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SCM Samba Member
Joined: January 26, 2011 Posts: 3102 Location: Bozeman MT
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:12 pm Post subject: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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TBH, I'll admit I used to think a lot of the "change your fuel lines" sentiment was a bit paranoid. I was wrong.
This Friday I started the van for the first time in a couple months and planned to run some errands. I did a quick loop around the block and parked it in the driveway. I was going to let it idle while I ran into the house to get something. My first thought was, "man, the way little kids are attracted to the thing am I risking one of the neighbors climbing in?". Of course not, I'll be gone exactly one minute and I can see that no one is outside other than me.
I was just about to walk into my backyard when I remembered reading a couple accounts of people in a similar situation who returned to find a burst coolant hose or oil cooler o-ring and a fried engine. "Hmmm. I should at least give a quick look/sniff". "Oh, wow, what's THAT puddle!".
Sure enough, a very steady drip of gas had formed a puddle under the van. Luckily I turned it off before anything had really warmed up.
The leak was coming from the engine bay bulkhead area. I run a solid stretch of fuel line through a grommet in the bulkhead so I expected to see that hose and grommet sliced through, although I do inspect it regularly.
It turns out that the leak is coming from the connection between the hard plastic line and the rubber fuel hose - which are joined together with an Oetiker clamp. It's as if the clamp had become loose but I don't think that's possible. Either the hard line or the rubber hose has somehow become compromised.
I already planned to replace my fuel injectors and filter next month so all new fuel lines just means some more shopping and little bit more time.
It's been a couple years since I had to do any real maintenance to the van so I suppose I'm due. _________________ '91 Westfalia GL Automatic (GTA "Turbo" Rebuild w/Peloquin) and 2.3L GoWesty Engine |
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4Gears4Tires Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018 Posts: 2982 Location: MD
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:14 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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It's not just Vanagons, it's any old car. RIP.
_________________ '87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32433 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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campism Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2007 Posts: 4485 Location: Richmond VA
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:51 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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SCM wrote: |
It turns out that the leak is coming from the connection between the hard plastic line and the rubber fuel hose - which are joined together with an Oetiker clamp. It's as if the clamp had become loose but I don't think that's possible. Either the hard line or the rubber hose has somehow become compromised. |
That's where mine was leaking, forward of the firewall and where the hard plastic line meets the rubber hose and it was dripping onto the starter. I double-clamped the new hose. _________________ '87 Westy in Wolfram Grey Metallic |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50261
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 5:58 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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4Gears4Tires wrote: |
It's not just Vanagons, it's any old car. RIP.
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It is not just old cars, where we winter in Arizona there are burn scars on the pavement every mile or two from cars burning up. On the 12 mile section of AZ 68 I count 13 fire scars. |
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Zeitgeist 13 Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009 Posts: 12103 Location: Port Manteau
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 6:35 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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Old gasoline powered cars. _________________ Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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hardway Samba Member
Joined: January 03, 2012 Posts: 409 Location: Fidalgo Island
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 6:56 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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I have seen that exact failure many times over the years. The hose is just slipped over the smooth plastic tube. Eventually the pressure and aging rubber allow the hose to creep off of the end of the tube. After the first time I saw it I routinely look at that connection on every Vanagon I see. There is often a witness mark, a clean part of the tube that used to be covered with hose.
My point is that although it might seem to happen suddenly it actually occurs gradually over a very long period of time. What I do is when I see this happening is that I replace that section of hose. I use a lubricant and push as long a piece of hose over the tube as possible. That way it has to creep further to come off. You can double clamp it or use those nifty blue spring clamps that came on the later Vanagon fuel hoses. Constant tension spring clamps are a better solution than worm or screw drive band clamps or even the Oetiker style clamps.
I seem to remember that OutWesty put more permanent bullet proof fittings on his plastic tubes. You could also replace the polyamide tubing and use some other Cohline fittings for it. Belmetric has that type of stuff. But I figure that if you are aware of the problematic joint and push the hose on further when you replace the hose every 10 or 15 years that you will likely avoid that calamity. |
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wcdennis Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2004 Posts: 954 Location: Winston-Salem NC
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 7:09 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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I have had more than one gas leak caused by some rodent chewing through a hose. Always frustrating because it’s not related to lack of maintenance. |
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tjet Samba Member
Joined: June 10, 2014 Posts: 3528 Location: CA & NM
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 7:22 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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Glad you listened to your vehicle. The main difference is that mechanic's (or most samba members here) don't ignore smells, sounds, or other odd things.
Most (non-car) people ignore everything until it catches on fire or whatever. I remember working on an older BMW. The customer wanted the oil change special, but also complained of a burning smell and engine noise while driving. I was getting ready to have a look at it, but I noticed the oil pressure light did not come on with the key on. When I looked closer, I noticed black electrical tape covering the light. I didn't even bother starting it at that point. I told the service writter about what I found. The customer called back and said they got tired of seeing that red light on.
I think they made the customer sign something before we moved it. We gave him an estimate on and engine and he got his car and ran away.
I'm sure the story at the country club was "...so I took my car in for an oil change, but they wanted to replace the engine. The nerve"
We had a lot of customers like that |
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jimf909 Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014 Posts: 7404 Location: WA/ID
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 8:48 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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Wildthings wrote: |
4Gears4Tires wrote: |
It's not just Vanagons, it's any old car. RIP.
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It is not just old cars, where we winter in Arizona there are burn scars on the pavement every mile or two from cars burning up. On the 12 mile section of AZ 68 I count 13 fire scars. |
Exactly. I've always wondered if Vanagons burn at a higher rate than other cars. My guess maybe but they're definitely not the only ones...
_________________ - Jim
Abscate wrote: |
Do not get killed, do not kill others.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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skills@eurocarsplus Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007 Posts: 16803 Location: sticksville, ct.
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 9:13 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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this just reinforces the fact why i fought a roll of NiCopp in my build
you can barely see them (sorry for the crappy pic) i still need to trim and barb the ends
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=9559752#9559752
i'm not going to lie...it was an EPIC pain in the ass to route these even with the engine/trans out but i think the piece of mind was worth it _________________
gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
Jake Raby wrote: |
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
Brian wrote: |
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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d_walküre Samba Member
Joined: October 09, 2008 Posts: 72 Location: Tulsa, OK
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 9:44 pm Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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jimf909 wrote: |
Wildthings wrote: |
4Gears4Tires wrote: |
It's not just Vanagons, it's any old car. RIP.
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It is not just old cars, where we winter in Arizona there are burn scars on the pavement every mile or two from cars burning up. On the 12 mile section of AZ 68 I count 13 fire scars. |
Exactly. I've always wondered if Vanagons burn at a higher rate than other cars. My guess maybe but they're definitely not the only ones...
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I'm a police and fire dispatcher and we get car fires ALL THE TIME... luckily no Vanagons on my watch yet (knock on wood). _________________ JesusV
1987 Vanagon GL Syncro SVX NAHT "Valkyrie"
1993 Eurovan Weekender "Camper van Beethoven"
1959 Bug |
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4Gears4Tires Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018 Posts: 2982 Location: MD
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Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 7:21 am Post subject: Re: I'll be darned, a gas leak. |
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That e30 would have been saved today. The fire truck in the background (on their lunch break) came over and put the fire out. The hood latch cable went and they used a huge crowbar to bend the hood up to confirm the fire was out. The fire was entirely contained to the engine bay. Everything mechanical (all the expensive AWD bits) was fine, everything plastic/electrical needed to be replaced. New hood and fenders too. This could have been done with a bit of time and any donor e30, however at this time even AWD e30s were just not expensive enough to do this level of repair on. That e30 was parted out, I kept the suspension. Engine, trans, wheels, etc all went to other e30s.
Nothing like first hand experience to learn an important lesson.
Keeping the fire contained to the engine bay is one of the reasons I bought a metal engine cover for my van. Fiberglass burns, that is not a great way to contain an engine fire. The metal cover is about twice as heavy though. But if it stays in the engine bay the rest of van has a better chance of being saved. _________________ '87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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