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52panelvan Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2006 Posts: 350
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Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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Isn't that the answer then ? After all if you look at all the pictures they all look like customer converted coachbuilt vans that VW photographed to show off the wide range of uses their vans get put too and not to show off their own VW models. That's probably what's actually going on here?
Cant get a better product endorsement than a customers one! _________________ Austrian Kohlruss Deluxe
January 1954, 20-072397
The Kohlruss Barndoor Restoration - https://www.facebook.com/groups/641684399225180/
Instagram - rustykohlruss |
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CaLiBus Samba Member
Joined: May 27, 2011 Posts: 1097
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Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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52panelvan- your taking this "image" of a Barndoor swivel seat way too serious.. Not sure how else to describe the image to you. That is an image from an artist just like many other fake images printed by VW for Real Stuff.
Fact is VW advertized and printed a swivel seat for a Barndoor for all the masses to see and buy. NO Where does it say " Here we have a Fake swivel seat just tease you and never offer to you".. Why would ANY car company do that to their customers???..
Last edited by CaLiBus on Mon Mar 03, 2014 9:14 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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52panelvan Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2006 Posts: 350
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Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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CaLiBus wrote: |
52panelvan- your taking this "image" of a Barndoor swivel seat way too serious.. Not sure how else to describe the image to you that it is a image from an artist just like many other fake images printed by VW for Real Stuff.
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Ahhhh _________________ Austrian Kohlruss Deluxe
January 1954, 20-072397
The Kohlruss Barndoor Restoration - https://www.facebook.com/groups/641684399225180/
Instagram - rustykohlruss |
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CaLiBus Samba Member
Joined: May 27, 2011 Posts: 1097
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Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69733 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Lowdown Dirty Rat Samba Member
Joined: June 25, 2005 Posts: 877 Location: Cornwall, UK
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Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 2:15 am Post subject: |
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And with the raised seat we're looking for a 15 stone midget _________________ 1951 Samba 20-017894
1952 Samba 20-028952 |
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52panelvan Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2006 Posts: 350
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Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 2:58 am Post subject: |
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Lowdown Dirty Rat wrote: |
And with the raised seat we're looking for a 15 stone Barndoor driving midget |
..Haha right that's that mystery solved then!! _________________ Austrian Kohlruss Deluxe
January 1954, 20-072397
The Kohlruss Barndoor Restoration - https://www.facebook.com/groups/641684399225180/
Instagram - rustykohlruss |
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CaLiBus Samba Member
Joined: May 27, 2011 Posts: 1097
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Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 7:51 am Post subject: |
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Maybe one day before I hit the bucket and walk thru heavens gate (that's if they don't count or noticed some of the lap dances I've paid for) a guy will post here on this thread a mysterious mounting plate and missing bulk head |
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banana split Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2002 Posts: 1068 Location: Beautiful British Columbia Canada
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Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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Lowdown Dirty Rat wrote: |
It's defiantly not real and IS a Concept picture and not a production one in my eyes to.... But again - in a Brochure you don't advertise what you don't offer. |
Just my 2 cents...
The picture looks like a real photo to me. VW certainly had their images/photos highlighted and air brushed to make blurry details more sharp etc. I've seen it many times. I have a large original 1951 Beetle production line poster and it is VERY evident that it has been air brushed and touched up.
Are you guys saying that the "entire" photo is just an artists drawing? Or are you saying the Bus is real and the seat has been drawn in?
The whole works looks like the real deal in my eyes. Extended shifter, no passenger seat, no bulkhead etc. A true swivel seat Bus.
As for "you don't advertise what you don't offer" - Volkswagen has proved you wrong. VW printed brochures for the Notchback convertible and I also have a price list showing the cost of a T3 Ghia convertible. All cars they didn't put into production.
As for the swivel seat base not looking right in the photos, I think we are just looking at a cone shaped cover that is actually hiding the swivel mounting base. Who knows what things look like under that cover. You could probably almost call this a prototype. Such and early version would look a little crude. The cone wouldn't necessarily fit flush against the x-pattern in the wheel well.
Just my thoughts. _________________ My Beetles :
1951 Crotch Cooler 11G Split Ragtop
1953 Zwitter
1964 Chop Top |
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CaLiBus Samba Member
Joined: May 27, 2011 Posts: 1097
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Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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banana split wrote: |
Lowdown Dirty Rat wrote: |
It's defiantly not real and IS a Concept picture and not a production one in my eyes to.... But again - in a Brochure you don't advertise what you don't offer. |
Just my 2 cents...
The picture looks like a real photo to me. VW certainly had their images/photos highlighted and air brushed to make blurry details more sharp etc. I've seen it many times. I have a large original 1951 Beetle production line poster and it is VERY evident that it has been air brushed and touched up.
Are you guys saying that the "entire" photo is just an artists drawing? Or are you saying the Bus is real and the seat has been drawn in?
The whole works looks like the real deal in my eyes. Extended shifter, no passenger seat, no bulkhead etc. A true swivel seat Bus.
As for "you don't advertise what you don't offer" - Volkswagen has proved you wrong. VW printed brochures for the Notchback convertible and I also have a price list showing the cost of a T3 Ghia convertible. All cars they didn't put into production.
As for the swivel seat base not looking right in the photos, I think we are just looking at a cone shaped cover that is actually hiding the swivel mounting base. Who knows what things look like under that cover. You could probably almost call this a prototype. Such and early version would look a little crude. The cone wouldn't necessarily fit flush against the x-pattern in the wheel well.
Just my thoughts. |
So they started with a real image then airbrushed. Interesting... Thanks for clarifying and helping bringing our point across.
Would it be best that we stay more within time frame and production plants (Wolfsburge/Hanover)? Referring to your examples of type 3 convertible vs Barndoor.
Your 51 poster does help what went on during the Wolfsburg era of vehicles. |
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Lowdown Dirty Rat Samba Member
Joined: June 25, 2005 Posts: 877 Location: Cornwall, UK
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Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2014 1:50 am Post subject: |
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Airbrush touch up is the way they do it. But in my eye the non widened wheel arch and the arch frame, cone shadow are odd. I was thinking maybe they photographed a bus with no bulkhead. But you may be right.
I was thinking I don't think the raised seat is a problem. With no bulkhead you can lay the seat back low rider stylee _________________ 1951 Samba 20-017894
1952 Samba 20-028952 |
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tstracy39 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2008 Posts: 3294 Location: Seattle, WA
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Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2014 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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52panelvan wrote: |
Isn't that the answer then ? After all if you look at all the pictures they all look like customer converted coachbuilt vans that VW photographed to show off the wide range of uses their vans get put too and not to show off their own VW models. That's probably what's actually going on here?
Cant get a better product endorsement than a customers one! |
I stated in the other thread in the splitbus forum, only having seen the one picture of the seat and not the whole brochure, that it's possible the picture is from an advertisement for a special coachbuilt model Barndoor, or for the seat itself. Looking at the rest of the brochure, I think that's likely. Even doublecabs originally got their start as a small production run by coachbuilder Binz, commissioned by VW, and for a short time VW actively supplied knock-down Beetle components for certain coachbuilts and commercial vehicles, so it's not unlikely that at one time they supplied stripped-down Barndoor bodies and arranged for special conversions by coachbuilders to fit the customers needs, and it's possible that they would have advertised this service with a flashy, heavily retouched brochure like this one. The brochure could have also been commissioned by the coachbuilder itself, working independently from VW; coachbuilding was a big enough industry during the Barndoor time period that coachbuilders could have conceivably produced their own advertising, and there are a couple Barndoor based coachbuilts such as Kohlruss that were built without the cooperation of VW. I know you already know all this, not trying to bore you, just trying to support your point.
Edit: I just figured out how to view all 45 high resolution pictures from the book, and looking at them it becomes clear that the book was made to showcase the adaptability of the basic bus design by illustrating examples of how standard buses have been customized for dozens of different applications, and as well as to advertise certain factory options that were available at the time. All of the buses pictured appear to be real, so I think it's unlikely that the swivelseat barndoor in the picture doesn't exist. Several of the buses in the book have options that are known to have been available from the factory at the time, such as an ambulance style large rear hatch, so it's entirely possible that a swivelseat was a factory option too, but I'm still leaning towards coachbuilt on that one, and here is why: for every known factory option that's pictured in the book, there is a code given in parentheses (such as KW 527 for the ambulance style rear hatch, plus KW 529 for cab divider with sliding windows, M 52 for no-window small rear hatch, M 54 for Deluxe dash, etc.), and there is no code given for the swivel seat.
_________________ Check my classifieds for kewl gauges:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/search.php?username=tstracy39
EverettB wrote: |
I like your fork. |
Last edited by tstracy39 on Wed Mar 05, 2014 3:47 am; edited 6 times in total |
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tstracy39 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2008 Posts: 3294 Location: Seattle, WA
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Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2014 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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easy e wrote: |
Maybe more elusive than the SS barndoor... the BD Jersey Looker prototype!
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It's pretty clear that this is an aircraft marshaling vehicle. Looking at this and the other picture of it, it appears to have a clear Plexiglas roof panel skylight above the front windshields which is pretty kewl. The background on this panel is a transport aircraft; the background on the swivelseat barndoor panel is the turbine room of a power plant, maybe that's a clue of some sort. Edit: bigger picture
_________________ Check my classifieds for kewl gauges:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/search.php?username=tstracy39
EverettB wrote: |
I like your fork. |
Last edited by tstracy39 on Wed Mar 05, 2014 1:26 am; edited 1 time in total |
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CaLiBus Samba Member
Joined: May 27, 2011 Posts: 1097
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Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 7:32 am Post subject: |
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Bravo tstracy39 thank you!
Coach built or factory built the swivel seat was a "VW option" is what we clearly see here given that the seat is in the same book along with other FACTORY KNOWN OPTIONS .. Now that would be difficult to dispute!
More than likely the seat was commissioned by VW for a coach builder. Independent coach builders that were not commissioned by Vw would not have been in the same book along with other known Vw options. |
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streetwagens Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2005 Posts: 475 Location: Wales, GB
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tstracy39 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2008 Posts: 3294 Location: Seattle, WA
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Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2014 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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CaLiBus wrote: |
Bravo tstracy39 thank you!
Coach built or factory built the swivel seat was a "VW option" is what we clearly see here given that the seat is in the same book along with other FACTORY KNOWN OPTIONS .. Now that would be difficult to dispute!
More than likely the seat was commissioned by VW for a coach builder. Independent coach builders that were not commissioned by Vw would not have been in the same book along with other known Vw options. |
There is also a ton of stuff in the book that is clearly homebrewed, or made from aftermarket components originating from a non VW affiliated manufacturer. It's likely that the swivel seat was an option they did have available at one point during the Barndoor era, but if that's the case then VW foresaw such little demand for this option that they outsourced the production to a coachbuilder, but one can't assume this just from looking at the book, because VW probably didn't have a hand in having that iron-lungmobile put together, or the bookmobile, or the pig hauler for that matter. There are a couple models pictured in the book that are known to have started from stripped-down Barndoors delivered in bare primer to coachbuilders, such as the firebus, but many of the other buses appear to have been modified without any involvement from VW.
The swivelseat BD probably wasn't a one-off prototype since it's in this book, so there might be a surviving swivelseat BD out there, but I'd be surprised. There are only about two or three surviving BDs with a small no-window rear hatch, and a similarly small number of non-ambulances with the large ambulance style hatch, and non-deluxes with a deluxe dash, and these were all options that had sufficient enough demand that VW produced them all in-house. _________________ Check my classifieds for kewl gauges:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/search.php?username=tstracy39
EverettB wrote: |
I like your fork. |
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bally Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2006 Posts: 1182 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 1:39 am Post subject: |
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Lowdown Dirty Rat wrote: |
My two passions in the VW world are barndoors and Swivel seats. I never dared dream they would overlap. |
Ditto! I'd like one in rhd too though please
Dave |
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tstracy39 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2008 Posts: 3294 Location: Seattle, WA
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tstracy39 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2008 Posts: 3294 Location: Seattle, WA
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Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 1:30 am Post subject: |
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German isn't my native language and Google translator wasn't any help; what does it say in this caption on the bottom of the page showing the Barndoor with the deluxe dashboard with auxiliary instrument/radio pods?
"VW-Kombi als Verkehrs-Unfall-Bereitchaftswagen mit Laufrost auf dem Dach und von hinten ansetzbarer Aufstiegleiter" _________________ Check my classifieds for kewl gauges:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/search.php?username=tstracy39
EverettB wrote: |
I like your fork. |
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geraldcrewcab Samba Member
Joined: April 10, 2007 Posts: 119 Location: Germany
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Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:58 am Post subject: |
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"VW-Kombi als Verkehrs-Unfall-Bereitchaftswagen mit Laufrost auf dem Dach und von hinten ansetzbarer Aufstiegleiter"
means:
VW-Kombi as traffic accident preparedness with catwalk (gallery) at the roof and with a rising ladder that was fixing from the backside. |
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