Megasquirt Shopping list?

[gtixpress]

Does anyone have a basic "shopping list" for the parts needs to get Megasquirt running with ignition only? I thought the EDIS system was needed, but that seems to not be the case any more. I don't need sequential, as wasted spark will do. The motor is a mild 1776cc with dual Dell 40's.

These are the things that come to mind:
Megasquirt ECU - MS2 or above, correct?
VR sensor
Coil pack
Plug wires
Trigger wheel - already have this

Down the road I would like to get the fuel injection side going, but that won't be for a very long while.

Thanks!
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Joe P.
1969 VW Type 3 Squareback
2002 VW GTI 337 (Limited Edition)
2018 VW Atlas SE VR6 4Motion
2019 VW Beetle S Final Edition Convertible

[Tramsdisciple]

user supaninja has a link on mis postings that break down the parts and cost for each of the parts. Try to hook up with it and im sure he can help you out with the mapping as well..
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[Nate M.]

The parts you list are pretty much all you need to get the job done with the exception of the factory Ford EDIS brain & plug assembly with as long of leads as you can get for splicing.

I would also recommend picking up the relay board in either kit form or complete. This will make it easier to wire everything now and in the future when you decide to go full EFI. You can use it to run an electric carb fuel pump now, like the CB rotary pump. Also pick-up a 12' wiring harness (the basic wires that are all labeled every couple inches). Again, use what you need now and you'll have the rest for later when you go full EFI.

You can pick up a set of plug wires from a Crown Vic or other V-8 EDIS powered car out of the wrecking yard when you get the coil pack and the EDIS brain (you still need the factory Ford brain and plug). This will give you a wide selection of long wires with the correct EDIS coil pack plugs that you can cut to fit on the VW and screw in the plug-ends of a set of Bosch wires and air seals.

Hope this helps. . . Good Luck!!
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Regards,

Nate M.

Squarsche build
Heavy Metal Affliction feature

For heaven's sake, put a type4 and a Porsche 5-speed in there. . . It's the right thing to do!!

[vdubin]

You do not need the edis ford module. If you use the msns software and wire up the second coil driver.

http://www.msextra.com/doc/general/sparkout.html
http://www.diyautotune.com/softwarelinks.htm

[supaninja]

Any of the MS's will work for ign only, I'm using a MS1 v3.0 and it's direct firing my gsxr coils. It's tough to make a shopping list because it's such a flexible management system you can literally make anything work

for a wasted spark ign, trig wheel and either a VR or Hall sensor. VR sensors have been getting a bad rap lately but my 24 year old mustang vr sensor works flawlessly even after a close encounter with the trigger wheel the one time it fell off.

then the big decision is coils. I'm using cheap used gsxr coils ($10 on ebay all day), but they are not self exciting so you will either need to add coil drivers or one of these beauties http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/quadspark-four-channel-ignition-module-p-481.html (I got one to drive the stock coils on my honduh motor for the bay window)

the current hawt coil setup is http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/ign1a-race-coil-p-394.html super powerful and self exciting so no need to add coil drivers (I have a set for the notch, just haven't had time to install them)

before you purchase anything from diyautotune, contact Mario at http://thedubshop.net/, he is a authorized dealer and a good guy. (that was a cheap plug for my buddy )
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Nick
Megasquirted Type 4 powered Notch http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=427890&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Blog of Doom http://supaninjanick.wordpress.com/

[vlad01]

I like the GM coils. and you can use GM 4 cylinder ignition module but I am not familiar with them.

here they are know as the camira module as they come from camiras. Don't know what they would be in over in the states?


like this i guess

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/CAD-Quality-Ignition-Mo...19ced6fbf0

[Willo357]

Another option is to get any megasquirt V3 board version and directly fire the stock coil using the inbuilt bp373 circuit through pin 36 , this way it isnt wasted spark, rather the distributor connects the coil to the correct spark plug like normal but the ecu is firing the coil not the points. you can take the points out if you like (like i did) but you dont have to. just make sure insulate the normal points wire and dont connect it to the coil.

this way all you need is

ecu
trigger wheel
hall or VR sensor, (Im using VR and its fine with noise filtering on)
stock coil
any distributor that will fit

i always get at least 7ms dwell which is my maximum so (set limit) so im always getting perfect spark but COP are more fun..... so it all much a muchness

with spark control alone you will gain alot of benifits
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[Intrinsic]

I have an MS on my 70 Fastback, running fuel and spark. PM me if you have any questions.

Check out the MicroSquirt, if you are using an external coil driver it might be all you need. You could save a few bucks and, being waterproof, its easier to locate.

[75smith]

1. MegaSquirt ECU $150(MS I-V2.2)
2. Stimulator )
3. Relay
4. Relay Cable
5. Intake Air Sensor
6. Coolant/Head Temp
7. O2 Wideband Sensor
8. VW EDIS Setup
9. EDIS Setup
10. CB Performance manifold
11. Fuel rails
12. TB(used)
13. TB New
14. Injectors(24-30#)need 4
15. Narrowband O2 sensor

this was my list, ignore some of the doubles, like narrowband and wideband O2 sensors, you only need one, when I made the list I made a cheapo list with the want list-

this list covers the fuel injection too, but I find if you want to do something, just do it
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My engine build

[gtixpress]

Thanks for the info. Definitely sheds some light on things. So the big thing it seems is to stick a version 3.0 board when getting Megasquirt. And I basically need to decide between either MS1 or MS2. I had thought about using some old COPs that I have from my GTI, but they won't clear the carb manifolds. So I'm thinking either a normal 4-port coil or CNPs. When running multiple coils like CNPs, is there anything to watch out for versus a single coil?

supaninja - Can you post a link to the GSXR coils? I just want to make sure I'm looking at the right parts.

For those running on a Type 3, where do you have your VR sensor mounted? Mounting it in the timing hold seems to be popular.

Edit: In looking at the MS1 specs on diyautotune.com, it shows that it can be upgraded to MS2 to allow "Ignition control (full spark timing advance control, dwell control, etc) for one coil/distributor and EDIS systems." So how does that feature differ from what MS1 does natively?
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Joe P.
1969 VW Type 3 Squareback
2002 VW GTI 337 (Limited Edition)
2018 VW Atlas SE VR6 4Motion
2019 VW Beetle S Final Edition Convertible

[miniman82]

[Dale M.]

[Willo357]

[miniman82]

There's nothing *wrong* with still using the distributor, so long as the crank angle is still used in timing calculations. If you ask me though, it doesn't make a lot of sense to keep it when you could have a maintenance free coil pack instead. For the nostalgic look? The slop in the timing gears is what gets the engine into trouble with scatter, do away with that by going with crank angle (VR) sensor and the problem goes away.
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[Dale M.]

[miniman82]

Dale,


There's nothing wrong with DISTRIBUTING the spark with a distributor, so long as a crank angle sensor is used in the actual timing calculations. There will not be any scatter or anything else instroduced by the distributor, it will be just as accurate as an EDIS system. It might lose a little voltage vs a coil pack, but we're talking about a carb'd engine here so I doubt it will notice.
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[clonebug]

I ran ignition only for 2 years on my blow through carbed tubo buggy.

I bought a used MS1 ver 2.2 from Mario with a direct plugged harness.

It had a couple grounds, an IAT, Pip, Saw and power soldered direct to the 37 pin plug.
Here is the business end of the harness. The extra red wire is signal for the O2 sensor.

I did not use a relay board and feel none is needed unless you go FI.

I used an EDis coil, VR sensor and Module which I found locally and I picked up a Pulley and trigger wheel combo off of STF.

I built all the brackets myself and I figure I might have had $350.00 into it by the time all was said and done.

I too suggest calling Mario....he might have a used MS for sale and can set you up with whatever you need.

Direct fire is probably the way to go now, but the price will go up accordingly.
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[Willo357]

the accuracy with my system is just as accurate as with COP or any other spark system.

Im running a VR sensor on a trigger wheel this gives me CAD on the crank shaft. I then control the stock coil using MS2-extra. however the MS only knows the CAD it dosnt know which cylinder it is firing. ... now stay with me here, the coil is directly connected to the distributor like normal. I have totally removed the rotor plate, points and all that junk (but you dont have to) so all that is happening is the distributor is connecting the coil to the correct spark plug according to the firing order. (which never changes) there is absolutly no input by the coil to controlling the spark timing it all comer from the accurate trigger wheel setup.

Next up, the quality of the spark is directly related to the correct dwell time. e.g. 7ms for the stock coil is maximum charge without burning the coil but 6 is just as good. so long as there is sufficient time between ignition events to charge the coil for 6ms the spark will be the best it can be.

now if you do the math there is 6ms available at 5000rpm and 7.5 at 4000. my rev limiter is set at 4500 so there is always enough time available give or take spark duration.

The whole point of COP sequential or even wasted spark is to increase the time available for dwell. e.g. wasted spark has twice the time available and COP four times. This is useful for high rpm or when there is more cylinder but as the numbers shown above demonstrate that for a four banger at 5000rpm there is consistently perfect spark with full mapping control.

you dont always have to spent big $$$ on fancy coils if your staying at lower RPM
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[Willo357]

I hope this helps the OP
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[Dale M.]