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Phishman068 Samba Member
Joined: February 19, 2007 Posts: 1868 Location: Pittsburgh PA (ish)
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Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 7:12 am Post subject: Engine Component Paint, Exhaust Paint, Exhaust Wraps, etc? |
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So i'm working on building up a 2.1 to stick back in a bus and all the bolt on components have been sand blasted, soaked in SEM Rust mort, primed with a high zinc primer, and waiting to paint.
The game plan was to paint the components body color, as i've never seen this done on a WBXer. I was going to get a quart of paint mixed up from the local paint shop and spray them, possibly clear coating them (But not sure on that).
Now people are informing me that this won't work. Some are telling me the paint has to be high heat (Though the intake system and pulleys really don't see THAT much heat) and others tell me it must be fuel/oil proof in some way. Some tell me theres no body paint that will hold up (But then what's the engine bay painted with....?), and others tell me if you don't clear coat it you will have problems. Then yet others tell me that the clear coat is what will be the problem.
Also, I'm putting on some very good used exhaust components and wondering if there is anything I can do to make these last longer here in western PA.
Does BBQ grill paint or exhaust paint actually work?
I've always been told they don't work, but that can't be the general consensus if people keep buying it, right?
What products have you used, and how have they held up? _________________ http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=559766&highlight=winter+rust
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482402&highlight=sunroof+syncro
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=569774
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6864936#6864936
"Along with the ability to go fast, one looses the desire to hurry." |
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61Scout Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2011 Posts: 1297 Location: Shoreline/Yakima WA
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Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 7:46 am Post subject: |
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Well, like yourself I've received lots of varying information over the years on this subject. What I've found works best is NO primer and a good enamel paint. I've found the primer makes the paint too soft and if you knock it with a tool it will chip. So basically I just blast the crap out of the tin, wash, and then paint directly on metal. I like Rust-Oleum for this job, easy to find and inexpensive. I've used it for years, no problem with oil or cleaners. No problems with flaking off or deteriorating either. The only place I haven't been able to use it is on the exhaust, obviously. For exhaust components BBQ paint works well if you like flat black. You can also shop for VHT high temp paints, or go down to your local woodstove store and shop for stove paints which often come in more colors.
A few tips I've worked out over the years... 1) Use gloves. I use gloves from the cleaning stage all through the painting stage. I've found if I touch the paint between coats, the oil from my fingertips ruins the finish on the second coat. 2) Hang everything. I don't try to place stuff on the ground on cardboard and flip it over. It just picks up too much dust during the painting process. 3) Clean your shop before painting. I've found even if I do a quick touch up around the shop and vacuum the floors with the shop vac I get less dust in the finish. Of course if you have a booth this doesn't matter. 4) Allow it to fully cure before installing. I personally wait a week before re-installing components.
This is just the way I do things... many would not agree with my methods, and I'm sure there are other ways of doing things, but it has worked for me. Been following your project Phish, looks great man. _________________ 1986 Westfalia Weekender Wolfsburg, RJE 2.3
1985 Tin Top, Subie 2.2 + 5MT
Floppy Mirrors no more: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=653018&highlight=
Remove the front spindle nut with ease: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=679567&highlight=
Remove the rear wheel bearing housing without messing with the big 46mm nut: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=679507&highlight=
-Nec Spe, Nec Metu |
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Christopher Schimke Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2005 Posts: 5391 Location: PNW
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Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 7:50 am Post subject: Re: Engine Component Paint, Exhaust Paint, Exhaust Wraps, et |
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Phishman068 wrote: |
Now people are informing me that this won't work. |
Sure it will...if it is done correctly.
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Some are telling me the paint has to be high heat (Though the intake system and pulleys really don't see THAT much heat) |
You could prep and paint the entire engine (everything but the exhaust) and the only place that you would have real trouble with heat is near the exhaust ports on the heads. Everything else will be just fine.
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and others tell me it must be fuel/oil proof in some way. Some tell me theres no body paint that will hold up (But then what's the engine bay painted with....?), |
Not completely true! However, all of the durability will come down to proper prep, proper materials and proper application...and you need all three. For instance, you could do everything right, but if you use a non-catalyzed enamel, it may stay on and look great for years, but it won't be very resistant to chemicals. Oil usually isn't too much of a problem, but fuel will attack uncatalyzed enamel. I would suggest nothing less than a catalyzed urethane or catalyzed enamel for your paint. Do not consider plain basecoat (un-clearcoated), uncatalyzed enamel or lacquer.
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and others tell me if you don't clear coat it you will have problems. Then yet others tell me that the clear coat is what will be the problem. |
For this particular application, the only reason for clearcoat would be if you used a basecoat for your color coat. Basecoat is not very durable and would need to be clearcoated for protection. If you use a single-stage paint, you don't need to clearcoat it as it will be durable just as it is. Adding clearcoat over the top of a single-stage could actually make it less durable due to the increased film build.
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Does BBQ grill paint or exhaust paint actually work?
I've always been told they don't work, but that can't be the general consensus if people keep buying it, right? |
VHT exhaust paint can work okay for a while, but the parts have to be prepped perfectly (perfectly clean, bare metal) and it won't last forever. If you plan on keeping up on maintaining it (removing the deteriorated areas and respraying), it could help keep the exhaust in good shape, but most people expect to be able to apply it once and forget it. _________________ "Sometimes you have to build a box to think outside of." - Bruce (not Springsteen)
*Custom wheel hardware for Audi/VW, Porsche and Mercedes wheels - Urethane Suspension Bushings*
T3Technique.com or contact me at [email protected] |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32625 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 8:13 am Post subject: |
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Yet again........we are traveling the same path!
Same thought processes, same "discovery" time frame.
On the exhaust, this I know...... The majority of Exhaust decay comes from the inside out.
This is why the life span is less for exhaust systems used for short local runs. The heat doesn't build up hot enough to displace the moisture out of the pipes that is naturally found in the atmosphere and from the combustion process.
Yes, exterior paint will help, but it isn't the answer to a long exhaust life........ Long drives are.
I am using single Stage automotive paint to redo my engine compartment, cleaning it up and dealing with minor unsightly rust.
My Engine case?........ I'm thinking of leaving it alone or maybe a clear coat.
The manifolds? I'm going with Black.
I could use single stage automotive black but for convenience I'd rather use a rattle can.
Apparently Motorcycle shops market a good chemical resistant rattle can paint for use on the frames and fuel tanks. I've yet to stop by and see what they stock.
What intrigues me is finding a solution to the Gold color anodized coating found on so many parts such as the pressure regulator, the latch hatch, door strikers, etc.
How to renew and restore this color.
Dave _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert |
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Phishman068 Samba Member
Joined: February 19, 2007 Posts: 1868 Location: Pittsburgh PA (ish)
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240Gordy Samba Member
Joined: May 15, 2008 Posts: 2354 Location: Vancouver, BC
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Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 12:09 pm Post subject: |
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djkeev wrote: |
What intrigues me is finding a solution to the Gold color anodized coating found on so many parts such as the pressure regulator, the latch hatch, door strikers, etc.
How to renew and restore this color.
Dave |
Methinks that is a kind of zinc plating. The swiss race taxi site has great pics of some restored suspension components.
I think Christopher is not to be doubted on this. It is an area of his expertise. _________________ Tencentlife said,
"So, now that you know what you're doing, go to town."
2010 GOLF TRENDLINE 2.5
1985 GL now with more! a 2.1L
H&R SPORT(RED) Springs FRONT , SLAM SPECIALTIES RE6 AIRBAGS REAR |
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spacecadet Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2012 Posts: 158 Location: San Francisco
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Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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I wrapped my exhaust headers in 1200 degree Kevlar wrap.. not saying it will improve longevity, but my engine bay got significantly cooler! - Might be good for paint. It definitely helps with working under the van after running it.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051US5M4/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 _________________ Daily Drivers Only
--
1990 Volvo 740 Turbo(Sold)
1986 Mercedes 300 Coupe (Sold)
1954 Volvo PV544 (Sold)
1990 Dodge D250 Cummins (Totaled)
1990 Vanagon GL 2.1 Automatic (Sold)
1968 Ford F250(Current) |
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jimeg Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2007 Posts: 510 Location: PNW
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bluebus86 Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010 Posts: 11075
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Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 9:05 am Post subject: |
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The exhaust system i had ceramic coated (kind of like powder coating, but higher temp) I had a specialty place do that for me. it worke best on new metal, on the old parts, dispite them sand blasting them clean rust did return, but sicne I used black ceramic, i was able to fix the bad spots with rustoleum high temp BBQ paint. I have also used Rustoleum BBQ paint with good results on my 914 ad bug's mufflers, lasts pretty well and touch ups are easy. this is much more economical than ceramic coating.
i useDuplicolor engine enamal or rustoleum enamal on the other parts, brackets, intake headers and such. the duplicolor engine enamal holds up a tad better than rustoleum on parts that get warm like the ends of the intake runners near the heads (the rustoleum enamal darkened a bit near the heads.) the duplicolor also dries faster than rustoleum.
the exaust bolts need a high temp paint, like BBQ paint. also use lots of antiseize when assembly is done on these bolts.
the engine bay (body sheet metal) should be given a rust proofing, teh factory did mine in a wax type material over the paint. this will avoid seam rust |
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PDXWesty Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2006 Posts: 6247 Location: Portland OR
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kirsplat Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2008 Posts: 412 Location: Seattle
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Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 9:33 am Post subject: |
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I've seen Por20 used on exhaust with good results.
The exhaust was sandblasted before it was applied. _________________ 86 Syncro|EJ253|Carat |
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90weekender Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2015 Posts: 183
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Zeitgeist 13 Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009 Posts: 12115 Location: Port Manteau
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Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2020 6:26 pm Post subject: Re: Engine Component Paint, Exhaust Paint, Exhaust Wraps, etc? |
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I have had really good luck with Rust-Oleum High Heat BBQ paint. It's held up for several years, even on mufflers and other piping on my TDI van. Super happy.
[EDIT] I guess I should mention that I painted my exhaust manifold prior to wrapping it with a thermal wrap, and after many years there's been no rust showing at the seams or edges. Mind you, I was pretty skeptical when I painted it, but it's holding quite well so far. _________________ Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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Californio Samba Member
Joined: May 17, 2007 Posts: 1306
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Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2020 6:43 pm Post subject: Re: Engine Component Paint, Exhaust Paint, Exhaust Wraps, etc? |
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Sharkhide says it's 100% proudly American made. At $40 for 11 ounces how could you go wrong. Inert ingredients include huile de serpent. |
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Jake de Villiers Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2007 Posts: 5911 Location: Tsawwassen, BC
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Posted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 8:05 am Post subject: Re: Engine Component Paint, Exhaust Paint, Exhaust Wraps, etc? |
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Californio wrote: |
huile de serpent. |
That sh*t's mighty expensive for a product that seems to be readliy available just about everywhere!! _________________ '84 Vanagon GL 1.9 WBX
'86 Westy Weekender Poptop/2.5 Subaru/5 Speed Posi/Audi Front Brakes/16 x 7 Mercedes Wheels - answers to 'Dixie'
@jakedevilliersmusic1
http://sites.google.com/site/subyjake/mydixiedarlin%27
www.crescentbeachguitar.com
www.thebassspa.com |
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