DuPont Product lines for Single-Stage? (Long)

[Clatter]

So, over the years, I have learned a bit about paint...

The #1 lesson is "Find a good rep".
In AZ, I used a place that sold Sherwin Williams, and was always happy with their products.

When I moved to CA, that went out the window.
We will say, that for several reasons, my experience with the reps here has been worse than bad.

So now, I am shopping for a new line of paints, and there are two here locally; PPG and DuPont.
From what I can gather, the lines are similar in quality.
The PPG seems more popular, and info is easy to find about DP and Concept and it's all good.
But then, going into the local store here, I can tell right away that they really aren't interested in working with a home-hobbyist dumbass like me.
Plus, they are new, and not proven and seem likely to go away soon.

The local DuPont place has been here forever, locals that I know and trust recommend them, and they are easy enough to work with. They are, however super busy, and don't really have time to give me a full education on their products. hence my dilemma; how on earth do I find out about their products enough to even figure out what I want?

Obviously, the Nason line is the cheaper stuff, and you can find out about it from the DuPont site.
What is their better stuff called? Cromax?
Dag, their site is impossible to work with.
Here's what you get if you try to access automotive coatings, exterior:
http://www.dupont.com/industries/automotive.html

I wanted a premium single-stage, L41 Black in color, and the compatible epoxy primer, 2K, etc.
Anybody know a good place where I can figure out exactly what I should be looking for?

Is this their good single-stage product?
http://dpcecatalog.dupont.com/dcat/us/en/dr/catalog.html#prodTypeCd=topcoat
That black looks tempting...

Any input is welcome.
Have a real low tolerance for randomly groping around in the dark for information....
Thanks![/url]
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Bus Motor Build

What’s That Noise?!?

[bubblehead]

Spend some time on DuPont and ppg websites and familiarize yourself with the products you are interested in. Read the tech sheets, msds etc. When you can ask specific questions (rather than walking in and saying" teach me") you'll get better service. Maybe hit the place on Saturday when they are less busy. I am an amateur and can say the PPG Concept makes you look like a pro. Lays down really nice and user friendly. No experience with DuPont.
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[Bobnotch]

[wcfvw69]

I recently resprayed my 67 with PPG Concept paint. It's not hard to use and sprays nicely and does lay down well. As mentioned, EVERYTHING the overspray gets on is sticky. Luckily, I made a paint booth out of plastic sheets and they were STICKY. The guys I bought the paint from deal mainly with professional shops but were fine with me asking questions. Their sales rep even over heard a conversation and came out and shared his experiences. The paint is EXPENSIVE. The gallon of Concept, reducers/hardeners added up to $500 bucks.

One note on the single stage Concept. I had a pretty good sag on the rear of my roof. I thought nothing of it and figured I'd color sand it down the next day. WRONG. The color seems to rise to the top of the paint and when I flattened it down, it was clearly a different color on that sag spot causing a full respray of the roof. The PPG rep at the shop was surprised as well. Oh well, my fault with the sag but I wouldn't of had this issue if I'd done base/clear as the clear would of sanded down fine.
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[Brent]

Automotive Color on Lincoln in Watsonville?
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69 Fastback Build
Berg5 Build

[Clatter]

Thanks for the help, guys.

I'll elaborate a bit more on how i came to learn why a good rep is important-
My bus has a custom mix ,done all the time, by Space Age in Mesa, AZ.
Straight white only - a "0/500" mix. No other colors, not an OEM, just white toner only.
An obvious choice in AZ, as the lighter the color, the cooler the car.
I wanted the brightest, whitest white they had, and they were like "no problem, we do it all the time, check this out".

Then i move to CA, and even though i have to drive a long way over the hill to San Jo, i have a Sherwin Williams place to go to. I buy all of my supplies and everything, but when i try and buy paint, they tell me they don't know what i'm talking about, and go away.
i went away, but after searching, there wasn't another SW place for hundreds of miles, and they were too stupid to mix paint too.
After trying again on another day, when another guy, who seemed like he was smarter, was there, he listened to my story, and mixed me up some paint, saying it was what i wanted.
After renting a booth and getting a painter on the hook to help me, i shoot the car with some egg-shell color.
Sitting there, after days and days of work and tons of money, "I sure hope this changes color as it dries..."
I went back there to try and get them to replace my paint with what i need, they told me to go away, and only after getting in their face ready to take all of them on, did a manager show up, mix me the correct color, and tell me never to come back again.
I can't tell you how pissed off i was. I waited in the parking lot for the guy to come out after work, until i cooled off a bit and left... It was time to settle this issue the old fashioned way..

Anyhow, i do NOT want to repeat this scenario, so am going to be super choosy about what shop i go to.
I don't want to drive the hill, so it's DuPont or PPG. I really like the PPG idea better, but being paranoid, i went into the local shops and started asking questions. Also asked local painters who i trust, too.

Brent you are right about which place is my local PPG place...
I went in, and, even though they were empty, the guy seemed slightly annoyed that a (white) guy would go in there and start asking a bunch of questions about which products work best with what and how much stuff costs. A couple of hangarounds were sitting there doing nothing and they just kind of vibed me wrong. I remembered my SW experience and left.

My local hero painter here goes to the DuPont place and recommends them. Even though he's super busy with a bunch of customers, he answers a few that he can and throws me a stack of sheets.

I'm on for DuPont for this reason alone.

Which sucks, because Bob Notch has given me great info about PPG, along with others here. There just seems to be so much more info about PPG products than DuPont. i dig around for DuPont info, and i can't find anything. Shit, I can't even find the _name_ of the product I'm supposed to be looking for(!)

So, in a selfish way, I'm glad your PPG guy went vapor on you Bob. That way you and i can learn to de-crypt DuPont's high-end single-stage cryptology and get this stuff deciphered.

I really think it's time to go and buy a sixer of Longboard and go and see if i can't pick my local hero painter's brain....

ANybody out there know about which is which with DuPont stuff?
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Bus Motor Build

What’s That Noise?!?

[Bobnotch]

[wcfvw69]

[Clatter]

Ha, funny...
Space Age was a great place. No wonder they are still going strong.
Back in 96(!) or so when I was there over half the people were young females.
Like high-school age..
The owners daughters and friends or something?
It was a trip to have a super-cute young girl who knew all about it style you out on just what you need.

Unlike these other places, where they just want to go out of business as soon as possible so they can get drunk and bitch about the economy or the president or something...

Anyways, translating DuPontese:
Axalta=Cromax
Topcoat=Single-stage

Do I have this correct?
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Bus Motor Build

What’s That Noise?!?

[Brent]

It's a bit far for you, but there's a paint shop on Broadway in Seaside that deals DuPont. The guy was pretty cool every time I went there for stuff.
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69 Fastback Build
Berg5 Build

[Clatter]

The DuPont guy here in Santa Cruz is pretty cool so far, too.

I just need to make sure I'm going down the right path, really...

Got to get a mental picture of exactly what steps i need to follow, all the way through.

And i need to get the DuPont version of PPG DP90.
Epoxy sealer in hopefully in black, as that's what color I will be getting.

I'm also thinking of geting a cheap HVLP 'primer gun', as they are only like $60.
The old-fashioned LVHP(?) guns i have, while in good shape, would likely pay for the new gun with all of their wasted paint due to overspray?

They sell Non-water-based stuff here, too.
We are so close to the ocean, that there isn't any pollution, so no need for low-VOC paint..
Even though all of the hippies are here!
Wierd, huh?
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Bus Motor Build

What’s That Noise?!?

[Clatter]

OK, i have been pouring through the Cromax site, trying to learn as much as i can.
Here, (Bob) this looks like DuPont's version of PPGs DP90:
http://dpcecatalog.dupont.com/dcat/us/en/dr/product/V-2970S.html
An epoxy primer; non-sandable, for bare metal, and, notice, it can also be used as a sealer over primer surfacer.
Like the DP can...
One thing i don't like as much, is that (according to the TDS), after 2 days it will have to be scuffed before re-coated, unlike PPGs DP epoxy, which can be top-coated without scuffing for up to 7 days.

This is a bit of an issue because there are going to be many nooks and crannies on my type 3 that i will be unable to reach with a scuff pad or sandpaper, but can reach with a spray gun, and, I would like more time before i have to top-coat the epoxy...
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Bus Motor Build

What’s That Noise?!?

[Clatter]

Also,

Why not Standox or Spies-Hecker?

Are they that much more ?
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Bus Motor Build

What’s That Noise?!?

[Bobnotch]

[VintageVulture]

Im very experienced with both dupont and ppg single stage urethanes. My opinion on quality and spray-ability is that ppg kicks butt in the quality dept, dupont is slightly easier to spray. I prefer the ppg finished quality, dupont seems too thin.
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The best things in life aren't Things
(they're Buses)

[Bobnotch]