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mazzidumato
Samba Member
Joined: August 04, 2013
Posts: 41
Location: Panama
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 Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:44 pm Post subject: Worst sound ever. pls help. |
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Battery on the Syncro died. So I got some friends to help push the car. As the car was on a hill, we pushed it in the reverse direction and my friend though he had the car in R when it was in 1st. So he kept trying to start the car but it wouldnt. The car made this loud noise and all of a sudden all the fluid from somewhere (presumably the transmission) came down in large amounts. I am hoping its not such bad news. Can someone give me a clue as to what this could have been? If its transmission, does that mean its destroyed? I am taking the car to a mechanic tomorrow, but I would like to know if its something serious or not. Thanks.
Last edited by mazzidumato on Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:54 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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syncrodoka
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2005
Posts: 12008
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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Smell the fluid. Gear oil is a distinct type of sulfer smell and it has a greenish tint.
If you cracked the syncro tranny it is serious. |
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Howesight
Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2008
Posts: 3274
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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Running the engine backwards with the ignition switch on could (depending on whether the hall sensor and ECU will still provide spark) send a lot of fuel/air mixture into the intake plenum which would be ignited by a spark in one of the cylinders. Remember that all the fuel injectors are triggered at the same time in the WBX - - it does not have sequential fuel injection. This may explain the loud noise.
What may have happened next to cause the fluid to escape is that the backwards-turning water pump or more likely backwards-turning oil pump caused a coolant leak or an oil leak or both.
You need to identify the fluid.
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'86 Syncro Westy SVX |
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mtnwater
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2008
Posts: 215
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:28 pm Post subject: |
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Can you clarify what you were doing? Sounds like you were trying to roll start the van in reverse, but actually had the trans in 1st gear. If that's that case, I'd say you probably did major damage to your transmission  |
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djkeev
Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32637
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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snowsyncro
Samba Member
Joined: January 11, 2009
Posts: 1557
Location: East Preston, Nova Scotia, Canada
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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My guess is that you have broken the low gear housing trying to bump start in low gear. That is a no-no on a Syncro. The design angles of the low/reverse gears puts very large lateral forces on the gears, that the housing cannot withstand, and it breaks out the casing. Second gear (2WD first gear) as a minimum, third gear is better.
RonC |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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this wouldn't be the 1st time I've heard of a syncro trans exploding from a bump start in Granny/Rev... esp common from Reverse...
an expensive oversight for sure.
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dobryan
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Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 16508
Location: Brookeville, MD
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mazzidumato
Samba Member
Joined: August 04, 2013
Posts: 41
Location: Panama
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:24 am Post subject: |
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Thank you all for the information. I guess it doesnt sound good
Im having a mechanic check it out today and hopefully its not as bad as it sounds...cheers. |
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Jake de Villiers
Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2007
Posts: 5911
Location: Tsawwassen, BC
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:51 am Post subject: |
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Never try to bump-start backwards. Bump-starting is easiest on all parties involved if you use third gear: there's less drive line shock and less of a jerk to injure your pushers! 
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'84 Vanagon GL 1.9 WBX
'86 Westy Weekender Poptop/2.5 Subaru/5 Speed Posi/Audi Front Brakes/16 x 7 Mercedes Wheels - answers to 'Dixie'
@jakedevilliersmusic1
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syncrodoka
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2005
Posts: 12008
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 11:19 am Post subject: |
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| Don't bump start one, carry jumper cables. |
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mazzidumato
Samba Member
Joined: August 04, 2013
Posts: 41
Location: Panama
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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OK. Car was lifted. Damage looks like its on the housing where the gears are. I am hoping I can only replace that part or maybe weld it. It would be easier maybe to replace but I live in Panama, and parts are hard to get.
Here are the pictures before opening, after and the piece that broke
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:28 pm Post subject: |
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Yup, that's a tough lesson in economics.. and physics
compounded by a rare vehicle (~46,000 vanagon Syncro made world wide over 5 production yrs)
and a remote location, though these aren't just hanging around any neighborhood.. well maybe Dylans yard, but nowhere else.
just a day late and dollar short bit of advice. I always carry a quality $150 battery boost pack. takes up less space than a set of cables and works when cables aren't long nuff to reach.
it's handy if I need it, it's handy when someone else needs it (more often) and handy as a portable battery pack for charging stuff and led lights while camping.
that's my advice on this topic for all other Syncro (any vanagon really) owners..
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joseph928
Samba Member
Joined: September 22, 2011
Posts: 2114
Location: flagstaff az.
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:48 pm Post subject: syncro trans |
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| dobryan wrote: |
I think you may have just spent $3k+....  |
 I would think your friend that does not what gear he is in owes you closer to $4,000 , good luck finding one down there. PS I hope Panama is easer to get a transmission in then Columbia, Nacho had a hell of a time getting one in!
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1987 syncro westy tin top sun roof , GW2.3, rear locker, decoupler, Gary Lee tire rack & winch mount, lift, south african grill, big brakes , rhein alloy ,15 BFG AT, Fiamma 10 foot awning ,140 watt rear 85 watt front solar , mppt, truckfridge, automatic fire extinguishing system, tencent oil cooler, And a RMW SS exhaust! - 1971 bug convertible 1776 engine- 2010 Subaru turbo - 1993 Toyota 4x4 truck - 1999 Harley 95 CI, big bore, Andrews cams . Also 80-84- vans. Stock 65 sunroof bug. |
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djkeev
Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32637
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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mazzidumato
Samba Member
Joined: August 04, 2013
Posts: 41
Location: Panama
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Ok...thanks for the lectures on what I could/should have done. But now with the current damage, is this something that could be welded together by someone knowledgeable? Is it something that hold pressure where welding it can be a problem? |
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BitterBeerFace
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Joined: June 11, 2010
Posts: 386
Location: Southern MN
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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I'm sure others more knowledgeable will chime in, but I'd think the case could be welded (careful of it igniting(?)!)
The other expensive bit will be the gears themselves most likely being shredded.
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32637
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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xoo00oox
Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2010
Posts: 2673
Location: East Nassau, NY
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think that is weldable, the pressure isn't the problem, the machined tolarances are the issue.
That will need to be pulled apart and have every piece examined, the replace the bad parts.
Tough break, sorry to see that happen.
A 2wd transmission can be used with a little work to get you mobile for now.
Andrew- |
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joseph928
Samba Member
Joined: September 22, 2011
Posts: 2114
Location: flagstaff az.
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| Posted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:57 pm Post subject: trans rep. |
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vEHp8zEvOU Try this , looks cool and you could do it yourself.  But it will only work on the case , the gears are another story. And if you have a Magnesium case then that's another story!  http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...ssion+case This is a way to tell what case you have.
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1987 syncro westy tin top sun roof , GW2.3, rear locker, decoupler, Gary Lee tire rack & winch mount, lift, south african grill, big brakes , rhein alloy ,15 BFG AT, Fiamma 10 foot awning ,140 watt rear 85 watt front solar , mppt, truckfridge, automatic fire extinguishing system, tencent oil cooler, And a RMW SS exhaust! - 1971 bug convertible 1776 engine- 2010 Subaru turbo - 1993 Toyota 4x4 truck - 1999 Harley 95 CI, big bore, Andrews cams . Also 80-84- vans. Stock 65 sunroof bug. |
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