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consvws
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2009
Posts: 949
Location: Roseburg, OR
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 Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:31 am Post subject: Nov/54 engine |
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Found out this old November, 54 engine was the replacement for my 58 beetle i just picked up. The oil that came out looked new, but as of right now it won't turn over. Too bad it's missing the stock dist. & carb. Hope to get it running & possibly run it in my 58?
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valentinesr
Samba Member
Joined: June 30, 2008
Posts: 749
Location: Ontario, California
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EverettB 
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69798
Location: Phoenix Metro
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consvws
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2009
Posts: 949
Location: Roseburg, OR
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| Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:19 am Post subject: |
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| Yeah, the dist. was missing & first thing is to get that rusty drive gear out & cleaned up. I haven't forced it or tried prying on the flywheel at all. Will tear it down & likely just rebuild it. |
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6371
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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If you do try to remove the drive gear withour a complete overhaul you will have better luck removing the fuel pump and its push rod first.
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1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018
1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc
1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse |
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Motorhead55
Samba Member
Joined: August 22, 2007
Posts: 468
Location: California U.S.A.
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| Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| EverettB wrote: |
Won't turn over meaning it's frozen?
Note:
I've seen people post that you should not rotate the engine with the distributor out as the distributor gears might move or go crooked. |
Everett is right. The dist drive can push up and tear up the soft brass helical gear on the crank.
Probably why the oil is clean is because the engine has sat so long that all the dirt and sludge in the oil is at the bottom of the case. My $.02 is NOT to take something apart until you are READY to rebuild it. Stuff gets lost, broken,bent ect.
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consvws
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2009
Posts: 949
Location: Roseburg, OR
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 3:38 pm Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine date castings different? |
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Well, this engine got tucked away for the last 5 years or so, and just recently i pulled it out along with some other cases i'm cleaning up to start building.
I started looking at the date castings, and noticed that this engine has to different sets of numbers
#3 and #4 side
#1 and #2 side
Is this weird, or normal? I thought maybe the case halves were mixed up somehow, but clearly they have been together a long time, and the casting date on the 3-4 side lines right up with being a nov, 54 |
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EverettB
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consvws
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2009
Posts: 949
Location: Roseburg, OR
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 5:10 pm Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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ok, so my question is, the 3-4 side is
(25) (10) (04) which would be 25th of Oct. '54
the 1-2 side is
(14) (10) (28 ) which would be the 14th of Oct. '58
or do they switch the day & year for the other half of the case? |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24729
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:12 pm Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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Pull the sump plate, and not just the drain plug. Doubtful oil was changed after last run. Old dirty oil will drop out the dirt when the engine sits still long enough. Bottom of the case and sump plate could be covered with up to a half inch of crud.
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Last edited by Eric&Barb on Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:52 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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sotos
Samba Member
Joined: November 15, 2014
Posts: 71
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:53 pm Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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| consvws wrote: |
ok, so my question is, the 3-4 side is
(25) (10) (04) which would be 25th of Oct. '54
the 1-2 side is
(14) (10) (28 ) which would be the 14th of Oct. '58
or do they switch the day & year for the other half of the case? |
The third "two digit" number that contains the year is based on the theory that the first digit is the shift of the factory : 1 ,2 or 3 .
So on your 3-4 side there shouldn't be a (04) but (14),(24) or (34).
Also it seems very unlikely side 1-2 and side 3-4 to be four years apart, at least if originally assembled at the factory.
There is a matching (at least to my experience) number stamped behind flywheel on the upper side of the engine where the two halves meet.
I don't know what this number counts but it seems it indicates the pairing of the two halves of the engine .
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Beetle 1.3 1966
New beetle 1.6 2003
Last edited by sotos on Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:58 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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txoval
Samba Member
Joined: January 23, 2004
Posts: 3553
Location: The Woodlands, TX
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:57 pm Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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| Nice find...one day I will look for a Nov. 54 case for my Nov. 54 car. My case is dated January 1960 |
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EverettB
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69798
Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:31 pm Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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| sotos wrote: |
| consvws wrote: |
ok, so my question is, the 3-4 side is
(25) (10) (04) which would be 25th of Oct. '54
the 1-2 side is
(14) (10) (28 ) which would be the 14th of Oct. '58
or do they switch the day & year for the other half of the case? |
The third "two digit" number that contains the year is based on the theory that the first digit is the shift of the factory : 1 ,2 or 3 .
So on your 3-4 side there shouldn't be a (04) but (14),(24) or (34).
Also it seems very unlikely side 1-2 and side 3-4 to be four years apart, at least if originally assembled at the factory.
There is a matching (at least to my experience) number stamped behind flywheel on the upper side of the engine where the two halves meet.
I don't know what this number counts but it seems it indicates the pairing of the two halves of the engine . |
I think the 04 might be 34 - that is what it looks like to me in the photo.
25 10 34
and
14 10 28
These should be read as
25th day of 10th month, 3rd shift, 1954
and
28th day of 10th month, 1st shift, 1954
And yes, they are reversed side to side.
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consvws
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2009
Posts: 949
Location: Roseburg, OR
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| Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:37 am Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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| EverettB wrote: |
| And yes, they are reversed side to side. |
That was the crux, now this all makes sense. Thanks for the info. |
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nlorntson
Crazy VW Lady
Joined: March 13, 2004
Posts: 3783
Location: Twin Cities, MN
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| Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:34 pm Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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| EverettB wrote: |
| And yes, they are reversed side to side. |
What???
You read them left to right (day) (month) (shift, year)
What do you mean reversed? |
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EverettB
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69798
Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 11:03 pm Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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| nlorntson wrote: |
| EverettB wrote: |
| And yes, they are reversed side to side. |
What???
You read them left to right (day) (month) (shift, year)
What do you mean reversed? |
I agree but I can't see how he has a '58 case half in this instance so I think there is something else going on here like they screwed up on the stamping.
OP - Do these #s below match?
| Quote: |
There is a matching (at least to my experience) number stamped behind flywheel on the upper side of the engine where the two halves meet.
I don't know what this number counts but it seems it indicates the pairing of the two halves of the engine . |
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janerick3
Samba Member
Joined: June 04, 2006
Posts: 1879
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:14 am Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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Check the part numbers under the pushrod ports - Nov 54 was during the transition period to 3x3 part numbers. If the left half has an old-series part number, you're in luck; if not, check to see if the 2-3 digit numbers stamped on each case half match.
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consvws
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2009
Posts: 949
Location: Roseburg, OR
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:05 am Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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i just scraped some crud away right above the flywheel & confirmed that these case halves are a pair. The numbers had me all mixed up there for a minute. Thanks for all the info. on this though, i really appreciate it!
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6371
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:11 am Post subject: Re: Nov/54 engine |
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If you are looking for date correct replacement parts you would be searching for a very early VJU 4 BR 8 distributor. They are hard to come by. The early ones did not have the unused oil port cast into them. They have a round vent screen and the vacuum canister has the vacuum nipple that is separated from the diaphragm housing. It should look like this:
disregard the badge number the rest is the same
not this:
_________________
Roads Scholar &
1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018
1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc
1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse |
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