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LSD for Bay?
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Martin Henriksson
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:19 am    Post subject: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

I tired to search but couldnt find any good info.

I know VW made transmissions with limited slip diff but they are impossible to find. Is it possible to find new LSD for Bay 002 trans anywhere?

Any good links on how to install one too?
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 10:51 am    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

http://www.evwparts.com/vwparts/091498006A.html
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:07 am    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

What are the advantages of this style of differential?
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:23 am    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

From Wickipedia: The main advantage of a limited-slip differential is demonstrated by considering the case of a standard (or "open") differential in off-roading or snow situations where one wheel begins to slip. In such a case with a standard differential, the slipping or non-contacting wheel will receive the majority of the power (in the form of low-torque, high rpm rotation), while the contacting wheel will remain stationary with respect to the ground. The torque transmitted by an open differential will always be equal at both wheels; if one tire is on a slippery surface, the supplied torque will easily overcome the available traction at a very low number. For example, the right tire might begin to spin as soon as 50lb-ft of torque is placed on it, since it is on an icy surface. Since the same amount of torque is always felt at both wheels, regardless of the speed which they are turning, this means that the wheel with traction cannot receive more than 50lb-ft of torque either, which is far less than is required to move the vehicle. Meanwhile, the tire on the slippery surface will simply spin, absorbing all of the actual power output (which is a function of torque provided over time), even though both wheels are provided the same (very low) amount of torque. In this situation, a limited-slip differential prevents excessive power from being allocated to one wheel, and so keeps both wheels in powered rotation, ensuring that the traction will not be limited to the wheel which can handle the minimum amount of power. The advantages of LSD in high-power, rear wheel drive automobiles were demonstrated during the United States "Muscle-Car" era from the mid 1960s through the early 1970s. It soon became apparent that "Muscle-Cars" with LSD or "posi" (positraction) were at a distinct advantage to their wheel-spinning counterparts.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:24 am    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

With LSD you don't get stuck! Power to both wheels!
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 12:47 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

LSD is amazing Very Happy

Seriously...I have a ZF in my 091. Great upgrade.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 12:48 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

Peloquin makes one new

Matt at AA transaxle has new ZF differentials available for 1600 or so.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 3:42 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

Thanks 70Crew! I understood positraction from my street race days, just didn't realize it was just a name for a limited slip differential.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:13 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

So if I had an LSD fitted to my 091, and a CV failed on a journey, could I in theory just disconnect / remove the offending CV and driveshaft and limp to safety / home on just the remaining driveshaft and CVs?
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 5:16 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

No. My cv broke on my while driving and I was moving down a long windy hill, I got it back up to 50 to coast and maintained 35 for 15 miles (out in the countryside lucky me) but once I came to a stop (forced via a stop sign and a sidecoming semi truck without a stop himself, I lost all movement as though my clutch was slipping super bad. Turned out my cv slipped off my axle shaft inside the boot...easy fix but left me movement less. If you want to go one cv joint, do my new upgrade: syncro transmission, cap the front shaft so it's 2wd and then install a locker for full power to both wheels at all times on demand with a switch.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 5:22 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

chimneyfish wrote:
So if I had an LSD fitted to my 091


The fix you're looking for is on board brakes. Brake rotors that are attached to the transmission as opposed to the wheel. If one side brakes, you lock up the drive shaft so 100% power goes to the other wheel.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 5:32 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

Brian wrote:
chimneyfish wrote:
So if I had an LSD fitted to my 091


The fix you're looking for is on board brakes. Brake rotors that are attached to the transmission as opposed to the wheel. If one side brakes, you lock up the drive shaft so 100% power goes to the other wheel.

Even then the diff is still a limited slip, that slip part is different from a locker, I've seen the pumpkin on US made trucks smoking from running one hub unlocked, all the slipping makes heat and eventually large expenses.

As Stu says the only reliable limp home for a missing driveshaft is a full locker, then that inboard brake would be handy, but lose a driveshaft and you also lose all braking on that wheel, flip a coin. I'd rather be stuck sitting still than descending a crazy grade at any speed with one inop rear brake myself.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 5:48 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
I'd rather be stuck sitting still than descending a crazy grade at any speed with one inop rear brake myself.


Descending yea, why risk it? Even though if you have your front brakes at near 100% then you could limp in a dire emergency. Ascending, well I have a fun story about that.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 6:13 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

Laughing
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 6:43 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

Here's my experience with an LSD, from an old Mercedes and a Porsche 944. With LSD on a slippery surface, if one wheel starts spinning, so does the other. This means the rear end starts going sideways, great if you are doing drifting, not so much in traffic in rain, snow, or ice, on the road. With the regular differential, one side stays at the speed you are actually traveling, holding the road, while the drive wheel actually is turned by the motor. This way you always have three wheels holding the road, not just the fronts. IMHO, unless you are racing, no need for a LSD, unless you are off roading, and I can't see a Bus doing a lot of drifting- then a locker puts all the power to all the wheels equally. Several times in my Bus, I've been on ice or snow, where everyone else was all over the road, and my Bus just kept on trucking with the one wheel pushing, even when the wheel would spin, the other three kept me going straight, or wherever I pointed.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 7:34 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote


Link


Before LSD

Should have an after video soon...plenty of snow just gotta get my bus back on the road...aiming for the end of the month!
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 9:03 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

Yep, I remember that video. You can see how much the Bus does not want to slide sideways and keeps trying to settle into going forward. Also, with all the weight of a camper, way up high too, and whatever else is in there??, it actually has a lot of grip with the regular trans diff.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:02 pm    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

It really does..kind of annoying when playing but nice when your moving down the road for sure. I much prefer the LSD tho. It gets me going way smoother then an open differential and pushes me through turns a bit more effectively.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2016 12:46 am    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

1967250s wrote:
Here's my experience with an LSD, from an old Mercedes and a Porsche 944. With LSD on a slippery surface, if one wheel starts spinning, so does the other. This means the rear end starts going sideways, great if you are doing drifting, not so much in traffic in rain, snow, or ice, on the road. With the regular differential, one side stays at the speed you are actually traveling, holding the road, while the drive wheel actually is turned by the motor. This way you always have three wheels holding the road, not just the fronts. IMHO, unless you are racing, no need for a LSD, unless you are off roading, and I can't see a Bus doing a lot of drifting- then a locker puts all the power to all the wheels equally. Several times in my Bus, I've been on ice or snow, where everyone else was all over the road, and my Bus just kept on trucking with the one wheel pushing, even when the wheel would spin, the other three kept me going straight, or wherever I pointed.


My experience in hilly rainy Seattle is without I would get stuck at a light with one wheel spinning trying to take off. With LSD rain, snow, hills aren't a problem as both rear wheels try to grab. It's not a locker thou but makes a difference in rain, snow or loose gravel or dirt roads going camping.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2016 12:54 am    Post subject: Re: LSD for Bay? Reply with quote

They are amazing for stop start low traction situations. Smile
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