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WBX lifter clatter
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The VW Vanagon liquid cooled flat 4 is an under engineered afterthought of how to get away from an air cooled configuration.

The late type 2's lifter's rattled, after sitting for an extended period of time, or for a lack of frequent oil changes with the correct viscosity oil depending on the ambient temperatures.
The wasserleaker is the same platform as the air cooled engine--why should it operate any different?
It doesn't, it won't.

Now--if you haven't owned that Van since new, and don't have a clue how the 13 prior owner's before you took care of the engine, you have several options;

(1) start all over and rebuild the engine
(2) clean the crap outa the inside of the engine--flush it with fuel oil, and refill with the proper grade of oil.
(3) change the oil & filter and run a quart of Marvel in it--all the time.
You have a good chance of the crap being cleaned outa the lifter's and allowing them to pump up right away.
(4) Yank use the junk low tech flat 4 outa the Van a go with a new millenium engine platform.
Think Zetec.

You guys are asking for a 1949 design to operate at 2012 engine parameter's.

Dream on---

And I'll say this one again--
Do not assume that any oils with high zinc content is going to cure your problems.
It ain't gonna happen.

The zinc in the oil is primarily for engine cam break in.
That's all.

Now--if you guy's had your thinking caps bolted on--you'd be running Air Cooled Motorcycle oil in your squirrel cages.

Golden Spectro 10/40, 15/50, 20/50 would be a perfect example of an excellent oil to be running in your low or no horse power to weight ratio engines, and allow them to run a little cooler, and prevent 90% of all of your dreamt up & imagined oiling / wear problems.
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Zeitgeist 13
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My lousy under-engineered WBX has made it to only 200k, and just won't die. I want my money back
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An act of God does happen every once in awhile.

The early failure to the long term longevity factor is very low.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mine has 182K Miles, runs fine. I never under stand why someone would put in a four cylinder ford engine over a 1.8t... Must be a back east thing, haven't seen a bostig out here yet...
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's the screwed up EPA laws that The Land of the Fruits & Nuts that's mandated that makes the 4 cylinder inline Ford Focus engine, that's capable of putting out 1000 horses in real time, not eligible for a transplant there in kumquat land.


Poor you.

Stuck with a weezie 1.8 that's still very low on the big totem pole of the horsepower to weight ratio slide rule.

Your a couple of horses short.
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kuleinc
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know what any of that means. I can't speak to the bostig conversions amount of power as there aren't any out here that I've seen. I will say though a 1.8T swap makes the subaru swap seem like a waste of time.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kuleinc wrote:
I don't know what any of that means. I can't speak to the bostig conversions amount of power as there aren't any out here that I've seen. I will say though a 1.8T swap makes the subaru swap seem like a waste of time.


You need to stop saying this.

You got a ride in a van with a highly modified engine tweaked to produce 250 HP and are comparing it to a bone stock 2.2 Subaru engine. Its just not appropriate.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL--
Now here's a good one.
He went for a Joy Ride in a turbo oil burner and now is an engine transplant comparison afficinato ?

Pretty Funny Stuff--- Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Want a fast van with no lifter clatter?
Here choose one:

Honda Odyssey Touring Elite: 0-60 mph in 7.3 seconds
Chrysler Town & Country Limited: 0-60 mph in 7.6 seconds
Toyota Sienna Limited: 0-60 mph in 7.7 seconds
Nissan Quest LE: 0-60 mph in 7.9 seconds

All faster than a 1970 Moss 302 Mustang - BTW.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jake de Villiers wrote:
kuleinc wrote:
I don't know what any of that means. I can't speak to the bostig conversions amount of power as there aren't any out here that I've seen. I will say though a 1.8T swap makes the subaru swap seem like a waste of time.


You need to stop saying this.

You got a ride in a van with a highly modified engine tweaked to produce 250 HP and are comparing it to a bone stock 2.2 Subaru engine. Its just not appropriate.


Its not a highly modified engine. To each there own. I think as Terry would say, you can choose the flavor of your cool-aide, subaru or VW. I choose the VW, its light years ahead of the subaru swaps. I never claimed to be an aficionado, but this won't be my first or last swapped car. I think after my experience riding and driving vans with swaps, should be shared with people. I thought the 2.2L swap was the cats meow, when it was the only one I'd tried.

Its a big investment. Make sure you do your homework before you end up with something that could have been done better. Hind sight and all.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dude, you're becoming dredward v.2.0
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can we leave the engine conversion crap out of this thread? It's like a freaking plague....


Another datapoint. Fresh Mobil synthetic 15-50 and oil filter change every 4K miles. Added MMO in quantities recommended here. It's been a while and a bunch of miles. Nothing, nada, no results, loud lifter noise after the van sits for several days.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What are the qauntities recommended here, and what is a while?

Some things to realisticly consider if after "awhile" the clack is still there;
(A) Your rocker's may need adjusting.
(B) Your lifter's are shot--replace them
(C) Your cam is going flat--change that & the lifter's.
(D)You didn't use enough Marvel.
A pint per oil change ain't gonna get it.

MMO isn't the Wizard of Oz--and most certainly won't wake up the dead, replace worn out metal, or do an in chassis re-build.

Your actually going to have to do some self diagnosis on your own on this one, and figure out the problem.
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Last edited by Terry Kay on Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terry Kay wrote:
What are the qaunities recommended here, and what is a while?

Three things to realisticly consider if after "awhile" the clack is still there;
(A) Your rocker's may need adjusting.
(B) your lifter's are shot--replace them
(C) your cam is going flat--change that & the lifter's.

MMO isn't the Wizard of Oz--and most certainly won't wake up the dead, replace worn out metal, or do an in chassis re-build.

Your actually going to have to do some self diagnosis on your own on this one, and figure out the problem.


I tried 6 oz of MMO first, drove the van for two weeks, nothing, poured more MMO up to one quartz, two more weeks of driving, nothing.

The lifters are not shot, they make noise when sitting for a while, 20 minutes of driving and noise goes away. There is no dead to wake up.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know what the inside of your engine looks like, or what the face of your lifter's might be, or what the insides of them look like.
How's the springs?
Valve plate clean as a whistle?

You didn't run the Marvel long enough, or use enough to do anything--go run the snot outa it.
2 Weeks --5000 miles or so?

When's that last time you adjusted the enigines valves??
And right off the top of your head--you can say that they are not shot or loaded up with crap.

Interesting.

How did you assess this Eurika?

If the springs are weak, the inside of the lifter's are filthy, and causing the lifter's check valves to be bleeding off---there's your early clack.

The lifter's are shot, dead, or they are filthy inside.
Remove them disasemble them, clean them up & reinstall.
Or wait for the Marvel to work on your abused engine.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My engine is fine, more than fine, rebuilt not long ago, thank you. Five pages of "put MMO in it" and when somebody (not the first one) says it does not work it is because the whole van is falling apart...

OK, I'm outta here, got better things to do.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who in the heck said the whole van is falling apart?

Not me--you did.

And when that engine was "re-built", a brand new cam & lifter's was installed--you know that for a fact.

If the lifter's are bleeding off in 2 days--they are obviously losing their oil prime, which in common sense terms means they are all of the above of what I mentioned before.

Shot, filthy, or half dead.

Plus--you decided to use some lame MMO formula.
Again, not enough for too short of a time---the pint formula is wrong.
How many miles with the quart MMO in it ?
2-300?

It's real clear that this "reman" engine, you have, got the short end of the stick if the lifters are clacking already.
Somebody skimped on the "New" parts.

Your engine isn't "OK" or the lifter's wouldn't be bled off in that short of parked time.

MMO is in no way, shape, or form Jesus.
Can't make the blind see,the lame walk, or cure lifter leprosy.

Amen.

I have never posted anywhere, any time that the product would magically remanufacture worn out parts.

What I have posted is; if you have stuck rings or lifter's, or want to fog the engine for an extended period of time MMO will do the job---with the Correct mixture formula.
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Last edited by Terry Kay on Fri Nov 16, 2012 9:06 am; edited 3 times in total
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What vile contempt for human decency and divine grace have I wrought?

My sincerest apologies to the civil

Straight to the anger management detention centers for the remainder



Godspeed one and all



click

clack

tallywack
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zeitgeist 13 wrote:
Dude, you're becoming dredward v.2.0


I will second that Exclamation
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terry Kay wrote:
MMO is in no way, shape, or form Jesus.
Can't make the blind see,the lame walk, or cure lifter leprosy.

Amen.

I have never posted anywhere, any time that the product would magically remanufacture worn out parts.

What I have posted is; if you have stuck rings or lifter's, or want to fog the engine for an extended period of time MMO will do the job---with the Correct mixture formula.


Word to dat!

It ain't no rebuild in a bottle.
K1 or any diesel distillant is the same thing, minus the red dye.
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