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Brian
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Joined: May 28, 2012
Posts: 8340
Location: Oceanside
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Cusser
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006
Posts: 31361
Location: Hot Arizona
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 Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 7:17 am Post subject: |
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About 35 years ago, I remember tapping my brass fitting a tad to "distort" it, then putting on a tad (yes, tad again) of epoxy, and light tapping with hammer to re-insert. Then I put on safety wire...maybe before Glenn !!!
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1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297 |
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Tim Donahoe
Samba Member
Joined: December 08, 2012
Posts: 11740
Location: Redding, CA
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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I just got my Solex 34 PICT 3 back from Tim at Volkzbitz. The carb was in perfect shape--except I wanted the added safety of a threaded inlet.
So, off to Tim it went, and I got the carb back with an inlet that is not going to pop out on me.
I should have taken a picture, but was in a hurry to get my bug back together. Essentially, he taps the hole, installs the threaded inlet pipe (the pipe has a hump, by the way)--and he charges very little for this service.
I also removed my fuel filter from the engine bay (been meaning to do that for awhile) and installed it over the transmission.
The new fuel pump I installed has integral barbs, so there's really little chance of any fuel escaping into the engine area now.
Tim |
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planenut
Samba Member
Joined: April 12, 2012
Posts: 334
Location: Georgia
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| Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:23 am Post subject: Fuel leaks |
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| I would've installed a threaded fitting in my carb, but I can't find anyone with small enough pipe threads. A 1/8" NPT won't leave enough meat after you drill for it. I've never seen a smaller fitting. Don't know where Volksbitz gets his, but it's definately smaller. |
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VolkzBitz 
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2009
Posts: 300
Location: Washington State USA
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| Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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This is the one I do for $20 plus shipping.
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http://volkzbitz.com
Quality VW Solex carburetor restoration
[email protected]
Der Vergaser Meister |
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whiskeyandsawdust
Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2014
Posts: 9
Location: Las Vegas
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| Posted: Wed May 13, 2015 12:53 am Post subject: weber? |
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| is there a problem like this with the webers? |
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Scott Novak
Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2004
Posts: 1586
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 9:54 pm Post subject: Re: weber? |
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| whiskeyandsawdust wrote: |
| is there a problem like this with the webers? |
Not with the Webers that I'm familiar with as they all use threaded fittings.
Safety wire on the hose clamps of press fit tubes is just a bandaid fix at best. A tapped fitting with Loctite is probably the safest.
However, removing the tubes and reinstalling them with Loctite sleeve and bearing retainer is probably more than adequate and safer than depending on safety wire to try to hold in a tube that is known to come loose.
I remove the carb fuel inlet tube and Loctite them in place.
Now if you really want to be obsessive compulsive, use a tapped threaded fuel fitting with Loctite sleeve and bearing retainer applied and drill a hole through the hex of the fitting for a safety wire.
Scott Novak |
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bluebus86
Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010
Posts: 11075
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:04 pm Post subject: Re: weber? |
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| Scott Novak wrote: |
| whiskeyandsawdust wrote: |
| is there a problem like this with the webers? |
Not with the Webers that I'm familiar with as they all use threaded fittings.
Safety wire on the hose clamps of press fit tubes is just a bandaid fix at best. A tapped fitting with Loctite is probably the safest.
However, removing the tubes and reinstalling them with Loctite sleeve and bearing retainer is probably more than adequate and safer than depending on safety wire to try to hold in a tube that is known to come loose.
I remove the carb fuel inlet tube and Loctite them in place.
Now if you really want to be obsessive compulsive, use a tapped threaded fuel fitting with Loctite sleeve and bearing retainer applied and drill a hole through the hex of the fitting for a safety wire.
Scott Novak |
the safety wire does prevent the tube from coming out period. the tube can be as loose as can be but if safety wired correctly it can come out till the safety wire is cut away. I did use lock tite on the tubes that failed, but I also safety wired them so there is no possibility of a repeat failure ever.
This is no band aid fix, it is a very effective repair and proactive safety measure. The tubes can fail at anytime. a safety wire prevent a failure turning into a big fuel leak and fire risk.
I got all mine wired up whether they have a history of failing or not I was not about to try some pull test on each fitting and if I determine it passes not add a wire, now did I think it wise to pull out a well fitted tube just so I can add locktite but no safety wire.
one problem with a threaded fix is the that the tapered thread can exert tremendous force on the old, weaken, already stretched aluminum carb casting, and that could allow the casting to split. So you have to do the thread and torque the fitting down carefully. eventually the threaded fitting may loosen by the same process as the tube coming loose, the casting expands under stress. so your re-tighten the fitting on an even more stressed casting and you may end up cracking the casting. so use care.
_________________
Help Prevent VW Engine Fires, see this link.....Engine safety wire information
Stop introducing dirt into your oil when adjusting valves ... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=683022 |
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Harris
Samba Member
Joined: June 11, 2004
Posts: 1317
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:21 pm Post subject: Carb Tube Failure |
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| VolkzBitz wrote: |
This is the one I do for $20 plus shipping.
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Tim has done mine as well on the carb and fuel pump. I did the safety wire for years, but like Tim's very clean and proper way to keep the tubes in. This is not coming out. |
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bluebus86
Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010
Posts: 11075
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:45 pm Post subject: Re: Carb Tube Failure |
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| Harris wrote: |
| VolkzBitz wrote: |
This is the one I do for $20 plus shipping.
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Tim has done mine as well on the carb and fuel pump. I did the safety wire for years, but like Tim's very clean and proper way to keep the tubes in. This is not coming out. |
sure it is clean, nothing wrong with it, don't forget to do the pump if applicable I had one tube pullout of a pump, so I wire the pumps also as needed (some pumps have a one piece tube / body , no wire needed)
I simply disagree that the wire method is a "band aid' implying it less than adequate. I trust the wire method more than locktite alone the wire is a fail safe fix. The prior poster claimed that the wire method is less safe than lock tite, I disagree. Not knocking the threaded fix. but I am not satisfied with locktite alone as a repair
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Help Prevent VW Engine Fires, see this link.....Engine safety wire information
Stop introducing dirt into your oil when adjusting valves ... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=683022 |
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Scott Novak
Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2004
Posts: 1586
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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If you are worried about stressing the casting with a pipe fitting, don't tighten it very much and use Loctite sleeve and bearing retainer to seal and hold it in place. If you question the strength of the sleeve and bearing retainer, do a test and see if you can remove a threaded fitting without applying heat. In my test I destroyed the brass fitting and still wasn't able to remove it without applying heat.
Or use a straight threaded fitting with an O-Ring seal. That does require spot facing the carb inlet. But it is much better than a tapered pipe fitting which is dependent upon a thread sealant.
I've wired the carb inlet fitting via the hose clamp before as a temporary measure. But then I bought some Loctite sleeve and bearing retainer and fixed it properly.
Scott Novak |
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bluebus86
Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010
Posts: 11075
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Scott Novak wrote: |
If you are worried about stressing the casting with a pipe fitting, don't tighten it very much and use Loctite sleeve and bearing retainer to seal and hold it in place. If you question the strength of the sleeve and bearing retainer, do a test and see if you can remove a threaded fitting without applying heat. In my test I destroyed the brass fitting and still wasn't able to remove it without applying heat.
Or use a straight threaded fitting with an O-Ring seal. That does require spot facing the carb inlet. But it is much better than a tapered pipe fitting which is dependent upon a thread sealant.
I've wired the carb inlet fitting via the hose clamp before as a temporary measure. But then I bought some Loctite sleeve and bearing retainer and fixed it properly.
Scott Novak |
I have done the safety wire fix as a permanent measure, and find it very effective with little work nor cost.
I don't question that the threaded fitting is also a nice fix, I just don't consider the safety wire as a temporary band aid as you do. It is highly effective and easy to do. I have pulled the on a safety wire equipped fitting very hard and it wont budge. Do a test, you'll see, and if it fails, it is cause it was wired incorrectly.
I just simply don't want to do a threading job on my carbs and pumps and I found a very effective way of solving the problem and want to share it with all cause it can prevent engine fires. Not all folks have the time talent tools or money to have the tube(s) taped. many more folks can afford the wire method, can perform the wire method and it results in very little down time.
I could have done the tapping job, I got al the taps and drills, and end mill for a spot face for a gasket. and have a nice vertical milling machine to do the job, but I like the safety wire idea best for me.
do as you wish but the safety wire is not a band-aid repair nor limited as a temporary fix.
_________________
Help Prevent VW Engine Fires, see this link.....Engine safety wire information
Stop introducing dirt into your oil when adjusting valves ... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=683022 |
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Harris
Samba Member
Joined: June 11, 2004
Posts: 1317
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Sun Sep 13, 2015 4:48 pm Post subject: Fuel Pmp FAiluer |
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| Yes the safety wire works and is effective, but look like crap with present options. Cheap and home made ( I used it for years) but when something else is now available why not go with a professional look which is much more secure. |
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grandpa pete
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Joined: July 06, 2008
Posts: 6426
Location: St. Petersburg, FL
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Harris
Samba Member
Joined: June 11, 2004
Posts: 1317
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Sun Sep 13, 2015 5:22 pm Post subject: Fuel Pump |
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| grandpa pete wrote: |
| Next time you are at a swap meet see how many carbs have loose connections where the fitting is . |
That does not mean I'm observing smart people, I know a lot are out there. We are not driving model T's with bailing wire in the back seat with a pair of pliers for repair in the back seat. Still looks like crap regardless of how many you see. Other options are available. |
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oldhuldy67
Samba Member
Joined: November 25, 2008
Posts: 506
Location: somewhere with a southern exposure
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| Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 8:47 am Post subject: Re: Fuel Pump |
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| Harris wrote: |
| grandpa pete wrote: |
| Next time you are at a swap meet see how many carbs have loose connections where the fitting is . |
That does not mean I'm observing smart people, I know a lot are out there. We are not driving model T's with bailing wire in the back seat with a pair of pliers for repair in the back seat. Still looks like crap regardless of how many you see. Other options are available. |
Well, I certainly appreciate this post. But, for the record...after WW2 my Dad had one hand, and did drive a ModelT but that was long before I was a gleam in his good eye. He did drive a 64Type1. And he had a couple of wire coat hangers, a pair of pliers, a hammer and a roll of electrical tape and a roll of what he called"100 mile-an-hour" tape in the back seat...and, whenever we took a trip he loaded all 4 kids and a wife into that thing and I dont remember ever sitting beside the the road for very long...but I digress
Thanks for all the great posts on this subject...I'm wired.
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Currently:1980 Westy Westfalia Poptop (a total stock-look rebuild with all my favorite camping mods)
1967 stock Sunroof Beetle
Formerly:
1978 Westy Campmobile, the"EM50 Urban Assault Vehicle" code named "The Pickle"
1973 Squareback (sold on a lark)
1973 Super Beetle (crashed..walked away without a scratch)
1972 Standard Beetle (lost in a relationship..)
1966 Beetle (the Black Beauty, my Dad's)
1964 Beetle (the Beige Bug, my beginning beater, also my Dad's) Thanks, Dad. |
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bluebus86
Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010
Posts: 11075
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| Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:51 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Pump |
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| Harris wrote: |
| grandpa pete wrote: |
| Next time you are at a swap meet see how many carbs have loose connections where the fitting is . |
That does not mean I'm observing smart people, I know a lot are out there. We are not driving model T's with bailing wire in the back seat with a pair of pliers for repair in the back seat. Still looks like crap regardless of how many you see. Other options are available. |
To each their own, but a burned up VW looks a lot more like crap to me. safety wires work and can be done easily and cheap. and you can remove them for a show for the original look. if you got threaded fittings you wont look original unless you take effort to turn a custom threaded piece, but even then it might be detected as modified.
for an original look for a show, the safety wire method cant be beat, a pair of dykes can remove it pretty fast and a new wire can be re-installed pretty fast for the drive home from the show.
The method you showed in the photo wont pass for original any day, that crappy hex is totally out of place.
_________________
Help Prevent VW Engine Fires, see this link.....Engine safety wire information
Stop introducing dirt into your oil when adjusting valves ... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=683022 |
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Travis's 61
Samba Member
Joined: March 30, 2016
Posts: 5
Location: Warrensburg, Missouri
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| Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 5:51 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Pump Failure, Huge Leak, Safety Wire Fix |
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I know this is an old post but, that safety wire in the pic is definitely backwards.
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Rickles
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Joined: January 22, 2016
Posts: 213
Location: South Jersey
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| Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 3:01 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Pump Failure, Huge Leak, Safety Wire Fix |
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I assume this is stainles steel wire. Where can I get wire like that?
On the backwards part, what is backwards? Seems like tightening the screw it's mouted to would shorten the length of the wrapped wire. |
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bluebus86
Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010
Posts: 11075
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| Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 3:14 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Pump Failure, Huge Leak, Safety Wire Fix |
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| Rickles wrote: |
I assume this is stainles steel wire. Where can I get wire like that?
On the backwards part, what is backwards? Seems like tightening the screw it's mouted to would shorten the length of the wrapped wire. |
you can use stainless, some hotrod stores and aircraft stores will have proper safety wire. or some hardware store galvanized (zinc plated) steel wire will do. I used common hardware store zinc plated steel wire, I think the spool had 100 feet, a life time supply of safety wire for my VW carb.
You cant pull the hose off with good force once wired.
There safety wire photo really has nothing horribly wrong with it that would surely cause failure. However for better you could loop the wire to the other side of the screw so that it would tighten the screw if the wire was pulled towards the fuel hose, but either way should do enough to keep the hose and fitting from falling off the carb as there is not much slack in the wire so even if the screw moved there would probably be enough wire to hold the fuel inlet, but better to have zero slippage, so the other way appears better.
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Help Prevent VW Engine Fires, see this link.....Engine safety wire information
Stop introducing dirt into your oil when adjusting valves ... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=683022
Last edited by bluebus86 on Wed Apr 27, 2016 7:25 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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