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MsTaboo
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2006
Posts: 4082
Location: East Kootenay, British Columbia
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 Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 2:32 pm Post subject: Re: More fun with Lizard skin |
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| Microbusdeluxe wrote: |
Taking apart the interior to continue with my Lizard skin application I got a couple of surprises.
The rear hatch has two 1/8" thick stainless steel panels screwed onto it. So
either the previous owner was a secret agent who required bullet proof shielding or syncro 16s all have this or do all the water boxers have this? Any knowledge would be illuminating.
I knew the 16 would have these welded panels and hoped I could just shove the nozzle in and spray away. Unfortunately, Hans and Fritz got there first and shot a kilo of Waxoyl into the panel. From what little I know of the Lizard Skin, it's not going to stick to this.
The two panels which are accessible are also Waxolyed, but unfortunately also have some rust at the bottom right on the seam. This leads to a real dilemma. Does anyone have an opinion on the feasibility of cutting out the welds, cleaning up everything, treating the rust, spraying the Lizards and then welding it back up. The crux being can it be welded without affecting the paint on the exterior?
Weigh in on opinions and ideas. |
Those extra panels are interesting. I wonder if the factory added those for a little extra stiffening of the rear hatch when using the plastic windows?
As for the rust, that is one very special van and stopping the spread of any rust should hopefully be high on your list. Do you have any plans to redo the seal between the hightop and the rain gutter? That is a notorious rust prone area that can lead to very bad and difficult to repair rust within all the pillars.
I found that most of the road noise in that van compared to my '90 Syncro Westy was coming from the front door leading edge because it lacks the extra seal the later vans received (which is odd being an '89, or did they start using that seal in '90?) Tracking down and installing that seal should greatly help with wind noise.
p.s. kinda a shame to cover those pristine floors!
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Currently:
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Microbusdeluxe 
Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2003
Posts: 980
Location: Bellingham, WA
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| Posted: Mon May 18, 2015 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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Job is done, Joker is back together & tomorrow we're on a road trip to get Morel mushrooms, so we can test 'er out on some back roads. Final thoughts on the whole soundproofing thing.
What I thought was the beginning of rust inside one of the few open areas of the interior actually turned out to be blobs of Waxoyl that just had a rusty reddish tone. Cleaned everything up, sprayed soundproofing where I could reach, then snuck in the tiny Waxoyl nozzle and blasted all the unreachable parts. Added to what the Wolfsburg boys originally applied I'm probably packing a kilo of Waxoyl in each panel.
I like the fact that the spray process provides rustproofing. I'm not as certain that it attenuates sound any better than mats. Rapping on my front doors (mats & VB-2 liner) they actually "thunk" better than the sliding door (Lizard Skin).
Proper cleaning & scuffing of any painted surfaces is essential for good adherence of the sprayed products. I missed a spot on my nicely painted floors (actually the floor on the driver's side had some issues with old brake fluid eating away a couple of areas so this whole deal was beneficial) and the sprayed soundproofing peeled away. So get real small and don't miss prepping any areas.
As everyone knows you need to label everything and save all fasteners in clearly marked baggies if you are going to have any hope of putting it back together. Even with that it took me a couple of days and lots of cursing to get the damn cabinets to line up and go together.
A final point. I covered all of the ground points and screw holes with tape. Problem with that is that after a half dozen coating of material, your tape is buried. While there won't be a next time for me on this job, I'd advise you to put a small flag, or matchstick or something that rises above the surface and marks you taped over screw holes, otherwise you'll find yourself mounting a cabinet, attaching most of it and then realizing one of the holes is totally blocked with a tape/soundproofing blob. You then get to remove the cabinet and uncover the hole, fun indeed.
P.S. I have 1 gallon of Sound Control as well as the whole spray gun kit on the classified page, here's your chance to join in the fun at significant savings!!
_________________
'69 Squareback RIP
'65 21 window deluxe sold before the price spike, damn it.
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'81 Westy sold
'89 hightop Westy Joker syncro 16" now with Bostig!
Last edited by Microbusdeluxe on Mon May 18, 2015 1:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Mon May 18, 2015 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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I roll up pieces of aluminum foil to make your "flags" for fasteners holes.
Works well.
Cut around them with an Exacto Knife. |
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Surfy Murphy
Samba Member
Joined: September 05, 2013
Posts: 139
Location: Brooklyn, New York
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| Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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I just had my van sprayed with Lizard Skin while getting painted and now it sounds so good I just want to open and close the doors over and over.
Insyncro, you mentioned using Roxul Comfort Batts after the Lizardskin for thermal insulation. Do you also use a plastic vapor barrier over the Roxul like in a house? I want to dial in the ultimate insulation combo, but I'm worried about moisture getting into the panels. I'm curious about what other folks have had success with.
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1987 Orly Blue Sunroof Syncro, EJ25 |
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Surfy Murphy
Samba Member
Joined: September 05, 2013
Posts: 139
Location: Brooklyn, New York
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| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 9:38 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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Lizard skin update... It's not so great with oil. It seems moderately resistant to solvent, but went completely gooey on me after spilling lubricating oil on one small patch. I had to pick out the goo and reapply.
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1987 Orly Blue Sunroof Syncro, EJ25 |
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 4:59 am Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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| Two part poly ureas...aka truck bed liner is what you want if you plan to spill solvents on the coating and not have it degrade. |
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Surfy Murphy
Samba Member
Joined: September 05, 2013
Posts: 139
Location: Brooklyn, New York
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 6:23 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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For sure insyncro. I figured others would want to know. If I were to do it again I'd paint over the lizard skin with a patch around the engine lid, or maybe skip it there and use something else.
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1987 Orly Blue Sunroof Syncro, EJ25 |
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snwbrdr435
Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2013
Posts: 337
Location: North Of Boston
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:48 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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| Using lizard skin C.I and S.C in my friends sprinter build right now. Wow this stuff is awesome and easy to work with. So far no Complaints! |
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 3:12 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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| snwbrdr435 wrote: |
| Using lizard skin C.I and S.C in my friends sprinter build right now. Wow this stuff is awesome and easy to work with. So far no Complaints! |
Glad to hear it.
Just curious....how many gallons to cover the interior of one of those?
Thanks. |
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snwbrdr435
Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2013
Posts: 337
Location: North Of Boston
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 12:20 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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Not entirely sure yet, we used about 4 gallons of s.c so far. That said I left for work yesterday and lets just say things got messy and there was quite a bit of product spilled/unused around the containers when I returned this morning....  |
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 12:53 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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| snwbrdr435 wrote: |
| Not entirely sure yet, we used about 4 gallons of s.c so far. That said I left for work yesterday and lets just say things got messy and there was quite a bit of product spilled/unused around the containers when I returned this morning.... |
Bummer, expensive stuff to waste like that.
I take 3/4s of the buckets and put them all into one 5 gallon pail to mix them.
I have a bucket of water handy.
I dip the mixing wand into the water, than into the LS.
Once mixed, I run my hand down the wand and get most back into the pail.
Than put the wand and drill into the water and spin off the excess.
If you work on a clean piece of plastic, keep an extra bucket handy to put any that has hit the floor into.
I use this stuff on my first pass as it will get covered up if it has any contaminants in it, but if clean plastic is used, it should be good as new. |
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snwbrdr435
Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2013
Posts: 337
Location: North Of Boston
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:50 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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| insyncro wrote: |
Bummer, expensive stuff to waste like that. |
Yup, I was bummed to see the mess. Not exactly how I would have done things but he also expects to have this finished with his webasto heater and cooksurface aux batteries/solar setup plus cabinets non of which are installed, all ready to leave by friday. Had 4 months to start and he waited till now. |
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:51 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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| snwbrdr435 wrote: |
| insyncro wrote: |
Bummer, expensive stuff to waste like that. |
Yup, I was bummed to see the mess. Not exactly how I would have done things but he also expects to have this finished with his webasto heater and cooksurface aux batteries/solar setup plus cabinets non of which are installed, all ready to leave by friday. Had 4 months to start and he waited till now. |
I dont know about all of that.
I posted this thread for Volks to be able to DIY this application.
Again, sorry to hear about your setbacks. |
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snwbrdr435
Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2013
Posts: 337
Location: North Of Boston
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:57 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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[quote="insyncro"]
| snwbrdr435 wrote: |
| insyncro wrote: |
Bummer, expensive stuff to waste like that. |
I dont know about all of that.
I posted this thread for Volks to be able to DIY this application.
Again, sorry to hear about your setbacks. |
Friends last minute work plans not mine! I'll be back over there tomorrow to check up on him. The first layer of Sound Control I put on worked wonderfully and is a product I can't wait to use again. They went to town on a second layer/ C.I. layer and made a mess.
I am always thankful you update us with your work |
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 4:26 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulat |
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Borrowed from my Monstaliner application experience, this roller will help apply LS if you do not want to spray it.
The 9" roller covers a lot of area fast.
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thasty07
Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2014
Posts: 310
Location: Bend, OR
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| Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 8:17 am Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulation |
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Curious to hear about the spray gun for Lizard Skin. Do you have to use their gun or will any large opening gun work?
Im refering to the Monstaliner sprayer that has large openings and can move very think substances.
Or is there something unique to this that their gun is required?
Just curious, and if I dont have to buy a new gun, I would prefer to use what I have, but results are results and Im not wanting to compromise too much. |
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0cean
Samba Member
Joined: February 29, 2012
Posts: 1149
Location: California
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| Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 2:26 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulation |
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Funny this came up, because I was on the phone with Monster liner asking the same question yesterday. Will Lizard skin gun work with monsterliner. The sales guy said as long as it has a 1.4 (or was it .4?) opening it should be fine.
I will let you know this weekend when I do a couple spray tests. Don't think there will be a problems.
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I'm not a mechanic, I just play one on the internet
Cluster Rebuild:
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(Number of completely different vehicles parts used: 3) |
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Five13avue
Samba Member
Joined: May 21, 2014
Posts: 2
Location: Boise, Idaho
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| Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 9:58 am Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulation |
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| Daryl, I am middle of a rebuiltd of a 87 syncro. Just ready to put the 1.8t in from SAH. Just came out upon this thread. Regarding lizard skin, do you see any application of lizard skin on the roof either interior or exterior to better insulate from heat in summer and cold in winter. If so can you give detailed thoughts on products and process. I have been winter camping without pop top up and roof is a major source of heat loss. Summer not so bad for heat gain cause I have solar on top but still would like to keep it cooler in >100* idaho summers. |
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thasty07
Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2014
Posts: 310
Location: Bend, OR
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| Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 10:52 am Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulation |
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| 0cean wrote: |
Funny this came up, because I was on the phone with Monster liner asking the same question yesterday. Will Lizard skin gun work with monsterliner. The sales guy said as long as it has a 1.4 (or was it .4?) opening it should be fine.
I will let you know this weekend when I do a couple spray tests. Don't think there will be a problems. |
Let us know how it goes! |
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Merian
Samba Member
Joined: January 04, 2014
Posts: 5212
Location: Orygun
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| Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2016 1:58 pm Post subject: Re: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulation |
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| I'd use a product made specifically for roofs (trunk lids, etc.) on the roof |
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