Winston Wehabilitated: Prologue

[msinabottle]

The time has... finally... FINALLY come. I have saved my pennies. I have saved other people's pennies. I have scrimped, scrounged and hoarded every penny. Also dollars, multiples thereof, and shiny things.

Next week, if the streets are clear enough for the Agilis not to do what they did HERE:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=276262

My shoulder still twinges... Winston will be going to this place:

Wheels Of Time, LLC
(303) 762-0196
2930 S Tejon St, Englewood, CO 80110-1315

Les, who runs the place, well, is the man primarily responsible for the salvage and restoration of Big Dodge, my beloved 1970 Dodge Dart Swinger:

I know these people very well, they have done other work for me, and the facility is very much up to Winston. I will keep you all apprised of what is going to be done with Winston, and how.

Here is what will happen as Les and I discussed it (for two hours!) last Tuesday:

1)Winston will come in and lose his exterior apparatus, I have left my Bentley and a CD of Winston's photographs with Les in the office. I have warned them about the almost entirely empty propane tank.

They will be leaving the fiberglass top, luggage rack, and tent on. Les was willing to pull it in order to paint the uppermost top, but after all the fun we had getting the new Atelier successfully installed, I'm willing to just let them paint from below the rain gutters down.

2)Winston will be driven to a facility nearby where he will be plastic bead-blasted from the rain gutters down. What lies under the Earl Scheib-grade 2nd coat, and the Arizona-ravaged original coat will be inspected. They will stud-pull out Winston's dents, such as this one:

and all the fun stuff going on here:

and here...

They will grind out his rust (stabilized seam rust behind the fridge and one 'blob' on the driver's side pillar) and use modern Bondo and Metal Glaze where they can't weld in new metal.

3)As per a suggestion by Mike Labate, they will weld a patch over where his antenna is NOW, and install a new one elsewhere. I'm thinking the opposite side.

4)I will make sure that they replace all the weather and window stripping with good quality replacement rubber. It needed to be done, the time has come to do it. Winston's interior paint is still in pretty good shape. It will be important to find something that matches his vintage Assuan Brown fairly closely for the interior/exterior contrast not to jar.

5)They will paint him, and clear-coat him. I am told it will take 1.5 gallons of paint, 1.5 gallons of primer, and 2 gallons of modern clear-coat. Les was emphatic that all must come from the same manufacturer to assure chemical harmony.

6)There is no #6.

7)Winston will then be beautiful. Outside, as well as inside. I've been feeling that he's something of a TARDIS currently.

Why am I bothering you all with this?



Well, for one, thing. I assume (after nearly 3,000 posts) that you still give a darn. Thought you'd like to know... For another...

A)Anybody want to recommend a currently available line of paint, primer, and topcoat to use? Les is open-minded, I told him I'd run it past you Vanacognoscenti.

B)Anybody want to chime in on the seals? I adore GoWesty, I actively LOVE Van Cafe, but with the Samba discount and the really good quality of the seals sold me already, I'm thinking Bus Depot.

C)Rocker panels. I am intrigued by this stuff:

http://3mcollision.com/3m-rocker-panel-coating-08889.html

Having his rocker panels coated with that and painted black appeals to me, practically and aesthetically.

D)Winston's winshield has two polymer-patched holes in it. Otherwise, it's in pretty good shape and I think has polarized glass in it--original. Should I get a new one, anyway?

E)Suggestions on the antenna?

F)What am I forgetting?



I'll be amazed, grateful, and pleased to get ANY good suggestions. But, I thought I would solicit them. I shall browse, I shall search, but here is the start of the project, I shall take you all along, with photos, to the conclusion.

Best!
_________________
'Winston,' '84 1.9 WBX Westy
Vanagon Poet Laureate: "I have suffered in
many ways, but never, never, never in silence."

[Bman]

Nice, I just finished something close to this with my 84 Doka recently. I applaud your decision to replace all your window seals, nothing says new and sparkly like new paint AND new seals. I got my seals from a mix match of used (wing windows), and new (busdepot, gunzel [those hard to find doka seals] and GW); I opted to move far away from the chrome in rubber look to the "euro" (all black) seal look. What are you planning on?

While you have it in the shop, plan for and save for the unexpected (extra work), it happens. Ask your body shop to get the van on a lift and poke around on the underside, looking for rust and or undercoating failure/absence. I had my shop spot blast and then coat a few spots that had lost the undercoating and sprouted a few surface rust areas; give a good check around the tranny mount area.

I also took off my wiper arms and had them powder coated during the job. I also replaced all the little trim pieces as well: wiper screw caps, fuel filler neck housing, grill clips, A pillar molding, rain gutter molding and grills. Of course you will do what your budget can afford, but at least go for the little stuff. Great time to source out Stainless Steel screws for your grills/lights and new camper specific stickers as well.

Yes I know it all adds up, but man will it be sweet when your done. Good luck and excited to follow.
_________________
~Bryan
1990 Burgandy Tintop (Wife's Daily Driver)
1989 Tiico Westfalia "Taj"




2WD Doka build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=503578&highlight=
FaceHook:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/VW-T3-DokaSinka/129026087217120?ref=hl

[randywebb]

how about that nice stock bronze color?

mine is Merian - maybe worse than Asuan - and I always envy the bronze Vanagons I see driving down the street (actually, I envy any Vanagon that consistently drive down a street under its own power)...
_________________
1986 2.1L Westy 2wd Auto Trans.

[dobryan]

Rob, Yaaaay for Winston!
_________________
Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru EJ25 and Peloquin TBD

"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson

MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646

Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371

The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794

[r39o]

Is there a reason "you" yes, you, are not removing parts yourself? You saved pennies but are losing dollars by not doing the simple, time consuming tasks your self, buddy. You have a garage to store the bits, I see. Waz da problem, dude?

Next, color changes are not wise unless the color is extremely hideous and you paint everything / everywhere in a totally empty van.

As far as material product lines go, you should let the shop shoot what they know best. I am not sure a 2 stage is the best, but that is what is typically done today, BUT, and it is a BIG one, I have found attempting single stage formulations do not produce good matches when translated to dual stage. Point of reference: it took several mixes to get a single stage white to be right when done in base coat / clear coat. WHAT a pain....

I hope your REALLY want this, cause, if you are at all paranoid, you will go over the edge once the van has new paint..... NOTE: the first scratch, dent will make you cry. Then it is a who cares after that. Some A..hole egged one of my freshly painted vans once.....TRAUMATIC, I tell you what.

Good Luck, bro.
_________________
"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)

[luVWagn]

I didn't catch if you're yanking the interior and dealing with everything from the inside too?
_________________
'91 Syncro 16 Reimo Hightop Conversion, eTDI

[dobryan]

[70coupyel]

I got my seals from VC. The guy that installed my new windshield said it was good rubber. Get a new windshield. Nothing like clear vision with new glass.
Get all of the rear windows tinted while they are out. This way your seals will go over the tint.a lot cleaner. Pop top seal you want the one with the alumium clips molded into the seal. Rebuilt your sliding windows while they are out. Get all body trim parts(door handles.wipers.wing window uprightetc.) painted in the booth with good paint or powder coated. This did not happen with mine and it's a shame that not all the outside parts were not painted with good paint. Make sure they spend exrta time cleaning out and preping the rain gutters. This is the one area that alway sees water. Buy new side marker and front turn signals. Get your hands on a new front mud flap now. Hard to come by but I did find a new one. Basicly all the small suff on the outside that you get find new do it. It really make the whole van look really fresh.
Do you really think Winston will be happy not being Aswian Brown on the outside?
_________________

[16CVs]

Will you be converting it to all black window seals or restoring to original Chrome ? If you are going to dump the chrome then realize that the vent glass seals will have to be replaced as well . I pulled my vent assemblies apart and had them powdered along with my door handles and wiper arms . The only exterior items I forgot to do and I just now realized it are the sliding window outside screw plates . The sliding door handle has a plastic filler on the back side which is a bear to get out ,but will not survive powder coating . I also took the sliding door hinge apart and had the hinge done as well .
Will you be removing the squirters as well . These are designed to twist out with a 1/4 turn . When removing them do not let the hose fall inside .
Find some way to tie them off and keep them at the top . You can push the wiper shafts in enough to get the seal off and the new ones in .
What are your plans for the bumpers ? They may look good now ,but once the van is painted they will look substandard . I removed the Licence plate door as well , so that you get complete prep and paint coverage .
Make sure that they paint inside the rear vents ,as my guys missed it. I just had to polish it inside and it looks OK .
Definitely replace the front glass ,no matter how good you think it looks . I would think of Updating the mirrors to power units at the same time , way better even if not hooked up .
I like the Stainless screw upgrades as well , I run them on everything that comes my way .
Will you be painting the wheels the correct Silver and dumping the Black Darth Vader look ?
I am on the final end of a complete tear down with rust repair ,door jambs and front doors inside and out . This is all very fresh in my mind . I should be in the garage putting mine back together right now .
If you had your Dart done ,I am sure you know that there will be lots of surprises and some little gotchas that you thought would be OK until you start to put it back together.
Keep us updated with progress photos along the way .

Stacy
_________________
1987 Syncro Westfalia Triple knob (bastard)
1989 Syncro Tristar Triple knob "Swedish"
2013 Jetta Hybrid a true "Zwitter"
Samba member # 14980
Call anytime number 650 722 4914 .
Keep Your van running and upkept tastefully for the love of the hobby.
Don't let your van end up in an "abortions" thread.

[FNGRUVN]

[msinabottle]

I thought you all would chime in. Thank you. I shall try to answer all the questions honestly, and coherently. I shall probably fail at the latter.

Bman--I will not be replacing the chrome in the window seals. The chrome chrome looks good on the front windows, but I guess I'll lose that when I replace the seals. I can cope or possibly just keep the front crhome. My seals last a long time because I coat them more than once a year with baby oil, which does a lot to keep them flexible. Winston's wiper arms and handles have been powder coated, it is holding up VERY well. The replacement stickers are bought, every external screw I've ever removed has been replaced with a stainless one--I will check the rear and running lights, though, but I think I did it then. We have even worked out the pattern for a decal to replace the external Westfalia build sticker.

Randywebb--the goal is to keep the external as close to the internal as possible, so it's Assuan Brown, or a variant mixed for blending, but probably not. PPG seems to be the paint of choice here on the Samba, although DuPont Imron is formidable. I don't think my bodyman will want to apply something for which you need a suit and respirator. I'll ask him, though.

Dave--you are and remain one of the nicest and most technically skilled people to drive a Vanagon. Thinking of the sad fate of the beautiful red van, I'm going to replace Winston's fuel lines with metal Polyarmor lines, and I'm wondering if manual valves in the fuel and return lines would also be a good idea.

r39o--Oh, great Guru of all things Boxy and Slow--if I let my bodyman pull and replace the externals, if they scratch the paint or muss it up, it will be their problem, Les is like that, and they will have the stuff at hand when they want to reinstall it. There will be NO color changes, the goal is to minimize those. I know about the agony of restorations, and the curse. But Winston needs his dignity back.

luVWagn , Dave--I did tell Les about the panel and seam, they have the text on how to remove the refrigerator. I do think I stabilized the rust years ago, when I pulled Winston's fridge, soaked the area with phosphoric acid, then sealed it with with Hammerite and Mercury Corrosion additive. If they do need to pull the kitchen, they have my Bentley--and a link to... the Samba. And (I am cunning) this thread.

70coupyel, I dislike tinting, it went... VERY bad on Winston, and I had a horrid time removing it, but I will talk to my 'glass guy,' ideally that will be the superlative Kenny Shock, on the windshield and the tinting. It is tempting to have them weld up the window behind the cabinet, though. I have the good Bus Depot seal on Winston's pop top, one of the reasons I'm loath to let them remove the fiberglass. That was all pretty epic. I did get a new front mudflap, it's still in good shape and can come off and on again. The turn signals are pretty good, actually. Winston shall remain Assuan Brown. The color kind of grows on one, and it is NOT more of the same. Thank you for the wise advice.

Vwcrewman, you are wise to remind me of the front windshield nozzles--I have gotten those to work pretty well, but it might be just as wise to replace them with new ones, or the best of the 'two nozzle' solutions we discussed here on the boards. I LIKE the chrome on the front windows and no where else... I shall have to decide. Winston's alloy wheels are in pretty good shape, I can touch them up if they get scuffed... I will order new rain gutter trim and have that permanently attached after the paint with 3M Weather Stripping adhesive.

The bumpers... I do like my monster wrap-around rear bumper, which did a pretty good job of protecting Winston when he got rear-ended last summer. His front Chrome bumper is intact and attractive, but... I will have a look at the Rocky Mountain Westy bumpers. There is nobody better that I know of in this area, and the Labate Bros. are friends. Terry Kay has on another thread suggested Rhino Hyde for Winston's rocker panels, I will investigate that further.

FNGRUVN--it's going to be a ride, but Les and I know and trust each other, I can get to the shop in 20 minutes for decisions or responses, and you've seen Winston's paint. Or lack thereof.

From a non-Samba reader, I have two suggestions on the antenna! One is this:

http://tinyurl.com/aa3y3jd

and another is this:

http://tinyurl.com/bcc25nq

His suggestion is to mount such under the luggage rack. I worry about a source of 12VDC for either, but completely out of sight is a lovely thought.

I will keep the updates coming. It's comforting to know that you guys are watching my back. I'll pull over in a bit so you can pass.

Best!
_________________
'Winston,' '84 1.9 WBX Westy
Vanagon Poet Laureate: "I have suffered in
many ways, but never, never, never in silence."

[shadetreetim]

Glad to hear you're keeping Winston Assuan Brown, one of my favorite colors. I hope you'll post pictures as Les massages Winston to perfection, it will be fun to watch the progress.
_________________
Tim Potts

Doing my best every time I drive it to dispel the myth these Vanagons have to be slow!


'89 Vanagon Bluestar/Country Homes 1.8T & .77 4th
'74 Jeep CJ5

[IdahoDoug]

Rob,

I'm going to try to talk you out of painting your rockers black. Ready?

First, you are going to end up with a beautiful and cosmetically stunning Vanagon when this process is over. People will point at it and come out of coffee shops to look it over. It just seems right that the look should be one of the factory original appearance with the rocker panels painted the body color as VW stylists intended. In my opinion, a car body freshly painted down to the bottom emphasizes the clean and fresh nature of a well cared for vehicle.

As for black rockers. To me, they say "My car's lower body was rusty and I could not afford to fix it properly, so I got a can of bondo and some black Rustoleum." It is a very common home-brew fix in rust country. Tape off the rusty rockers and paint them black because you couldn't afford to do it right. Heck, look at the Samba ads and you'll see the rusty lurker Vanagons with home job painted rockers. So I urge you not to do it. Don't make Winston wear the "dark socks in running shoes" look.

DougM
_________________
1987 2WD Wolfsburg Vanagon Weekender "Mango", two fully locked 80 Series LandCruisers. 2017 Subaru Outback boxer. 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20V with rear locking differential, 1990 burgundy parts Vanagon. 1984 Porsche 944, 1988 Toyota Supra 5 speed targa, 2002 BMW 325iX, 1982 Toyota Sunrader

[Jake de Villiers]

[luVWagn]

[JPrato]

[dobryan]

[FNGRUVN]

There's a product called Gravel Guard, you can buy it at your local PPG automotive paint store, it's a rubbery, spray that dries hard and you can paint over it. Best of both worlds. You get to keep your color and protect the rockers from rock chips.

Rob, you should at least take the front luggage compartment off(takes about 15 minutes) and check for rust, rock chips right above windshield, and remove all the dirt and debris that has collected over the years. They could easily paint this area while they're there.

Slippery slope, indeed.
_________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin

[BillWYellowstone]

On the antenna question, I would go with an electric that nests flush. vs the electronic type. In all my antenna work, longer is better. Then again, I mainly use my iPod, I can't find many stations I like.

I would go with passenger side, or just stick to stock.
_________________
Live Fulltime in motorhome
Have 86 Westy Camper 2.1 rebuilt
Work in Yellowstone NP year round.

[dobryan]