| Author |
Message |
Skyline
Samba Member
Joined: August 25, 2012
Posts: 129
Location: Middle Tennesse
|
 Posted: Tue Aug 27, 2013 9:07 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
Not likely for the wheel well.
With the overhang of the wheel arch and the wheel itself blocking the air from getting into that area, it will be effectively still air. The air ripping by at 60mph will not want to bend into the wheel opening, it will want to continue on by.
Sealing like you indicated to force all the air through the radiator instead of around it will maximize the flow you do get. Even front mounted radiators are sealed, like you indicated.
Best option is a scoop like the split windows run. Have it stick out about 2 inches from the body, or make the factory scoops stick out more. Somebody here showed clear plastic extensions to the factory scoop that might help.
Think about the physics of how the air flows and how OEM's engineer the radiator placement. If they could close that giant hole on the front of the car, they would do it immediately for MPG reasons. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Stuartzickefoose
Samba Post Whore
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 10350
Location: SoCal for now...
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mojogoat
Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2013
Posts: 440
Location: Norcal
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 27, 2013 10:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| What about mounting the radiator on the engine compartment door area as some of the diesel pushers do, leaving a little room on top for motor access Behind the bus is a low pressure area plus you could mount a fan on the motor. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Stuartzickefoose
Samba Post Whore
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 10350
Location: SoCal for now...
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 27, 2013 10:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| mojogoat wrote: |
| What about mounting the radiator on the engine compartment door area as some of the diesel pushers do, leaving a little room on top for motor access Behind the bus is a low pressure area plus you could mount a fan on the motor. |
'
i have not seen this work positively, as the air pressure doesnt flow through. your fans do a lot of the work...but it is doable.
_________________
Stuart Zickefoose
2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual
206-841-7324
[email protected] |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
Actually, that is one of the other reasons I don't want it down there.
I have a set of those too, along with the under dash stuff and a TDI motor with a compressor. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Stuartzickefoose
Samba Post Whore
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 10350
Location: SoCal for now...
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
| vwwestyman wrote: |
Actually, that is one of the other reasons I don't want it down there.
I have a set of those too, along with the under dash stuff and a TDI motor with a compressor. |
your the second person who iv suggested that too who thinks im talking about AC.... i mean the guard over the breakable parts.....get a grill like that for the radiator, and put the radiator under the bus.  its a scoop, and a stone guard at the same time! 
_________________
Stuart Zickefoose
2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual
206-841-7324
[email protected] |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Stuartzickefoose wrote: |
| vwwestyman wrote: |
Actually, that is one of the other reasons I don't want it down there.
I have a set of those too, along with the under dash stuff and a TDI motor with a compressor. |
your the second person who iv suggested that too who thinks im talking about AC.... i mean the guard over the breakable parts.....get a grill like that for the radiator, and put the radiator under the bus. its a scoop, and a stone guard at the same time! |
Right right right, but as I recall, those things took up a lot of space under the bus. I removed them years ago and stashed them away, so I don't remember exactly how big they were but I thought it was a fairly significant part of the space under the bus.
Would there be room for the radiator and condensers? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Stuartzickefoose
Samba Post Whore
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 10350
Location: SoCal for now...
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
| vwwestyman wrote: |
| Stuartzickefoose wrote: |
| vwwestyman wrote: |
Actually, that is one of the other reasons I don't want it down there.
I have a set of those too, along with the under dash stuff and a TDI motor with a compressor. |
your the second person who iv suggested that too who thinks im talking about AC.... i mean the guard over the breakable parts.....get a grill like that for the radiator, and put the radiator under the bus. its a scoop, and a stone guard at the same time! |
Right right right, but as I recall, those things took up a lot of space under the bus. I removed them years ago and stashed them away, so I don't remember exactly how big they were but I thought it was a fairly significant part of the space under the bus.
Would there be room for the radiator and condensers? |
if you scoot my condenser forward, and usually condensers are smaller than the radiators, then yeah there would be room. but you also need room for air to get out as well, i havent done any measuring or mock ups, so i honestly dont know, but it would be a tight squeeze.
_________________
Stuart Zickefoose
2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual
206-841-7324
[email protected] |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tristessa
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2004
Posts: 3992
Location: Portland, OR
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 8:05 am Post subject: |
|
|
| vwwestyman wrote: |
| Would there be room for the radiator and condensers? |
If you're careful with your radiator & condenser selection and placement, yes. I'm using a late-model V8 Ford Explorer radiator mounted about mid-way in the underfloor area, and have more than enough room between the rear of the radiator and the rear torsion housing for this 12x21 "universal" streetrod condenser I've been eyeballing:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Universal-AC-Condenser...mp;vxp=mtr
Condensers that will work are easy to find, underdash/overhead A/C units .. those are trickier. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
scirocco_crazy
Samba Member
Joined: March 27, 2011
Posts: 924
Location: Indiana
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| scirocco_crazy wrote: |
Keep up the good work, the rear mounted radiator does work. I am within 10 deg of it being perfect with 95 deg Florida weather. Once I put the oil cooler in it should keep my temps spot on. If your not doing a second scoop you will definitely need some shielding to help bring more air in.
Cheers |
Thanks! I've been watching your thread (though I don't think I've commented) primarily because I was wanting to see how you handled the cooling, plus, well, you've done quite a nice job. I feel like my bus is a big mess compared to how yours looks!
But I'm going to have to get mine going and wait awhile before even thinking about restoring the body.
I did run across this thread http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6824718#6824718 and the guy told me that he was doing fine with the rear radiator. This was the first TDI build I could find with success in that placement.
I received today an aluminum radiator to go with a big ole fan that came the other day which I think will help quite a bit. I'll be sure to create some kind of shrouding to keep the air going through the rad. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
scirocco_crazy
Samba Member
Joined: March 27, 2011
Posts: 924
Location: Indiana
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| vwwestyman wrote: |
| scirocco_crazy wrote: |
Keep up the good work, the rear mounted radiator does work. I am within 10 deg of it being perfect with 95 deg Florida weather. Once I put the oil cooler in it should keep my temps spot on. If your not doing a second scoop you will definitely need some shielding to help bring more air in.
Cheers |
Thanks! I've been watching your thread (though I don't think I've commented) primarily because I was wanting to see how you handled the cooling, plus, well, you've done quite a nice job. I feel like my bus is a big mess compared to how yours looks!
But I'm going to have to get mine going and wait awhile before even thinking about restoring the body.
I did run across this thread http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6824718#6824718 and the guy told me that he was doing fine with the rear radiator. This was the first TDI build I could find with success in that placement.
I received today an aluminum radiator to go with a big ole fan that came the other day which I think will help quite a bit. I'll be sure to create some kind of shrouding to keep the air going through the rad. |
This is what I used
[img]
[/img]
I would definitely enhance your scoop. It will help. Although the TDI generates far less heat than my power plant. You are on the right path. Make sure to seal the area off to ensure all the air only goes through the radiator.
[img]
I used adhesive backed foam[/img]
_________________
Current Build 1976 VW Bus Subaru with EZ36 https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=9443081#9443081
Second Current Build 1979 Porsche 911SC
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=10117349#10117349
Previous Builds 78 Westy with matching trailer
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=589790&highlight=westy
78 Bay with Acura 3.2 Type S engine
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516038&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 7:08 am Post subject: |
|
|
I don't have any exciting pictures, but yesterday I spend the day working through the engine wiring harness. I was able to trace all the wires and figure out which went where, and remove a bunch of wires for things that won't be used anymore to simplify things a bit.
I was even able to hook the proper wires to a battery, and make the thing start and idle while sitting on the garage floor!  That was pretty exciting! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
scirocco_crazy
Samba Member
Joined: March 27, 2011
Posts: 924
Location: Indiana
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:05 am Post subject: |
|
|
I prefer to buy my elephant already butchered, so I can pull out a steak and grill it up when I'm hungry!
Since I have most of the wires figured out, I ordered a cable with 12 conductors to carry all the needed signals to the front of the bus yesterday. I'm also working on tracking down the socket with the large spade terminals to wire up a glow plug relay.
Its hard to focus on work when I want to be working on my bus! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
scirocco_crazy
Samba Member
Joined: March 27, 2011
Posts: 924
Location: Indiana
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 10:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Scored a set on ebay today! Here is a (generic) pic of the ones that should be arriving on Thursday! Too bad it'll be awhile until I can run them...
Last edited by vwwestyman on Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 7:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
On the computer-controlled TDI mtotors, the accelerator is controlled through the ECU by a electric potentiometer rather than a cable and throttle butterfly or similar.
On the newer cars, the potentiometer is part of the accelerator pedal. On some conversions, including this one, the whole pedal would need to be utilized.
However, on the donor car the potentiometer is a separate part, attached to the pedal with a very short cable. I believe I could have used the later version like the above-mentioned, but wanted to use what I had.
I bought a marine-marked electrical box from Home Depot which has no openings, and a gasketed lid held on by screws. I then cut up the bracket that held the potentiometer, and welded a couple captive nuts to the bracket, so I could mount it inside the box with a couple bolts through holes drilled in what became the bottom of the box.
I drilled out the old little cable, and ran the bus' shortened accelerator cable and sheath into a hole drilled into the box.
The cam that the cable spins on can be removed and realigned so I used a barrel nut to secure the accelerator cable to the cam. After a tiny bit of bending to the pedal stop, it seems to fun from zero to full throttle with no problem.
Shows the cut up bracket, with nuts welded on.
Shows the potentiometer mounted in the box, on the frame. The wires will be connected and then the connector will be pushed back in behind the pot. I notched the top edge of the box for the wires to go through, and will seal it up with a smear of silicone. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
scirocco_crazy
Samba Member
Joined: March 27, 2011
Posts: 924
Location: Indiana
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 2:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| scirocco_crazy wrote: |
Good job on the wheels, you might need to order the 66mm studs for these for the front and 55mm for the rears, I also used a 1/4 in spacer in the front to clear the inner hub, check my thread for the pictures. |
Yeah, I'm pretty excited to get them in! So, you are saying that with the spacer on the front, machining is not required?
First I had heard of that, but if true very good news!
I haven't priced spacers but I bet that is cheaper than machining 4 wheels (so they can match and be rotated, etc) as well as essentially making those wheels unsaleable (or narrowing the potential market anyway) should I decide to change my mind in the future. Also would allow for the option of the small wheel cap, I bet. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
