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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:43 am Post subject: Gas Gauge Woes |
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So I installed a new fuel gauge sender about a year ago and ever since then the needle would bob up and down and work sometimes but other times wouldn't work at all. I also noticed that when I filled up the tank to full I could distinctly smell gas quite strong. So I decided to cut an access hole (I did it really carefully and it looks quite nice). I get in there and see that the sender is loose on the tank! That explains the gas smell when full. Then I pull out the sender and take it apart and this is what I see:
That would explain the gauge bobbing up and down and working sometimes but not others. How do you think this happened?
Also when I ground the wire going to the gauge the needle only goes up to about 3/4 a tank and not to the 1/1 mark. Could this be attributed to resistance in the old wire? Should I run a new wire when I get a new sender? Or should I replace the vibrator with the solid state fix seen here on the samba? _________________ air-cooled or nothing for me
1978 Sunroof Deluxe Bus (daily driver)
1978 Transporter (mom's, making into a camper)
1970 Single Cab 2.1 turbo/EFI 6 Rib, 78 front beam, vanagon backing plates on rear (project)
2001 GTI VR6 (wife's) |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:47 am Post subject: Re: Gas Gauge Woes |
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tootype2crazy wrote: |
Also when I ground the wire going to the gauge the needle only goes up to about 3/4 a tank and not to the 1/1 mark. Could this be attributed to resistance in the old wire? Should I run a new wire when I get a new sender? Or should I replace the vibrator with the solid state fix seen here on the samba? |
How about if you ground right at the back of the gauge?, if it reads the same the vibrator is suspect.
Likely also the cause of the F'd up sender, although most appear more burnt than that. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
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Слава Україні! |
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:51 am Post subject: |
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Good to know, I wish I had done the solid state fix on the vibrator before I spent $60 on this sender only to have it crap out. I thought about it and didn't do it. Oh well. I'll go ground out the gauge now. _________________ air-cooled or nothing for me
1978 Sunroof Deluxe Bus (daily driver)
1978 Transporter (mom's, making into a camper)
1970 Single Cab 2.1 turbo/EFI 6 Rib, 78 front beam, vanagon backing plates on rear (project)
2001 GTI VR6 (wife's) |
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:12 am Post subject: |
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OK, then clean up the big connector where the main harness comes up into the dash (on steering column brace on a 79 IIRC) and confirm you are grounding to a good ground at the back, usually the wire doesn't break down but a connection does. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:24 am Post subject: |
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No, usually the result of stuck points in the vibrator so the system got full battery voltage. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50254
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:24 am Post subject: |
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I suspect you are just seeing the results of junk low quality materials and workmanship. For a decade it seems senders have not read correctly from the get go and needed to be tweaked a bit to get them to read even close to what they should. I have heard some of the newer ones are better but haven't tried one yet. Thinking I might just buy some nichrome wire and try rewinding an old one. |
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AB westy nut Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2010 Posts: 1124 Location: Calgary, Alberta
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:35 am Post subject: |
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How was your sender loose on the tank? _________________ 1963 Ruby Red 356 Cabriolet
1976 Sage Green Westfalia Deluxe |
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:40 am Post subject: |
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AB westy nut wrote: |
How was your sender loose on the tank? |
Not sure how it got that way, I remember it being really hard to put on. I don't think I greased the seal last time, maybe the seal was gripping the metal and it worked loose over time. _________________ air-cooled or nothing for me
1978 Sunroof Deluxe Bus (daily driver)
1978 Transporter (mom's, making into a camper)
1970 Single Cab 2.1 turbo/EFI 6 Rib, 78 front beam, vanagon backing plates on rear (project)
2001 GTI VR6 (wife's) |
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AB westy nut Samba Member
Joined: June 01, 2010 Posts: 1124 Location: Calgary, Alberta
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:46 am Post subject: |
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Yeah I found mine impossible to get on so I ended up sourcing a flat profile nitrile gasket. I was still a snug fit but it worked perfectly. _________________ 1963 Ruby Red 356 Cabriolet
1976 Sage Green Westfalia Deluxe |
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:55 am Post subject: |
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Just now I put the broken one back on by greasing it with my sunroof lube. It is called superlube and is hard to find, I think you can get it on amazon. It is non-reactive so it won't hurt the rubber or the gas if it gets in there. I placed the sender on and since i cut an access hole, I used a big pry bar with lots of leverage from the access hole and it seated quite easily. _________________ air-cooled or nothing for me
1978 Sunroof Deluxe Bus (daily driver)
1978 Transporter (mom's, making into a camper)
1970 Single Cab 2.1 turbo/EFI 6 Rib, 78 front beam, vanagon backing plates on rear (project)
2001 GTI VR6 (wife's) |
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:33 am Post subject: |
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Ok I cleaned and greased every connection with dielectric grease. When I ground the gauge out in the back by the sender it will indeed go to the 1/1 mark.
After doing it a hundred times I noticed that when I first grounded it, the needle will twitch a few times before rising to the full mark. Then once it is at the full mark if I hold it there it will slowly descend until it shows empty. Actually this is exactly what it did with the sender in there too. So either the vibrator is bad or the gauge itself. _________________ air-cooled or nothing for me
1978 Sunroof Deluxe Bus (daily driver)
1978 Transporter (mom's, making into a camper)
1970 Single Cab 2.1 turbo/EFI 6 Rib, 78 front beam, vanagon backing plates on rear (project)
2001 GTI VR6 (wife's) |
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50254
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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tootype2crazy wrote: |
Any thoughts on the sender before I drop the bills? |
As I said I have heard that some of the more recently made senders are better than the ones produced a few years back. I think my source was referring to VDO but am not sure. No experience with very recently manufactured VDO senders myself. |
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tootype2crazy Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2007 Posts: 1276 Location: St. Louis Missouri
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rustbus Samba Member
Joined: June 18, 2009 Posts: 2078 Location: alberta
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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i spent a few weeks trying to source a VDO sensor. even a made in Czek on would have done. could not find it, all the usual places are out of stock and rumor is no more VDO ones coming. i bit it and went with the chinese unit.
o well. if it craps i plan to rewire the old VDO unit and go with that.
i guess what im saying is that you might as well buy whatever unit you can get since they are all the chinese ones. (you could try and hunt for a mexican one) _________________ May of '72 Deluxe. 2.0L L-Jet CS & 091 trans conversion
my Bus thread |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50254
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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rustbus wrote: |
i spent a few weeks trying to source a VDO sensor. even a made in Czek on would have done. could not find it, all the usual places are out of stock and rumor is no more VDO ones coming. i bit it and went with the chinese unit.
o well. if it craps i plan to rewire the old VDO unit and go with that.
i guess what im saying is that you might as well buy whatever unit you can get since they are all the chinese ones. (you could try and hunt for a mexican one) |
Wonder what is available from Brazil? Really need a good Brazilian contact. |
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