Removing the tricky starter bolt on my 70' single cab

[minimember]

I'll keep it short. I just bought a 70' single cab, and it needs a new starter. I can feel the 17mm nut that's hidden behind the fan shroud and I can get both a wrench and socket wrench on it, but am having a hard time getting enough torque to loosen it with either. Has anyone been able to change their bus starter without dropping out the engine, and if so, whats the trick???

Thanks in advance,
Craig

[Tom Powell]

[minimember]

Thanks for the advice. Perhaps my closed end wrench is not beefy/long enough. Perhaps i'll try a breaker bar next, or just go out and buy the store's longest 17mm wrench. Silly question, but just to make sure: What is the correct direction to turn that nut to loosen it (assume counter-clockwise)Also, I read about people refitting longer hex bolts with washers for re-install to avoid having always go behind the shroud for future removal...your thoughts?

[minimember]

Thanks for the advice. Perhaps my closed end wrench is not beefy/long enough. Perhaps i'll try a breaker bar next, or just go out and buy the store's longest 17mm wrench. Silly question, but just to make sure: What is the correct direction to turn that nut to loosen it (assume counter-clockwise)Also, I read about people refitting longer hex bolts with washers for re-install to avoid having always go behind the shroud for future removal...your thoughts?

[bigbore]

God this isn't hard I have done HUNDREDS of those bolts without a problem go get yourself a gearwench you mite as well start getting some decent wenches you will have the nut off in no time and back on and as for which way for the nut to come off Iam scared to answer that to someone doesn't know and is trying to fix ---------------you know no matter how Iam going to answer this Iam going to sound like a ass well it happens some times when a stupid question gets asked------twice sorry.
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[chrisgilmour]

-take the closed end of the wrench place it on the nut behind the shroud, and brace it against something so it can't spin and fall off.

-crawl under the bus, and laid right under the trans, with my head to wards the back and took my left hand and ran it up and over the trans to the other side with the starter. i then used a wrench to loosen it from that side. eventually i heard the wrench in the engine bay drop and i was able to just remove the starter and bolt

[Tom Powell]

[ccpalmer]

[aeromech]

anyone been able to change their bus starter without dropping out the engine

The top D headed bolt holding the starter in place must come out to drop the engine so your thinking is off.

I read about people refitting longer hex bolts with washers for re-install to avoid having always go behind the shroud for future removal...your thoughts?

Later cases used a captured nut that the drivers side upper bolt attaches to. The upper starter bolt always uses a nut from behind the fan shroud. I've seen early cases moded for the drivers side but never on the passenger side
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[busdaddy]

Agreed, so unless someone has put a reeeaallly long bolt with a bunch of carefully cut down washers under the head to defeat the bump for the D head it's futile attacking from the starter side.
If that nut is putting up a fight put the box end of your 17mm combination wrench on it at around the 10:00 position, then hook the box end of another largish wrench into the open end (turn bonus wrench sideways with the box end angled up), the added length gives you enough leverage. Lift up on the end of the second wrench to loosen.
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[dugfresh]

Just r&r'd mine, but on a T4. Sounds exactly the same just my S boot was in the way. Could have worked around it but why bother. Just remove the items that are in the way and get it done. Reinstallation will be much easier if you can actually See your work. And don't overthink how bolts turn, you'll make yourself dizzy.
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[aeromech]

You've gotta get animal on it sometimes. Busdaddy's idea with the wrenches is a good one and Tom Powell suggested using something under the D head to keep that bolt in place. I have a hunk of some stuff we used to call Gorilla Snot. I place a bead of that under the D and slide the bolt into the hole. It keeps the bolt from pushing forward when you're stuggling to get the nut started. I usually clean up the bolt theads real nice too so the nut threads on easily by hand.
_________________
Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound

[Red Fau Veh]

Just remembered that in a 73 and newer bus, you get to access that nut from the top engine access hole, really easy in those years to grab that nut.
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1969 Adventurewagen blue whale Gene Berg 1776 built by Dave Kawell dual 36 DRLA's, Vintage Speed exhaust, Bosch 019 screamer
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[SGKent]

Put a long 17mm or 11/16 box end on it, reaching around the engine shroud. It is easier if the apron is already off. Use a mechanics rag wrapped around the handle or gloves if it is too hard on the hands to turn it. As you unscrew it keep the wrench a little cocked with the top out so it grabs the nut. Keep a little pressure pulling towards you as you turn it and that will keep the D Head from sliding out on the other side and spinning. Do the same when you put it back. Once you have done it a couple times you will get the hang of it. Also, on some engines as mentioned the driver's side is a pressed in nut that is part of the case so you remove the top bolt on the driver's side from under the car. Pull the motor mounts last and MAKE SURE you have something like a heavy rope or chain supporting the trans. Do not let it dangle on the front mount when you remove the engine or you will bend the shift rod.
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“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin

[bsairhead]

I took a chunk of 1/2 inch EMT i had laying around, I'm an electrician. Put a little dent in it so it made a press on fit on my ratchet handle. Leverage is a wonderful thing.

[Desertbusman]

[TomWesty]

[bigbore]

[aeromech]

I turn into vwdubtech

Not possible bro
_________________
Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound

[bigbore]