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Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan?
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Zephyr_shreds
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Hey mark. I wouldn’t egg him. Just felt like I got fucked in the ass for paying 200$ and it not being done right. I couldve wired it how he wired it in 5 minutes. I put on the new gas radiator with the bigger fan motor. That’s why I was wondering about the resistor, and why the mechanic didnt put it in.
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Zephyr_shreds
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Mark thanks for helping me too. I really appreciate it. sorry for being squirrel
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 7:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Zephyr_shreds wrote:
Hey mark. I wouldn’t egg him. Just felt like I got fucked in the ass for paying 200$ and it not being done right. I couldve wired it how he wired it in 5 minutes. I put on the new gas radiator with the bigger fan motor. That’s why I was wondering about the resistor, and why the mechanic didnt put it in.


Did you ask how much it would cost to bring it back to original spec?

Also, I'll give you $200 bucks if you wire the van as he did it in less than 5 minutes (incl. R&R the bits, diagnosing and repair).

Sorry you're feeling badly about the exchange. Some mechanics and Vanagon owners are jerks. Some are awesome. Sometimes it takes some learning to become acquainted with each other.

Not sure about all the details but you are belittling the mechanic by saying that you could do the work in 5 minutes. The $200 charge may be his way of saying "Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out the door".

These are delicate relationships between owners and techs.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.

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E1
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 8:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

My recommendation is to gather your thoughts and go see the mechanic.

Tell him exactly how you feel, and why, and your budget limitations, and what you might do together now to have both speeds working. They really both should and it doesn't sound certain he took advantage of you.

It may well be to your long-term benefit to have him as a future resource, too.

Our first van never had a high-speed fan function, and never overheated in five years and 58,000 miles. I never realized it until our second van went into high-speed -- and it shocked me!
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 8:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

To the original question, I can hear my Low Speed Fan, doesn’t run excessively either . The only time I got worried was this Summer in dead stop traffic on Lake Shore Drive, heading into town. That day, it ran more often than I ever heard it before , but never went into High Speed.
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Zephyr_shreds
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 9:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Mechanic is cool. I’ll let him become vw god like you guys. He’ll eventually become familiar and be a good resource for the city. And ok. No problem. But give me like 25 minutes realistically I’ll wire it how he did. Today I drove vw on freeway and hit 63mph! It was gnarly. I kinda was flooring it. But it seems natural to floor it. But only in 4th gear. Idk. Do u guys almost floor it. I can loosen the rev lever nut too. Cuz it’s easy to floor at times. But maybe it’s safe. Idk. Super off topic tho. 1.9L. I love you guys.
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E1
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Speaking just for me...

I only floor it if trying to get somewhere, ANYWHERE, sometime that week. Laughing

And with JLR's gentle nudge posted above, Yes, I can hear the fan on low speed -- but generally only at stop lights.

Sometimes though, even in those cases, I still can't hear it.
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sphet
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

My 1982 diesel prevents me from hearing anything, let alone the fan. Only once did I get out in Monterey, CA and heard it still running low, but that was before I replaced my radiator. I have not heard it since.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 3:57 am    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

E1 wrote:
Zephyr_shreds wrote:
So that’s why it’s up to you guys if I should go egg his shop. But it’s a 1982

Super-impressed you kept an egg for 37 years just for such a purpose.

That's commitment. (👍🏼)

Wink


Nice!

Quote:
Just felt like I got fucked in the ass for paying 200$


Not too bad. My guy in CT charges more but I do Get free kale afterwards.
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crazyvwvanman
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 4:13 am    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

The larger fan motor needs the resistor to have multiple speeds.
The larger fan motor needs heavier wiring added.
You should have used your original/smaller fan motor if you weren't going to upgrade the fan wiring for the higher amps of the larger motor.
The smaller fan motor was used on 82-91 models of Vanagon.
Vanagons 86+ with factory A/C and 86+ Syncros got the larger fan motor.
They also got heavier duty fan wiring harnesses and big resistors to make multiple speeds.

The early Vanagon fuse box is not quite up to the job of running the larger fan motor, especially without the resistor. Good luck.

Mark

Zephyr_shreds wrote:
.... I put on the new gas radiator with the bigger fan motor. That’s why I was wondering about the resistor, and why the mechanic didnt put it in.
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Zephyr_shreds
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 2:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Today smoke came somewhere from the fuse box after the fan turned on the 2nd time.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 5:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Zephyr_shreds wrote:
Today smoke came somewhere from the fuse box after the fan turned on the 2nd time.


You let the smoke out??? Electrons require the smoke to travel along the circuit. Without the smoke the circuit is done.

Read what the other Mark posted. The early fuse box is not sized to handle the load of the bigger radiator fan.
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Zephyr_shreds
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 10:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

“Without the smoke the circuit is done.
Read what the other Mark posted”.[/quote]

Wait what? Smoke in the fuse box is good? To me it seems a fire hazard.

How exactly do you add heavier wiring to the fan motor? After adding heavier wiring and adding the resistor, then will my fuse box be ok?
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Can you post a photo of your rad fan motor?

When I upgraded to the larger fan, I made an entire new fan wiring harness, added in the resistor, ran a dedicated wire from the battery. Behind the glove box, I added a blue sea maxi fuse holder with 50 amp fuse for high speed, as well as a relay for it. Added small fuse holder on passenger A Pillar with fuse for low speed. I don’t have AC so not utilizing the mid speed.

It was not a hard modification, but it was time consuming to make and run the new harness. If you had the mechanic do it, you would be looking at a lot of money for the time.

Read and understand the GW write up on the fan workings and wiring. Maybe this is a project you can undertake yourself. If you have any basic electrical knowledge, you should be bake to tackle this.

I’ll try and take some photos of my instal when I get a chance.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Zephyr_shreds wrote:
“Without the smoke the circuit is done.
Read what the other Mark posted”.

Wait what? Smoke in the fuse box is good? To me it seems a fire hazard.

How exactly do you add heavier wiring to the fan motor? After adding heavier wiring and adding the resistor, then will my fuse box be ok?


Just in case the smoke joke is lost at this time (but you probably knew this...)... Very Happy

Ever since British electrical systems have been self-immolating folks have been wondering how to get the smoke back into the system and often buying replacement smoke kits for their Britt rigs...
http://www3.telus.net/bc_triumph_registry/smoke.htm

So yes, the smoke is good, as long as it’s kept tightly contained in the system. Once it gets out all bets are off....


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Abscate wrote:
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.

Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro).
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crazyvwvanman
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:17 am    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Since it is an 82 diesel van the battery is back by the right rear tail light.
This makes it more complicated to safely run the necessary new dedicated power feed wire for the larger radiator fan motor.
This is part of why I said the original small motor should have been used.
With the larger fan motor a new separate wiring harness for it is essential, along with the fan resistor to create low speed.

Mark

beach_creature wrote:
......When I upgraded to the larger fan, I made an entire new fan wiring harness, added in the resistor, ran a dedicated wire from the battery. Behind the glove box, I added a blue sea maxi fuse holder with 50 amp fuse for high speed, as well as a relay for it. Added small fuse holder on passenger A Pillar with fuse for low speed.....
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Zephyr_shreds
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:21 am    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
it’s from gowesty.
Beach_creature, it would be super cool if you can show me some pics of your wiring installation. I want to do it exactly like you. I want to take my friends to sf this weekend cuz they’ve never been there. We like to skateboard. So please take some pictures when u get the chance that would be amazing!☺️🙃

Did you use any special wires to make the harness?

What about running the power wire safely from the battery? How do u make it safe?
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Zephyr_shreds
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 4:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

beach_creature wrote:
When I upgraded to the larger fan, I made an entire new fan wiring harness.


Can you draw your setup out on paper, and label everything attached, take a pic and post it please. I really appreciate the help from you guys so much.
Thank you
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beach_creature
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 6:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

K I have some photos, not complete. This is what I did. I think it works well. Others maybe have differing opinions.

I ran a wiree direct from the battery under the passenger seat to the area behind the glove box. It was a 10 awg wire. If you are ruining it from the battery in the rear, I would go 8 awg wire.

The wire goes to this fuse block on the A pillar (large blue wire)
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Then the wire from the same terminal on the fuse block, continues to the blue sea maxi fuse holder
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This is all 10 awg wire so far.

The maxi fuse is a 50 amp fuse. The other side of the fuse continues to this relay
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


The wire color from here I tried to coordinate with original wire colors and to match the existing temp switch connector at the rad.

The white whire from the fuse block with 30 amp fuse goes to the red/white wire on the temp switch connector. This is hot all the time.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


It will then travel through the switch and into the red/black wire if the low temp switches on. The red/black wire then goes through the big resistor that is mounted behind the drivers head light. You will need to fabricate a bracket and make sure the resistor does not come into contact the the van. The inside is porcelain and not conductive. The bracket will slide into either side of the resistor. Wish I had a photo.

The power will then come out the resistor and down into the radiator fan. This has now all been 12 awg wire.
This completes the wiring of the low speed.

For the high speed fan, the red/blue wire on the temp switch connector you need to run back into the vehicle to the relay. I used 16 or 18 awg wire. It’s the smaller blue wire. It does not carry much load, just activates the relay.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


The relay brown wire is the ground.
When the relay is actived by the blue wire from the temp switch (high), the relay is on and the power coming from the maxi fuse, large blue wire, will go through the relay, and allow power to come out the large red wire (10 awg). This red wire travels back to the radiator fan positive side and now high speed is on. There is no resistor for high speed. The large red wire for high speed and the smaller 12awg wire from the resistor both attach to the fan on the same terminal. But only one is delivering power at a time. The temp switch controls which, (if any), is getting power.

I used a 10 awg brown wire for ground the radiator fan and ran it back into the vehicle at the ground trees on drivers side above the main fuse box.

The relay should be a 70 amp relay. I currently have a 40 amp and it works, only on briefly ever and not often. But I’ll be switching it out for a 70 amp relay.

All wire connections were done with crimped butt connectors and used heat shrink over them to keep moisture out. I also used marine wire as it is tinned copper and is more corossion resistant. Similar price to automotive wire.

All the wires from the fuse block and relay all travel behind/bellow the the dash in a wire loom. The ground wire joins in on the drivers side. Then go through one of the large wire grommets below the dash, accessed behind drivers headlight.

2 wires will need to come out from the loom at this point to reach the resistor. 1 wire coming from the temp switch, then traveling back into the harness and to radiator fan. Hopefully this makes sense.

Here are some more photos from behind the glove box.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



This is a very time consuming project. May take a while to sort out how your harness will go together. Measure all the wire lengths needed beforehand, and be generous with your measuring.
You can also use a cheaper inline maxi fuse holder rather than the blue sea one.

Good luck!
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Zephyr_shreds
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 4:12 am    Post subject: Re: Can you HEAR your low speed radiator fan? Reply with quote

Ok how fun:) I understand everything I think, except when 2 wires need to come out the loom and hit the resistor.
1 To me it just seems like u have to attach original red/black wire to resister 2then put the one positive resister wire in the loom, direct it toward fan motor,
3 Then put the new blue 16awg temp sensor wire in loom, directed towards the 70amp relay.

So I understand putting two wires into the loom. + wire from resister to fan motor, and 16awg wire from temp sensor to relay.
But I don’t understand taking two wires out of the loom to attach to resister.

Did you tap into the original temp sensor wires with the new wires of bigger awg? Heck no huhthats a dumb question?

Thankyou so much for explaining this whole thing to me. I can’t wait to get started tomorrow when oreillies opens. Hopefully they have the parts
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