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lonotch
Samba Padrino
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 3304
Location: So. Cal. Oceanside GFK!
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 Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:55 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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| Porschedave wrote: |
One more thought, I was in the garage looking at this situation. I think that I can live with moving the turn signals up without doing much damage to the body. This reduces the overlap between the bumper and the light.
And then I would put a spacer between each of the 4 bolts between the bumper brackets and the bumper moving the bumper forwards away from the nose, by about 1 cm. The lights would still be clear above the bumper. Let's see what that looks like.
Dave |
The only problem I see is the bumper bracket cover will be further away from the body, but I bet you could manipulate that since it has a rubber seal that goes between the cover and body. The support bar could also give you problems also if you are running American style bumpers, not a problem with the support bar if you are using a euro bumper.
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It's not about the window, it's about the people.
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lonotch
Samba Padrino
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 3304
Location: So. Cal. Oceanside GFK!
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 2:07 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Actually the cover should be fine since it mounts to the bumper bracket, but the support bar wraps around the towel bar and it would push it out from the mounting hole on the bumper bracket.
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It's not about the window, it's about the people.
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VeloMikey
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2012
Posts: 654
Location: So Cal
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:28 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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How about we start posting the distances from the bottom of the headlight ring to the top of the bumper? I have 100mm plus or minus.
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'58 Ghia 2387cc with a Berg / Folts 5 Speed
Ghia Build Thread https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768748 |
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Porschedave
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2004
Posts: 454
Location: Vancouver, Canada
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:30 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Interesting. Here's my ruler and I am much closer than yours.
Looking inside the trunk, you can see the orientation of my bumper bracket, right in the middle where it should be I think, maybe down a bit at the front. I cannot see anyway of lowering the bumper by 3 cms.
And I went ahead an placed the towel bars on and the upright supports.
I think that if I put spacers in as I suggested above, the bumper covers and the upright supports could fit if I elongated the hole in the bracket. At least it's worth a try.
I know these cars were hand built, and if you've followed my thread you'll agree that I did a lot more hand building to get to this point but I remain mystified about this bumper placement.
Dave
_________________
1977 911S
1958 Karmann Ghia build thread here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=571683
1965 Sunroof Notch build thread here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5600139&highlight=#5600139 |
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VeloMikey
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2012
Posts: 654
Location: So Cal
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:47 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Let’s try the inside. I get 70mm to the center of the back bolt. Looks like your mount has been rewelded to the body at the front. Maybe the mounts for the brackets are welded in the wrong location. Almost like they are upside down on the Vietnamese bumper.
Here is the relationship to the nostril.
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'58 Ghia 2387cc with a Berg / Folts 5 Speed
Ghia Build Thread https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768748 |
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lonotch
Samba Padrino
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 3304
Location: So. Cal. Oceanside GFK!
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:18 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Here’s my body bracket.
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It's not about the window, it's about the people.
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PeteSC
Samba Member
Joined: January 26, 2011
Posts: 881
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| Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:11 am Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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| VeloMikey wrote: |
Maybe the mounts for the brackets are welded in the wrong location. Almost like they are upside down on the Vietnamese bumper.
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I was thinking that as well, but looking at the ears on the bumper bracket nut plate it almost seems that if they were upside-down the bumper would sit too low?
Looking back at the photo of the car in primer with the original bumper on, it appears that something is off with the position of the body bumper brackets - the OG bumper looks like it sits to high, especially on the right side.
Looking at Dave's body mount compared to the other two it's obviously been welded on. I bet it's mounted at a very slight upward angle, so while it may be only slightly off when measured in the trunk it will get amplified as you get farther away from the bracket. |
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rich caramadre
Samba Member
Joined: August 22, 2014
Posts: 145
Location: United States
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| Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:40 am Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Dave, my 58' has a different turn signal mount. Your looks like the ones for a 59'. Is it possible that it was changed sometime earlier in the cars life? Maybe drilled a little low? I'm no Lowlight guru so maybe some later 58's used the 59' style?
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Porschedave
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2004
Posts: 454
Location: Vancouver, Canada
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Porschedave
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2004
Posts: 454
Location: Vancouver, Canada
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John Moxon 
Samba Moderator
Joined: March 07, 2004
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Location: Southampton U.K.
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udo dreisoerner
Samba Member
Joined: February 13, 2005
Posts: 1155
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:53 am Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Found my old drawing to show the diameter between headlight and turnsignal st lowlight Fender. At left you see the fenderline when you look from side to the Fender. Diameters are mm.
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Searching for a 1956 lowlight karmann ghia with a VIN number between1273054 and 1273440, and the matching engine with an Engine Number between
1525510 and 1525519 PLEASE OFFER ME ONLY THE CARS THAT I'M LOOKING FOR, THANKS!! |
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Porschedave
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2004
Posts: 454
Location: Vancouver, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:24 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Hi Folks
First, many many thanks for the photos and dimensions/measurements. It seems that my turn signal lights are a bit too low - according to the measurements maybe 3-5 mm. However, my bumper is 3 cm too high. The bumper bracket measurement is the same as tonotch's. I did no work on the inner fender well so the placement of the bumper bolts is correct. In the end, I have no idea why my car is this way. I was so frustrated that I stopped working on it and returned to the rear bumper. And I can happy report that it is on, everything fits although I did have to do some fiddling to get it to fit. But it's on and looks great - certainly shinier than the original.
Today I went back to the front bumper and made another odd discovery. I had bought new cover plates for the bumper brackets and it seems that they are slightly different from the originals- no surprise I guess. The difference, however, makes it impossible to fit the brackets and the over-rider support. Here is a drawing of the bracket, both new and old, and you can see the hole in the new one is slightly offset from the original.
I am now working on restoring the old ones, which I think I can, rather than modifying these new ones. And I modified the bumper brackets to lower the bumper as well as put a 1 cm spacer between the bumper and the bracket thus moving the bumper forward by 1 cm. With the lights raised up by about 5 mm and these mods to the bumper brackets I can fit everything together and things seem OK.
I'll let you know when I get there ....
Dave
_________________
1977 911S
1958 Karmann Ghia build thread here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=571683
1965 Sunroof Notch build thread here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5600139&highlight=#5600139 |
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lonotch
Samba Padrino
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 3304
Location: So. Cal. Oceanside GFK!
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| Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:29 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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I had the same problem with the brackets covers on my car also with the aftermarket parts, I restored the original ones I had.
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Porschedave
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2004
Posts: 454
Location: Vancouver, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Sep 12, 2020 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Hi All
I'm happy to share that I am a step closer. I moved the turn signal lights up, made a couple of mods to the brackets and now I can get the bumper to fit.
I'm still working on restoring the over-rider covers and when done I should then be able to finally bolt the whole thing in place.
My next step is to figure out why my new fuel sending unit is not working ...
Dave
_________________
1977 911S
1958 Karmann Ghia build thread here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=571683
1965 Sunroof Notch build thread here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5600139&highlight=#5600139 |
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Marcdeb
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Location: Vermont
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22425
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sun Sep 13, 2020 4:59 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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| Porschedave wrote: |
Hi All
I'm happy to share that I am a step closer. I moved the turn signal lights up, made a couple of mods to the brackets and now I can get the bumper to fit.
I'm still working on restoring the over-rider covers and when done I should then be able to finally bolt the whole thing in place.
My next step is to figure out why my new fuel sending unit is not working ...
Dave |
It's looking good Dave. Did you do a video of the engine start? Your solution for the bail end was pretty good, and looks like it'll work to me.
Looking at your issues, reminds me of why I sold my T-34 Ghia. The bumpers on it were a nightmare, and they were original German bumpers (just not to the car). Not too mention the glass and seal difficulties I had with it.
On your car, the SS bumpers look beautiful, and the extra time spent making them fit really makes it look all that much better. Really brings out the color of the paint. Personally the polished stainless looks so much better than rechromed chrome. I'll be looking into a set of them for my 65 Notch. The front looks like yours, as it's exposed to the weather 24/7 unless it's in the garage getting work done on it. The rear was rechromed in California before I bought 10+ years ago, and I clear coated it to keep it from fading too much. But it's getting to that point where the rechrome doesn't look that great any more (at least in my eyes).Keep at it Dave, it's getting closer to being done, then you can start on a low light convertible next.  
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Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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djway3474
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2011
Posts: 2582
Location: The Real NDK So Cal
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| Posted: Sun Sep 13, 2020 7:59 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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| Porschedave wrote: |
Hi All
I'm happy to share that I am a step closer. I moved the turn signal lights up, made a couple of mods to the brackets and now I can get the bumper to fit.
I'm still working on restoring the over-rider covers and when done I should then be able to finally bolt the whole thing in place.
My next step is to figure out why my new fuel sending unit is not working ...
Dave |
Lots of information out there on rebuilding the sending units. I just did the one in my 59 Ghia and in my Notchback, both went from nothing to working great. |
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Porschedave
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2004
Posts: 454
Location: Vancouver, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:36 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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Hi Folks
Okay, I have finally managed to get that pesky front bumper with all of its supporting pieces in place.
It was an interesting struggle but so far I am pleased. And now to get on with the interior, renewing the door panels and such. And the windows weals just a arrived so I can put them in as well.
Hey Bob, it was great to read your comments and hear from you. I certainly understand the struggles with these multiple piece bumpers. I did post a video way back at the beginning of this thread when I got the engine to run and managed to drive the car upon and down the ally. Maybe I should make another with this newly rebuilt engine. I hope all is well with you and yours during the time of covid.
Cheers.
Dave
_________________
1977 911S
1958 Karmann Ghia build thread here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=571683
1965 Sunroof Notch build thread here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5600139&highlight=#5600139 |
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lonotch
Samba Padrino
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 3304
Location: So. Cal. Oceanside GFK!
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| Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:34 pm Post subject: Re: Had some time for my '58 low light today |
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I knew you could figure out the turn signal and bumper situation, you really had no othe choice......
Great job!
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It's not about the window, it's about the people.
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