Vin number/engine number--how close to the end of production

[Pat KG]

My 74 Ghia has a vin of 1442611465 and engine number of 376445. I bought the car new on September 25 of 1974. How do I tell how near the end of production this car was?

She has about 102000 miles on her and I drove her yesterday--had this car for 39 years plus and she has been garaged since she was one year old.

Pat


Moderator note:
A member has created a listing of the last VIN #s.
It is here on the site:
Current 1974 Ghia VIN database(PDF Format)
_________________
Pat Daily

74 Ghia Cabriolet (bought it in 74 new)
63 356 B Coupe
2005 BMW 325i
2008 BMW 328 convertible
2007 Dodge Ram Hemi
2005 Honda Odyssey

[c21darrel]

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/chassisdatingkg.php

[Pat KG]

Thanks--I had looked there before I posted and couldn't figure out the way to read it. Can you help with that? 144 means Ghia, I think, but not sure about the rest.
_________________
Pat Daily

74 Ghia Cabriolet (bought it in 74 new)
63 356 B Coupe
2005 BMW 325i
2008 BMW 328 convertible
2007 Dodge Ram Hemi
2005 Honda Odyssey

[toddb_67]

From: http://www.type-14.com/
1974 Aug.73 - Jul.74 144 2000 001 to 144 2999 000 engine: AK 0 239 365

[KGCoupe]

To further clarify a bit, (If I'm not mistaken) the range of VIN and engine numbers listed for any given Karmann Ghia production year is basically a block of possible numbers set aside by Volkswagen, but not every number was actually used.

The range given above by toddb_67 includes almost 1 million possible VINs, yet the chart of Karmann Ghia production numbers, found HERE on The Samba, indicates that there were only 5608 Karmann Ghia Couopes and 1558 Karmann Ghia Cabriolets produced in 1974.
So as toddb_67 has already suggested, the only sure way of finding out how close to the end of production your car falls would be to order the "birth certificate" by following the information found in the
Ordering Your Karmann Ghia's "Birth Certificate" thread.

Even then, that will likely just give you a build date from which you can figure out how many days of Karmann Ghia Cabriolet production continued after yours was produced.
If you can find an estimate of the number of Cabriolets produced per day, and you know how many days of production continued beyond the date that yours was made, you can get a pretty good estimate of how close your Ghia is to being the last one produced.

Regardless, you've got one of the most exclusive standard Karmann Ghia models one can own, and a great looking one at that!
On top of all that, you're the OG owner as well - I doubt that many other 1974 Karmann Ghia Cabriolet owners can say that.
If it is an AutoStick car, then go buy a Lotto ticket because you have just hit the Trifecta of Karmann Ghia "rareness".

[Pat KG]

Thanks guys! No trifecta, mine is a stick shift! I do love the car (her name is Mellow Marlene and she shares a garage with Fast Frieda, my 63 356B coupe).

I have owned a VW flat four since 1965 continuously except for about a 9 month period in 1970. I love VWs (had a 63 and a 66 Bettle and a 70 Ghia Cabriolet before I bought the 74. Can't imagine life without a German flat 4!
_________________
Pat Daily

74 Ghia Cabriolet (bought it in 74 new)
63 356 B Coupe
2005 BMW 325i
2008 BMW 328 convertible
2007 Dodge Ram Hemi
2005 Honda Odyssey

[kiwighia68]

Thanks for starting this thread. I've just ordered my Ghia's birth certificate.

Like you, I have a soft spot for air-cooled rear engined cars and have owned '70 Beetle, '72 Beetle, '76 Beetle S, '79 Porsche 911SC, '71 Fiat Bambina 500cc and '96 Porsche 993 (my daily drive).

My '68 Ghia coupe arrived two weeks ago and will be going in three parts to different places for a ground-up body-off restoration this week: Body to acid baths and blasting, chassis elsewhere for new floorpans, and the motor to another for reconditioning.

[kiwighia68]

Thanks for starting this thread. I've just ordered my Ghia's birth certificate.

Like you, I have a soft spot for air-cooled rear engined cars and have owned '70 Beetle, '72 Beetle, '76 Beetle S, '79 Porsche 911SC, '71 Fiat Bambina 500cc and '96 Porsche 993 (my daily drive).

My '68 Ghia coupe arrived two weeks ago and will be going in three parts to different places for a ground-up body-off restoration this week: Body to acid baths and blasting, chassis elsewhere for new floorpans, and the motor to another for reconditioning.

[Pat KG]

KiwiGhia68


Be sure and post some photos of the progress. Sounds like you are doing it the right way!
_________________
Pat Daily

74 Ghia Cabriolet (bought it in 74 new)
63 356 B Coupe
2005 BMW 325i
2008 BMW 328 convertible
2007 Dodge Ram Hemi
2005 Honda Odyssey

[74 Ghia]

Pat KG,

I also have a 74 Vert that I purchased new in February of 1975. My birth certificate suggests that the car was built on July 1, 1974 which I understand is the last day of Ghia production. The VIN is 1442780434.

Hopefully, this will help you get some feel for how late your car is.

[img]https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/1134476.jpg[/img]

[pbaptist]

The last Ghia that was build was on 21 june 1974. That one had chassisnumber 144 2780 502. The last convertible was 144 2780 500

The last Ghia made for the European market was on 21 december 1973 and had chassisnumber 144 2376 681. (the last convertible was 144 2376 366)


74 Ghia has one of the very last build Ghia's. Beside the one in the Karmann Museum I have not heart of any "newer" karmann ghia's.
_________________
Dutch Karmann-Ghia and coachbuild lover.
1* Karmann Ghia Coupe (1966 Teak)
2* Karmann Ghia Convertible (1958, 1971)
4* Rometsch Lawrence (nr 534, 555, 558 and 561)

Karmann-Ghia Lowlight page and registry
Karmann-Ghia Collectibles database

[Pat KG]

Thanks pbaptist and 74 Ghia.

Can you tell me how or what the numbers mean--for example

1442780500

144 what is that? I think it means Ghia, but not sure

2780 ? is this the number of the car for a given year?

500 ? not sure what this means.

I get confused by what the actual number produced was.
_________________
Pat Daily

74 Ghia Cabriolet (bought it in 74 new)
63 356 B Coupe
2005 BMW 325i
2008 BMW 328 convertible
2007 Dodge Ram Hemi
2005 Honda Odyssey

[KGCoupe]

I think some of your confusion is coming from assuming that these old VW "VINs" are similar to the "VINs" found on more modern cars where each number (or letter) has a specific meaning.
Think of the VW number as more of a "serial number".

Per the explanation found HERE:
For your VIN, 1442611465

1442611465
"14" - Model Number for Karmann Ghia

1442611465
"4" - Model Year 1974

1442611465
"2" - Extra digit to clarify year as post 1970

1442611465
"611465" - Individual serial number assigned to specific car

Although there are six digits reserved for the serial number portion, the numbers were not simply assigned one right after the other as you might expect.

For example, per the info provided by pbaptist, "The last Ghia that was build was on 21 june 1974. That one had chassis number 144 2780 502.".
However, per the Karmann Ghia production figures chart found HERE, we know that 5,608 Coupes and 1,558 Cabriolets were made for a grand total of 7,166 Karmann Ghias produced in 1974.
The fact that the last 1974 Karmann Ghia bore serial number 780,502, combined with the fact that there were only a total of 7,166 Karmann Ghias produced that year, is proof that the serial numbers were not simply assigned one after the other beginning with 000,001.

Hopefully I was able to explain that in a way that clarifies it a bit, and I didn't actually confuse you even more.

[Pat KG]

KGCoupe

Wonderful! Thanks so much for the explanation of the vin for the Ghias. Now it makes sense to me! I really appreciate it.

So for my car, 611465, does that mean there were 611464 Ghias (both convertibles and coupes) were made before mine? Or am I simplifying too much?
_________________
Pat Daily

74 Ghia Cabriolet (bought it in 74 new)
63 356 B Coupe
2005 BMW 325i
2008 BMW 328 convertible
2007 Dodge Ram Hemi
2005 Honda Odyssey

[pbaptist]

I am still trying to find out a logica in the chassis numbering.

The chassis numbers for the karmann ghia were released in series.

I have not figured out how big these series of numbers were and if it contains some sort of month, week or daycode. (i don't think so).

If I compare the karmann ghia chassis nummers tot the 1974 VW Beetle Karmann Convertible (prefix 1542) the 1974 Beetle 1200 and 1300 (prefix 1142) or the 1974 beetle 1303 (prefix 1342) it looks like all different models had there own series of numbers.

The numbers for the karmann Cabrio are very close to those of the Karmann Ghia, so it looks like Karmann was given a range of numbers and they stamped a series of chassis for the karmann ghia and then a series for the beetle. The karmann ghia and Karmann Cabrio share the first 3 digits so my conclusion is that karmann was give the series 010 -014, 080-081, 200, 294, 376, 445-446, 510-511, 611-612, 666-669, 725-727 and 780.

Below is a list of 1974 Karmann ghia Vin numbers that are known to me

1442 012245
1442 012331
1442 012489
1442 013241
1442 013513
1442 013764
1442 014460
1442 014810

1442 080710
1442 081778
1442 081907

1442 200426
1442 200604
1442 200895

1442 294258
1442 294315
1442 294756

1442 376366
1442 376681

1442 445060
1442 446467

1442 510146
1442 510771
1442 511111
1442 511156
1442 511696
1442 511775

1442 611465
1442 611741
1442 611917
1442 612107
1442 612026
1442 612168
1442 612197
1442 612332
1442 612367

1442 666713
1442 667809
1442 668461
1442 668809
1442 669116
1442 669639
1442 669756
1442 669811
1442 669836

1442 725246
1442 725248
1442 725957
1442 726033
1442 727187
1442 727220
1442 727246
1442 727415
1442 727576
1442 727745

1442 780016
1442 780084
1442 780099
1442 780434
_________________
Dutch Karmann-Ghia and coachbuild lover.
1* Karmann Ghia Coupe (1966 Teak)
2* Karmann Ghia Convertible (1958, 1971)
4* Rometsch Lawrence (nr 534, 555, 558 and 561)

Karmann-Ghia Lowlight page and registry
Karmann-Ghia Collectibles database

[Pat KG]

Patrick

Thanks so much for posting the list and more information about the vin numbers. I appreciate it very much.

I also enjoyed looking at your websites and Wolfgang's site. I had not seen those sites before and I plan to join! Love the collectables that you show. Thank you.
_________________
Pat Daily

74 Ghia Cabriolet (bought it in 74 new)
63 356 B Coupe
2005 BMW 325i
2008 BMW 328 convertible
2007 Dodge Ram Hemi
2005 Honda Odyssey

[pbaptist]

deleted
_________________
Dutch Karmann-Ghia and coachbuild lover.
1* Karmann Ghia Coupe (1966 Teak)
2* Karmann Ghia Convertible (1958, 1971)
4* Rometsch Lawrence (nr 534, 555, 558 and 561)

Karmann-Ghia Lowlight page and registry
Karmann-Ghia Collectibles database

[Pat KG]

Patrick

I just got an email from GHIA on the Samba asking about the body number on my Ghia. I checked it and it is 1019005. I didn't realize the chassis and body numbers were different.

Do you or GHIA have any additional information on body numbers versus chassis numbers?

Thanks! This is getting to be as interesting as car numbers on Porsche 356s from different coach makers.

Pat KG
_________________
Pat Daily

74 Ghia Cabriolet (bought it in 74 new)
63 356 B Coupe
2005 BMW 325i
2008 BMW 328 convertible
2007 Dodge Ram Hemi
2005 Honda Odyssey

[BabaFor3]

[John Moxon]