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Black Fastback Build Thread
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 9:23 pm    Post subject: Black Fastback Build Thread Reply with quote

OK, so here we go.
Just to show a few of you that i do more than just run my mouth on here...

Here's a loooong term project I been picking at for about six(?) years.
Because I suffer from Parenthood, Poverty, Matrimony, Color-blindness, and Servitude, among other afflictions, this has to take place when she says so.

So, going back about 10 years, I finally found the (my) holy grail:
Sunroof 67 - Black with red.
It sat in front of Peninsula Automotive over in Campbell off and on for years and years before I was able to pry it off of the original owner.
It didn't run, and had sat since the late 80s, but was complete, and did I mention original owner?
Smile

So, after getting it home, I gave it a good cleaning, and tried to find out just what i had.
Thing acually was rust-free for the most part, but needed gone through.
The first order of business was getting the wiring sorted, and that involved removing a hack-job alarm system and stereo.
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My helpers were able to assist in the de-stereoization..
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So after finding a bunch of brake parts under the back seat, an NOS master cylinder, and a few more whatnots, it was road ready.
Oddly enough, i actually had everything on-hand to get the motor sorted.
Because it had a 009 on it, i put an SVDA from a late bus, cleaned the carbs, torqued the heads, adjusted the valves, yadda yadda, and it runs!
Had some left-over 145 front tires from my Oval, and went and bought two 165s for the rear from the tire shop down the street ($35 ea.).
Lowered the front 1 click while i was at it, and drove it for a few years like that.
It was a rat, but had the patina, right?
Here it is in my white-trash tarp garage.
White By Birth, Trash By Choice!
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Not that I'm on crack, but it was fun to have a car that you don't need to worry about.
It did, however, make me feel like a crack-head to drive a total roach like this, so the resto plan slooooowly started to materialize.
If you look real close, you can see how it was in a nasty front-ender back in the day.
It was fixed, but definitely not right.
And, since it's a black car.... It's going to have to be straighter than straight if it's gonna be shiny....
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Here's a set of BerT3 spindles that i left out in the winter rains for a couple of years to get the matching patina just right...
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So watch this space, we'll be making the ultimate crusty patina OG driver here...
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Last edited by Clatter on Wed Mar 05, 2014 11:09 am; edited 3 times in total
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Yabbadubbadoo
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Holy roachbacks Batman I think we've found the next Batmobile.

Jokes aside, you don't see those everyday. You seem to have a bit of a rarity. Black fasties are not often seen unless they've been resprayed to black.

Good luck with the build. Are the drop spindles definitely going on or are you gonna wait for the moss to start growin'?
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squaretobehip
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This was one of my favorite cars when you showed up at the 50th Anniversary Cruise. Sweet ride!
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Brent
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 11:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Black Fastback Build Thread Reply with quote

Clatter wrote:
Here's a set of BurT3 spindles that i left out in the winter rains for a couple of years to get the matching patina just right...
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That's just wrong...

About time brutha.
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t3kg
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Popcorn
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I WAS THERE! The 2017 Type 3 Rally / September 29–October 1 / Cayucos, CA
2014: The 2014 Type 3 Rally / October 3–5 / Cayucos, CA
2011: 50 Years of the VW Type 3 / September 29–October 1 / California Central Coast
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, fast forward a couple of years... Like 4(?) years.
This would be last year, or the year before.
Had a real mess of the shop going, so decided to throw together a motor to use.
This will be a "heater box motor" so not a heavy runner, but one to use until I get the $$$ together for a proper exhaust for the 2270.
Parts take up a lot more space than an assembled engine, too right?

So the spec on this one is a 2056; stock lower end but spin-balanced as an assembly.
Web 494, 1.7 rockers with Porsche swivel feet.
Solid spacers, up-sized studs, heavy singles,
The heads are 1.8 914 "S" heads at 41 x 35.
I gave them a little fluff, and a Supreme Wizard did the valve job and flycut for me.
Jim is God.. I love you, man *sniff*...

So the guys helped me get the case bolted up to the stand.
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This motor was an experiment in "vapor blasting". It sat in my damp shop for two winters and got zero 'fuzz' on it, so something is right about it.

Had to clean out all the passages though...Perfect job for a little kid. they love compressed air.
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Threaded galley plugs.
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Lapping the valves in.
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Don't forget to grease the stems.
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Ended up using the thick shims on these ones.
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Crank needed a bit of a polish from sitting so long.
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Once we got the gear on it needed a final clean.
Love the Q-tip cleaning - gets those passages.
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Assembling the rod bearings.
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And hanging them on the crank.
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This shows our little math lesson.
ARP rod bolts getting the stretch calculated along with the final torque.
Making sure the bolts stretch as much as they are supposed to at the specific torque.
Not having a real stretch gauge - want to have the numbers match by both measurements.
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Head studs going in.
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Like a bit of blue Lock-tite on them.
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Fasteners were all done in white cad. Precision Metal Finishing in Canby, OR... Top shop.
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Coming together!
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Little trick i like.
Hate it when them fans run out...
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Wrist pins... Helps if you hold your mouth right!
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ANd rings...
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Anyhow, the motor is back sitting on the floor and doing nothing for a year and a half or so...
Someday someday.
At least it takes up a lot less space this way, even if it is harder to move by yourself. Wink
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the kind words, guys.
Funny, how when you are reading someone else's build thread,
All the "nice car" posts kind of get in the way.
But here, on my own build thread, they actually feel really good.
Appreciate it..

Squaretobehip,
Can't believe you would remember this car with all of those others at the 50th.
Brent and I showed up late, and my car seemed like the least likely to attract any attention...
Man, that was a cool event. I still remember the food.
VW events are all about the food to this fat kid right here..
Smile
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, as you know, we are indebited to the wise and experienced posters here.
Some have been working on VWs since before they were even on paper.
One of these guys, older than Hitler would even be, and just as personable,
goes by the screen name "Tram".
He has inspired me to take on a little side project; not just a square, but the late square he has been so instrumental in promoting.

Here it is when I got it home.
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And the project is coming along...
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Getting closer...
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And almost done...
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Once all of the parts were cut small enough, I fed them all to my pet snake Nagini.

That was fun and easy.
You can do a late Square in one day!
Will have to do another again soon.

Thanks again to Tram for all of his inspiration for this project.
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Nate M.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've heard that families who build motors together, stay together. Wink That is awesome that your kids are helping like that. I'm planning to have my son build my 2316cc race motor for the Squarsche so he can have braggin' rights at the venues we race at.

Now aren't you going to be running a 923 5-speed as well?? It's the right thing to do you know. . . Cool

The car looks great!! I can't wait to see more progress. . .
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For heaven's sake, put a type4 and a Porsche 5-speed in there. . . It's the right thing to do!!
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squaretobehip
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clatter wrote:


Squaretobehip,
Can't believe you would remember this car with all of those others at the 50th.
Brent and I showed up late, and my car seemed like the least likely to attract any attention...
Man, that was a cool event. I still remember the food.
VW events are all about the food to this fat kid right here..
Smile


You gotta remember, I see most of those cars on a yearly basis...so when a BLACK SUNROOF PATINA'D fastback shows up, I take notice. Laughing
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, there have been rumors of a 923.
The rare bird never seen except in certain professional circles...

My son is helping teach me that top end parts are better assembled in your pajamas...
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Tram
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clatter- that was a Kasan Red '72, wasn't it? You sure know how to hurt a guy... Crying or Very sad No, seriously... try to find another one.

Sorry, but that was a complete utter dick move and post... Hitler was way more personable than I'll ever be for one, and I fail to see how this promotes the preservation of Type 3s for two.
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Nate M.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clatter wrote:
Yes, there have been rumors of a 923.
The rare bird never seen except in certain professional circles...

My son is helping teach me that top end parts are better assembled in your pajamas...


Since it's obvious that your son is doing all the hard work, I can safely assume that's his well earned Coors Light on the work bench too. . . Wink
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For heaven's sake, put a type4 and a Porsche 5-speed in there. . . It's the right thing to do!!
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tram wrote:
Clatter- that was a Kasan Red '72, wasn't it? You sure know how to hurt a guy... Crying or Very sad No, seriously... try to find another one.

Sorry, but that was a complete utter dick move and post... Hitler was way more personable than I'll ever be for one, and I fail to see how this promotes the preservation of Type 3s for two.


Dag, could it be me, little old me, to get the great Rants Master's goat?
No snappy come-back?

Dag, I feel bad. (kinda).

That "car" was already gutted, rotten as a pear, had no paperwork, and was going to the crusher anyways.
Look again; it didn't even have a column...
I did put the very few parts that were any good here on this site and sold them to help others.
ANd totally lost my ass just having it hauled here.


Soooo....




Gotcha! Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
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Tram
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clatter wrote:
Tram wrote:
Clatter- that was a Kasan Red '72, wasn't it? You sure know how to hurt a guy... Crying or Very sad No, seriously... try to find another one.

Sorry, but that was a complete utter dick move and post... Hitler was way more personable than I'll ever be for one, and I fail to see how this promotes the preservation of Type 3s for two.


Dag, could it be me, little old me, to get the great Rants Master's goat?
No snappy come-back?

Dag, I feel bad. (kinda).

That "car" was already gutted, rotten as a pear, had no paperwork, and was going to the crusher anyways.
Look again; it didn't even have a column...
I did put the very few parts that were any good here on this site and sold them to help others.
ANd totally lost my ass just having it hauled here.


Soooo....




Gotcha! Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy


Rolling Eyes [email protected] Rolling Eyes


Laughing
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rebel1968
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mate that's wicked.
Im jealous
Too bad its a lefty Laughing
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vlad01
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the cad plating, did they heat treat it too?
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rebel1968,
Thanks for the kudos,
The man appreciates a fastback; gotta respect that.
Very Happy

Tram,
You not know who you messim wit...
My style is refal!

vlad,
The fasteners didn't go out for heat treat. Just coating.
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 12:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alright, enough shenannigans,
I'll leave Tram alone (unless he starts in again)..

Here are some of the tribulations i went through to get a tight front beam.
The inner bushes are NLA, and a pretty significant wear point.
While you can get the needle rollers if you dig hard enough, however.

So, the only solution is to find a beam with good bushes.
In my case, I (foolishly) wanted to powder-coat the beam.
This will melt not the inner bushes, but the bakelite rings that support them.
Because removing the bakelite rings means destroying them, my answer was to cut up a beam and remove them, then installing after coating.

So we clean up yet another beam...
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


And cut it up.
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Here are the uppers. You can see how they have tabs to bottom them in place when driven home.
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The lowers have the same bottoming for the bakelite, but like the uppers, the bush itself does not have a shoulder to sit against. Another reason i like to drive them both in at once, to get them to sit home as a unit together... if that makes any sense.
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Another stupid pet trick; polishing the surface the bush rides against. Maybe might lose a few tenths from this treatment, but would seem to make them last longer.
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Makes it easy to get a feel for the fit if you have them free. Cut up a couple of beams and you will find a pretty good bit of variation here. Pays to get one that fits, right? If the rollers are out, only then will you get a feel for this fit. My seat-of-the-pants guess for a nice fit would be about 1/4" or 3/8" of lateral play clear out at the end of the arm by the ball joint, making about 1/8" or so total sideways movement at the seal surface/roller. At least that's the best i was getting on a used set after a few different beams got this exercise. FWIW..
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After cutting a couple up and having them be rotten inside. (don't just lower your cars by splining them if you want the bushings to last, either. BTDT) Had to make a trip all the way up to Oaktown to get a complete from Chris Morrice. This one ended up being the prize.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


ANd another part that is NLA, these thrust bushes... No matter the nice-ness of the beam, they are always at least a little cracked... Pick the best pair and stab them in...
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


In the end, my powder-coater was willing to try to work with the bakelite. After the fact, he tried to lower the temp of his oven and leave the stuff in for longer, and it flowed the powder on well and saved the bakelite at the same time. So, you don't have to be a Sawzall Samurai to powder-coat a beam, but do have to find a coater who cares...

So that's the beam itself, for now, we'll move on to other beam fun-ness in a future installment...
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Tram
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 12:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I never "started in" in the first place- you did. Wink

Now when you gonna stop hackin' up perfectly good parts that you've rat- fecked, step aside, and let your son build this thing RIGHT? Obviously, he's got all the talent here. His mother's side must have been automotive people!

Popcorn
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