there was a drop of grease on it. This might have been where most of my squeaking was coming from. You guys have covered so much but I thought Iíd better add my two bits in case it can help the next person.

Removed clip, easy. Used large screwdriver to leverage against van body and pushed pin back 1/2Ē. Then I got a 7Ē spike with a large head and bent it at 90 degrees leaving about 3/4Ē between the head and the back of the 90. Putting this in against the pin allowed me to use my large screwdriver and leverage against the back of the 90. Ended up bending three more spikes to different lengths before the pin was back far enough. And I had to pry really hard. So obviously lots of grease will be used when I reinstall. There was no grease whatsoever the clevis or pin.

As you can see the hole in the pedal is worn so Iím looking for advice on how to fix it. I have a welder friend who is also a blacksmith and heís willing to do the work for me. Do I just get him to fill the hole with weld then drill a new hole? Iíve measured the clevis holes at a hair under 5/16th. So should the pedal hole be drilled slightly larger and how critical is it that gets drilled in exactly the same place?

Iím thinking, run a 5/16th drill through the clevis to clean it up then maybe a 11/32th hole in the pedal part. Your thoughts are much appreciated.
Thanks
Dan




Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Sodo
Samba Member


Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 6400
Location: Western WA
Sodo is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2019 7:08 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics) Reply with quote

Leo, best wishes that it cooperates.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Raising the van helped a lot cuz I worked from the outside, standing on the ground. I almost wore the driveway gravel thru to the dirt.
Raising the van higher would be better.
And that's the pile of tools that ensued for this "simple" task.

If you have to re-adjust the clutch, here's a post from CessnaJon: Clutch master cylinder clevis adjustment

I turned the adjuster two turns, that was too much.
Out came the pedal and one turn was better.
Then I used the slop in the master cyl mounting holes to get it right.
Then later I found CessnaJon's post which makes sense.
_________________


EJ25, Peloquin diff, locker, transaxle oil cooler/filtration system
....KTMs, GasGas, and a Stumpjumper
Gear oil is like underwear.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Vanagon All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Page 1 of 6

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2020, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB