1963 Stock 1500 Motor

desert westy · Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 7:45 pm Post subject: 1963 Stock 1500 Motor

I need some help figuring out what I need to get this motor back to stock (1963 deluxe bus with a 1500 motor). Homemade breather box and cheap air cleaner have been already replaced with originals. Motor runs great, but leaks so much oil that I am not comfortable driving my bus long distances. I'd like to pull it, have it rebuilt and then make it as "original" as possible. Any help identifying correct parts and part numbers would be greatly appreciated.

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joe56vw · Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 8:14 pm Post subject:

what did you do with the hose coming up from the sides to the breather box?
if you did not seal them or route them to a better place that might be your oil problem

as far as correct engine parts the carb and dist. are not original style one and not sure about the coil either
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desert westy · Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 8:42 pm Post subject:

Vented valve covers have been replaced, most of the oil is coming from the pushrod tube seals. I've searched the forum, now I'm suffering from information overload. Thought I needed a governer, now I think I've got the wrong manifold. I'm thinking the distributor part number is 131 905 205, but I'm not certain. Took a while to figure out which air cleaner I needed, trying to speed up the process of getting the rest of the correct parts.

joe56vw · Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 8:46 pm Post subject:

stock dist. for a sp motor would have a vacuum advance on it

and if the push rod tube are the only spot leaking badly the motor might still be good but just need those seals replaced
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Stanagon · Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:25 pm Post subject:

Is the priority to make it totally correct, or run reliably? A lot of those non-original parts (coil, dist. carb) might work pretty good, and wouldn't look incorrect to most car (nonVW) people.
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desert westy · Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:53 pm Post subject:

Run reliably and "limit" oil leaks. Engine case number is correct for a 63 bus. May be original, but I cannot be sure. Would love to drive it to the classic next year.

Stanagon · Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:10 pm Post subject:

If it runs OK the way it is, then start by removing the right side tin under the pushrods (and maybe under the thermostat if you have one) and pull down the left lower tin as possible. These tins connect the heater box bottoms to the engine case bottom. Now clean everything up real good around the pushrod tubes and seals. Then run it around for 10 minutes or so and get underneath and see where the oil is really leaking. You can leave the right side lower tin off for this.

Take the time to find out where exactly the oil is leaking and report back. This may involve a few cycles of cleaning and checking for leaks. And use a big metal drjp tray under the engine, positioned the same way all the time, to help pinpoint the oil leak situation better. You can also do this with a big piece of dry cardboard.

You can replace the pushrod tubes and seals with two-piece spring loaded units without having to remove the engine or the heads. They won't be correct, but might stop the oil leaks. Correct means removing engine and heads to replace the stock pushrod tubes.

Some common oil leaks are:

-Engine oil pressure switch, oil pools underneath it. Easy fix, replace the switch, but don't tighten the new one too much into the magnesium engine case.
-Oil cooler seals, oil usually runs down left side of engine case toward the oil pressure switch. Must remove engine and fan shroud to fix. A fairly common problem on engines that have been in service a very long time or sat for a long time.
-Engine seal behind flywheel or input shaft seal, oil leaks at engine/transmission joint. Must remove engine to fix.
-Axle boots, generally leaks under them. Can replace with non-original split axle boot(s) or remove axles to replace with OE one piece boot.
-Leaks where head and cylinders meet. This can look like pushrod tube/seal issues but generally means the motor will need a rebuild soon.

I'm sure there are others, but those come to mind right now.
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EverettB · Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:24 pm Post subject:

In terms of correctness:
Yes, you should have a governor.
Carburetor should be a 28 PICT.
You should have an oil filler without a down-draft tube.
You should have a "big cap" distributor. This is the BR5 usually associated with 40hp engines.

Kent's '63 15-Window with 8K miles is a perfect example of a correct 1963 1500cc engine:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=301802

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Eric&Barb · Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 9:19 am Post subject:

brettsvw · Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 9:45 am Post subject:

Would this be your first time removing the heads on a AC VW motor?

If is is, the first time may be intimidating.
My first time I was 21, but had help from a VW Guru. Now I am 43 and have pulled heads on every VW engine the car came with.

I found that about 20% of the motors had bad thrust bearings and 80% were good to go and gave me many miles. That is good odds to me.

Trying not to get off subject here. Basically I like the idea of pulling heads because I get peace of mind knowing the heads are seated, new push-rod tubes, and seals (old ones can leak at weld seam), new oil cooler, I can check that all tins are present (replace anything missing), clean block even more, and replace front seal at flywheel. A lot of good can come out of it.

You are in the right place for help. Now you will need a year correct Bently manual, engine stand, and tools.

As you do it post pics and ask questions and you will get plenty of advice.
If someone disagrees you will get that too.

It is also good to take pics as you remove items. It can take the guess work out of putting things back together.

TinCanFab · Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 10:58 am Post subject:

I'd like to add that I always install push rod tubes with the seam (it runs lengthwise) facing up, in case it ever splits. Good info above. The oil cooler seals leaking down the driver side of the engine are always mistaken for the tubes/cylinder bases.
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desert westy · Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 4:56 pm Post subject:

Thanks for all of the replies. The bus was built May 30, 1963. The case number is 0236876. Would the M-plate would have a code for a 1500 motor or did all deluxes have a 1500? If the bus did come with a 1500, could this be the original motor? Production date and case number is close, but I am not sure if I am reading the Vin/Chassis section correctly.

Updated picture of the motor.

Kind of hard to read, but the number is 0236876

BarryL · Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 6:56 pm Post subject:

In the VIN / Chassis Numbers pulldown of the Technical menu it puts your block at May 1963 so, ka-ching, confidence is high it is orginal.

EverettB · Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 10:34 pm Post subject:

0236876 is supposedly super early June, 1963 according to the charts but given that your Bus is May 30th and I'm assuming that's off the M-code plate, I feel confident that is the original engine.

When it comes to the numbers around the month change, I have seen other variances, it's not a strict thing.

That is awesome.
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Big Bill · Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 6:30 am Post subject:

Very nice, I would love to have the OG motor(or even the case for my 63).

BarryL · Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 10:12 am Post subject:

Could you look very closely at your engine and see if the dull silver finish that is on the engine and generator pedestal looks original. Especially the pedestal appears to have a coating.

If you go with the manifold that is for a governor there is a spacer that will substitute instead so you don't have to have the actual governor on it.

desert westy · Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:15 pm Post subject:

Considering that this may be the original motor, I think the best bet would be to have a pro rebuild it. What would you guys/gals do?

Eric&Barb · Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:22 pm Post subject:

Build it yourself. Get a CW crankshaft, and full flow oil filter/pump.
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bugcollections · Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2013 1:45 am Post subject: bus engine build

Have a pro rebuild it and replace the 1500 jugs with 1600 ones. Makes it a much more enjoyable driver and takes away nothing from the originality.


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