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Astra VW GT 2+2 - Starting Restoration, Have Questions
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redfarmer84
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 7:51 am    Post subject: Astra VW GT 2+2 - Starting Restoration, Have Questions Reply with quote

Hey guys. It's been since around July since I got the Allied Astra GT car and now I am starting on it. I've decided to upgrade the chassy from one out of a 1970 VW bug since mine is based off of a 1967 or so. I've found that it has the original 40 hp 1300 cc engine that is loose, but I hope to upgrade to a Monster of an engine since this is a sports car. I would like at least 80-100 hp, but that is down the road. I only got an owners manual for a VW 1300 bug, and an aftermarket shop manual for a VW with it. The guy who owned it kept EVERYTHING! even old aircraft builder magazines, car magazines, etc.; so I am sure there is more paperwork to be found for this car. At least I hope so.

This past weekend I got it raised up on stands and took off the old rusted out wheels, removed the seats, and just cleaned the car out to get a better look and idea of what I am up against. I've decided that before any kind of engine work/troubleshooting on the current engine that is in it, that the body must come off the chassy. I found 5 bolts across the back of the car in the rear passenger area, then I found 3 bolts on each side of the body at the door jambs. Those are the only bolts I've found (none up front) , so the next time I work on it, the body will come off after removing the steering column and the wiring.

In the little information I've found on this car from internet research, I've seen where a "plan pak" was offered by Allied as instructions and information on how to build the car and take it apart. I really would LOVE to see a copy of that information, but I am sure it is long gone by now. Being in Antique Tractors, I know that there are enthusiasts who track down old articles/manuals/etc. and preserve them electronically or keep the originals for people to use down the road. I spoke with Dave from OldSchoolRestorations (near my home), and he didn't know where I could fine such a document. Its possible the PO kept it among the pile of stuff he has in many buildings but finding it would be hard. It sure would help me in my restoration efforts though. Save time, money, and I could learn something too! Any ideas guys??
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redfarmer84
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 8:08 am    Post subject: Pictures from this past weekend..... Reply with quote

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HEY, the tail lights work!!
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BL3Manx
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 8:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What a great looking car! I'd try to keep it as close as possible to the 60s Euro-performance feel.

It appears to be practically fully assembled. I'm not sure the plans package would provide any information you can't see for yourself by studying the car and taking pictures and notes (which it looks like you're already doing)as you disassemble it for restoration.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool Car!

A use that the Mustang tail lights actually look good on.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a great looking car.
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redfarmer84
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you guys. I'm excited to get started on this project. I plan on keeping it to the original era for the most part. I am going to need to figure something out with the seats/headroom/steering wheel becuase there isn't hardly enough room for getting in there must less driving. Also, I am going to keep the original car club sticker, and the original lights for sure. The engine is going to be VW air cooled, but I feel that car would sport a bigger engine than the small single port. I'm not very familiar with VWs so any help you guys can give that you'll think I need would be greatly appreciated! Right now trying to figure out how to body is mounted (besides the bolts I removed), is a task. Also, does that metal "firewall" (the gray part in the front footwell) come off with the body or is that part of the old VW pan or VW body? That plan pak would be really useful I think, plus it would be real intresting to read and display.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Found this in a google search. Hope it helps!

http://www.kellisoncars.com/Allied_Fiberglass_Co_1966.pdf

Cool project! Keep us informed as to how it goes!
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redfarmer84
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for that info. I had found that from a past google search myself, and have it saved on my computer. There is also 1 more "catalogue" like that one (that I believe is later 1960s) that I found on the internet. Other than the old catalogues, I haven't found any other info on them. I really can't seem to find alot of pictures of them on the internet either. It makes it tough.
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BL3Manx
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

redfarmer84 wrote:
Right now trying to figure out how to body is mounted (besides the bolts I removed), is a task. Also, does that metal "firewall" (the gray part in the front footwell) come off with the body or is that part of the old VW pan or VW body?


The lower part which the brake pedal pushrod passes through and the brake master cylinder is mounted on, is part of the chassis. The part above it is part of the fiberglass body. The lower metal part is known as the Napoleon's hat.

Some of the floor is missing in this pic but you can see the shape of the Napoleon's hat

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redfarmer84
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok. Yeah, I didn't know exactly where it ended and the body began. I wonder if that metal firewall (the gray piece) comes off separate from the body or if it is tied together. I'm just trying to figure out if there are any more bolts holding the body on....especially in the front area near "napoleons hat".
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only bolts that normally hold the body on the Napoleon's hat are at the outer ends. You should see any from underneath.

Are you saying the gray section is also metal? Maybe they used that part of the VW body with the kit. If it is it might be bonded(glued) to the fiberglass body.
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redfarmer84
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BL3Manx wrote:
The only bolts that normally hold the body on the Napoleon's hat are at the outer ends. You should see any from underneath.

Are you saying the gray section is also metal? Maybe they used that part of the VW body with the kit. If it is it might be bonded(glued) to the fiberglass body.


If that is the case I am betting that there are no bolts in the body at the Napoleons Hat. I took off the front wheels and it is a squinting match to try and see the gas tank. I really couldn't see it through there but caught a glimpse of the fuel line coming out of the bottom. That would be the only way to even see the tank, having that the body is 1 piece.

Yes, I thought that metal piece looked like it matched up with the pan pretty well. I felt like it was part of the original VW beetle. But you are saying that it is a separate piece from the floorpan? so maybe it is bolted to the body at the top and floorpan at the bottom? It is stuff like this that I wish I had the old "plan pak" for. If it is bonded or glued, how would one remove it? Or should I remove it from the body? I feel like with a restoration and to fix things properly and make them look good that I should remove it.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In some of the pictures of the interior I see what looks a lot like VW heater channels. Any closer pictures of the door sill area? And the front firewall?
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BIGMIKEY wrote:
In some of the pictures of the interior I see what looks a lot like VW heater channels. Any closer pictures of the door sill area? And the front firewall?


Do these help? This is all I have at the moment and could take more this weekend if needed. Thanks for the help guys.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would definitely relocate that shifter and ebrake handle.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

redfarmer84 wrote:
Thank you guys. I'm excited to get started on this project. I plan on keeping it to the original era for the most part. I am going to need to figure something out with the seats/headroom/steering wheel becuase there isn't hardly enough room for getting in there must less driving. Also, I am going to keep the original car club sticker, and the original lights for sure. The engine is going to be VW air cooled, but I feel that car would sport a bigger engine than the small single port. I'm not very familiar with VWs so any help you guys can give that you'll think I need would be greatly appreciated! Right now trying to figure out how to body is mounted (besides the bolts I removed), is a task. Also, does that metal "firewall" (the gray part in the front footwell) come off with the body or is that part of the old VW pan or VW body? That plan pak would be really useful I think, plus it would be real intresting to read and display.


The typical body mounting is from bolts along each side of the outer edges of the floorpan. You need to look underneath the car. The bolts will be in a row tucked up into a channel. Might be covered in gunk so look close.
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BIGMIKEY
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found these on the Kellisoncars.com website.

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Interesting that the directions say to cut the heater channels off the donor car and bolt them to the chassis before mounting the GT body. Never saw that before.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went home briefly this past weekend and got a chance to look at the car again (not work, but look). I noticed that the gray piece (firewall?) is indeed made of fiberglass and not metal. I noticed this because at the bottom where it is rounded on the left and right side, it is made to "lip" over the rounded part of the floorpan. I could see the cross-section where it lipped over and noticed that it was fiberglass. Still I haven't figured out how it is conected to the pan or the body (if it is at all). From the inside of the car it doesn't appear to be connected to the pan. I haven't checked at the top to see if it is connected to the body.

Secondly. YES I AGREE with the idea of moving the shifter. The E-brake seems fine, but I guess if you move the shifter back then the brake controls would have to be moved as well. When you are sitting in the car, you actually have to lean forward out of your seat to reach the shifter. I don't like that. I also don't like the lack of room and lack of ease of getting in and out of the car. Without cutting the body and making it a convertible, how could I make it better???
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Without cutting the body and making it a convertible, how could I make it better???


You can't. What you are learning is that the majority of these great looking old kits have absolutely terrible ergonomics. The seating position sucks. The shifter location sucks. The way in and out sucks. Usually the vision sucks.

But...they look great! And that is how they were sold.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

redfarmer84 wrote:
I also don't like the lack of room and lack of ease of getting in and out of the car. Without cutting the body and making it a convertible, how could I make it better???

I'm not exactly sure what you mean or expect as far as room and ease of getting in and out of the car. A smaller diameter steering wheel would probably help. Some people cut and drop the floorpans a couple of inches or so. This makes the seats sit lower. It can give more head room and add a little more room to the cabin. It could also help a little with fitting through the doorway. If you're going to go deep into refurbishing the car I'd definitely look into installing dropped pans. If I do any floorpan repair on my Kelmark I'll be dropping them at least a couple of inches. I'm about 5'9" or so & I can touch my head to the top of my car without much effort. Confused
As far as getting in & out of the car, I've just sorta' developed a certain way of getting in & out of my Kelmark that works for me. I have to back into it with my right leg going in first. Once I'm in I have to use both hands on the seat to lift & push myself all of the way back into it. Getting out also took a bit of learning to figure out what worked best for me. My wife won't even ride in it because she has a bad knee & doesn't want to mess with climbing in & out. Very Happy Once you have the car useable you should be able to figure out what will work for you.
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