Quick welding question - replacing rear quarter panels

[therealfrogman]

Just got my replacement rear quarters from WW (bumper bracket section) and would like to know if I can just do the cut precision straight and butt weld it without using the butt welding clamps?

I am pretty new at this and want to do it right. I understand spot welding an inch or so apart and going slow but I do not understand the need to use the clamps, seems like I would have more chance of burn throughs with my experience level.

Anyone with a quick response would be appreciated, ready to do this now.

I have a Hobart 140 handler 110 machine with C25

Thank you
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73 Camper Tin Top/Type 4 1.8 engine, Single progressive EMPI carb, electronic ignition SVDA W/ Vacuum.

Really appreciate what Everett has done here. Almost like he hand picked some of you. I am very thankful for all the help I get here.

[far rider]

Yes you can butt weld without the clamps. Use a vise grip, c-clamp, magnet etc. to hold the metal in place. Tack and move your clamps. You might even use a hammer and dolly to adjust the metal as you go if needed. This is strictly self taught amateur advise. Good luck
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67 zenith blue sunroof

Contentment; when what you have is what you want.

[therealfrogman]

Thanks, no advice like experience. Heck I am still in the fitting and cutting process I do not know why but the heater channels were easy compared to this....
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73 Camper Tin Top/Type 4 1.8 engine, Single progressive EMPI carb, electronic ignition SVDA W/ Vacuum.

Really appreciate what Everett has done here. Almost like he hand picked some of you. I am very thankful for all the help I get here.

[far rider]

If you thought heater channels were easy I'd say you're good to go on any vw metal repair. I'm slowly working up the courage to tackle mine. Looked at your project-nice work. And yeah it takes lots of time for every step but just think of the money you're saving!
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67 zenith blue sunroof

Contentment; when what you have is what you want.

[therealfrogman]

far rider, I thought they would never come out. The spot welding removal bit is essential in getting all of the welds out for the channels. The problem I seem to have is accurate tacking spots on the butt welds, now I am just filling pin holes and trying not to grind off to much material.

The sad part is that some of these filling spots I get bigger holes with burn through, yada, yada. Almost done with this side and will finish it with a dremel grinding bit, not going for totally smooth on this one. Seems like the real skill is in the grinding and not so much welding for a rookie like me.

Once I get this done I will post some pics, the fender fits fine after a little massage at the weld point, not perfect but none of my work is
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73 Camper Tin Top/Type 4 1.8 engine, Single progressive EMPI carb, electronic ignition SVDA W/ Vacuum.

Really appreciate what Everett has done here. Almost like he hand picked some of you. I am very thankful for all the help I get here.

[Mike Fisher]

Why not buy a cheap set of panel clamps from Harbor Freight?
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https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold

Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey

[beetlenut]

The panel clamps help once you start putting on your tacks. They keep the metal straight with a uniform gap and together (to a degree) once the heat of the tacks starts to build up. If you can get behind the metal you're welding with some copper, those pinholes will be easier to weld up too.
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scrapyards are for quitters
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[Thrasher22]

I've been working on my bus for 2+ years and only recently bought butt-weld clamps. They ARE nice for holding flat panels in place, but not always practical if you can't access the back of the panel or if there is a curve (read: a lot).

As stated, cheap welding magnets are great, but I find a lot of it comes down to just being able to eyeball the alignment and adjust as you go. The first weld is the hardest if you can't clamp properly, but once it is on you can work around it.

[johnshenry]

[therealfrogman]

I have the c clamps from harbor and probably everything else they sell

The weld went well except for a couple of pin holes, fix em later, working on a crossmember and wheel well replacement now. Promise to upload a pic soon, I have a couple of pads -xoom and ipad out here and a droid phone for pics but I need to reread how to post pics.

I did spend some time shaping the bottom end of the quarter panel and I think it turned out well. I plan on replacing the crossmember, wheel well and then the other heater channel. Hopefully I am doing this logically.
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73 Camper Tin Top/Type 4 1.8 engine, Single progressive EMPI carb, electronic ignition SVDA W/ Vacuum.

Really appreciate what Everett has done here. Almost like he hand picked some of you. I am very thankful for all the help I get here.

[therealfrogman]

Hope I did this correctly, these are the outside and inside views of my first attempt at what I consider technical at least for me.

Hope they are acceptable. As far as measurements go I used a level across the two matching holes on either side and made sure my distance from the firewall were exact, I also fit the fender on it and it all fit good. Pretty scary for me for the first time cutting off material like this, hopefully it will be okay. I did not fit the decklid because it is a little bent right now, there are some seam cracks I still need to weld but hey, it should be okay.
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73 Camper Tin Top/Type 4 1.8 engine, Single progressive EMPI carb, electronic ignition SVDA W/ Vacuum.

Really appreciate what Everett has done here. Almost like he hand picked some of you. I am very thankful for all the help I get here.

[starved-artist]

Nice work. After a few panel replacements, you won't be as apprehensive and your confidence will build.
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Troy

'67 Type 1
'08 Jetta Wolfsburg Edition

"For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also." - Matthew 6:21

[beetlenut]

As long as you fit the fender on it, and all the fender mounting bolts mated up with the fender bolt holes, you should be good to go.
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scrapyards are for quitters
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[oldmanmark]

staight cuts and whatever works to hold panels in place, getting them lined up. looks good in your pic.

[therealfrogman]

Another question. I have purchased a flanging punch tool and I am considering using flanges to weld up the new wheel section instead of butt welding it....

Any opinions on that approach?
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73 Camper Tin Top/Type 4 1.8 engine, Single progressive EMPI carb, electronic ignition SVDA W/ Vacuum.

Really appreciate what Everett has done here. Almost like he hand picked some of you. I am very thankful for all the help I get here.

[johnshenry]

[therealfrogman]

johnshenry, thank you for the insight! Will take the advise.
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73 Camper Tin Top/Type 4 1.8 engine, Single progressive EMPI carb, electronic ignition SVDA W/ Vacuum.

Really appreciate what Everett has done here. Almost like he hand picked some of you. I am very thankful for all the help I get here.

[ateneo]

therealfrogman,

Like you, I am also preparing to venture into doing my own body repair on my VWs. I have never done it before and so I am a bit scared.

I am slowing buying equipment like an 80-gallon compressor and some air tools. I know a little bit about butt welding because I have been practicing during my free time with my MIG welding.

Hopefully within a month or two, I will be set to start the scary part of this whole experience and that is I will start cutting through the body of my 1971 Westy.

I am forced to learn this myself after a bad experience with a restorer who did a bad job on one of my VWs. Though it was a bad & sad experience for me, I am trying to turn that bad experience into fueling my desire to learn how to do auto body repair.

ONce I start working on my VW, I will post pictures of my progress (or blunder) and hopefully get tips from kind hearted & helpful VW hobbyists

I found a restorer who seemed to be good in giving tips. Here is his forum:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=543445

[Dresden]

I'm about to do this same thing on the driver's side, thanks for the pics frogman! I'm also a visual kind of guy so this helps a great deal. I've welded a lot, just not on cars and thin set metal they're built out of, so the thinner metal has me a little apprehensive.
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"Don't be stubborn and rake all the skin from your knuckles, contort your shoulders out of place and throw out your back... Just go ahead and pull the motor. You will thank yourself later!

[Bntbrl]

Most welded on panels should overlap 50mm. Some people don't like doing so but it makes it easier to align, esp. if there are holes that you can overlap to use for lining up.

I worked in a production autobody shop so I couldn't buttweld panels if I wanted to. Overlapping them you will be able to weld with plugwelds and it will be easier to align, weld, and dress.

Use putty or filler to smooth out your panel like any other part of your repair. If you take some reasonable time you wont notice it. If you just seam seal it you can see it.

Also look for factory seams, if you can find a breaking point drill it out and go from there. Drill out or cut off and leave enough to overlap a couple inches. U

Use weld through primer on your cleaned surface, align them and clamp them. You can also use self tapping sheet metal screws to line up and hold.

Butt welding created localized heat if you run a straight bead. Weld an inch or so and then move to the other side to allow it to cool. Then return back and forth. Itll help keep the panel from moving if you buttweld it.
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1984 Vanagon Westfalia 1.9 wbx

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