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How to know which engine tins I am missing?
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khalimadeath
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 6:45 pm    Post subject: How to know which engine tins I am missing? Reply with quote

I searched but to no avail I was not able to find a list WITH pictures of all the engine tins so I can order the right ones. I have found a lot of them in the classifieds but I dont want to order what I already have..

engine in question..

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Thanks for any helpful links.... or just an answer would be great!
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Danwvw
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What year? Looks like the ones that can be seen are all there! Often the Heat-Riser-Covers are missing. See Item "K" on the Bus Boys site.
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Last edited by Danwvw on Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:12 pm; edited 2 times in total
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Before you get too carried away with tin you may want to look into some fuel line clamps Wink

Noting looks too awful from here as far as the tin goes, how about some more pics from above and below?
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Tcash
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.awesomepowdercoat.com/Original_German_Engine_Tin.html

http://www.jerseylooker.com/FicheDump/EarlyBaywindow/EarlyBay-1.html

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/chassisdating.php
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khalimadeath
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
Before you get too carried away with tin you may want to look into some fuel line clamps Wink

Noting looks too awful from here as far as the tin goes, how about some more pics from above and below?


Haha yea, well PO just put new lines on it apparently, I am not driving it. The motor and trans will be coming out soon so I will begin collecting all the things I know I need now, then order more as they come up. I will get some more pics..

Also its a 1970, 1600 I believe.. Also having trouble finding a thread that describes the differences between a type 1, type 2 ect.. most of them have pictures but nothing particularly labeled. I have been lurking the site apx. 6 hours a week and I find that most threads people are referenced to fail to answer the question and end up leading to no answer at all. When I search I just find thread of people asking questions and people telling them to search..
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Danwvw
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your engine photo shows it is a Type 1 1600 based Single port engine which is what came in the 1970 VW Bus, In 1971 they Went to the Dual Port, Still a Type 1 engine then in 1972 the buses for the USA got the Type 4 engine which went from Dual Carbs and 1700cc to a full fuel injected 2 liter engine. The Type 1 engines are up-right the Type 4's are flat on top.

Photo of the Type 4 Engine:
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Tcash
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6635854#6635854
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There isn't really a Type II engine in 71 and earlier Bay, just a Type 1 with some slight modifications to the case for the rear support bar. As others posted the later Bays had Type 4 engines from the 411/412 cars.
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Jeff Geisen
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do not see a breast plate tin in the photo...
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khalimadeath
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok great thanks guys that will be very helpful when I start ordering parts. i will get some more pics of underneath and above today..
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skid
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeff Geisen wrote:
I do not see a breast plate tin in the photo...


x2
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asiab3
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The link to Awesome Powdercoat that Tcash posted is pretty comprehensive. Check out this numbered guide:

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Like Jeff and skid said, you're missing the breast tin, which is number 15 and on the right center of the picture.

You're missing the #10 left lower rear air deflector, and I'd guess you're missing the #9 (right rear lower) tin as well.


Once you have the breast plate in, you'll want a "stovepipe" preheat tube to go under the breast plate and pull warm air from near the #9 tin (and #2 cylinder head.) You'll need some fresh-air heater hose to connect the "stovepipe" to the air cleaner's lower pipe intake.* Then when it's cold/humid outside, you can flip the valve on the air cleaner to pull in pre-heated air which helps in drivability and fuel economy when the engine is cold.

[img]http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=1089220[/img]


*You should straighten out the kink in your left hose. Maybe cut the excess out and use it for the preheat/stovepipe setup?
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khalimadeath
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thats a lot of tins ^^ lol I am gonna have to try and figure out where each one is and mark them so I can narrow it down more. With that many I can see how hard it could be to identify them all.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many of the tins you can see from the pictures. Things like the fan shroud, upper cylinder tins, and backing plates (4, 5, and 6) are obvious. The thermostat and flaps (14 and 24) are nice to have, but some people run without them. They help the engine get up to operating temp quicker, which is healthy for oil life on short trips and engine life in the long run. Sled tins like 11, 12, and 13 you can easily see from underneath the engine.

One of the most common mistakes new engine builders make is using a bug front (front of engine is front of bus. Technically, you're always looking at the back of the engine from the hatch,) firewall tin instead of a bus tin. We're talking about #7, and technically only came 1971 buses with the exit hole for the doghouse oil cooler. Up to 1970 it was the same shape with no hole. Even then, it looks like a bug firewall with extra metal tacked on. That is a common way of making a bus firewall tin out of a bug tin.

Remember, these cars are about 45 years old, so just because it came from the factory a certain way doesn't mean it's still that way. Check, check, and recheck.


Do you have a doghouse shroud or non-doghouse shroud? We're feeling behind the shroud for parts 1, 2, and 3 here. The red line is where the firewall tin goes:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here are the bus firewall tins. See the exit hole for the doghouse oil cooler now? Also, take a look at the arched bead running roughly horizontally through them. That's the shape of a bug tin, the bus tin is larger. Which do you have?

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Last edited by asiab3 on Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Tcash
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
busdaddy:how about some more pics from above and below?

Quote:
khalimadeath:i will get some more pics of underneath and above today..
Popcorn
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khalimadeath
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


want sure exactly where or what to take the pictures off so I just kinda stuck my phone under there and got a couple. If there and area in specific you suggest I can get more pics..
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Brian
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad to see the sled tins are there. But holy oil sump batman.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lustig69 wrote:
Glad to see the sled tins are there. But holy oil sump batman.


Thats what i was thinking! Is that thing gunked up or what?! ha

Ill get some more pics tomorrow, there seems to be more to all these engine tins than I thought. Kinda strange why they would use so many..
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

khalimadeath wrote:

Thats what i was thinking! Is that thing gunked up or what?! ha

Ill get some more pics tomorrow, there seems to be more to all these engine tins than I thought. Kinda strange why they would use so many..


Just pretend the tins are like coolant hoses on your watercooled cars. Actually, that's exactly how they work, and that's why I'm happy to help you not "spill your coolant" everywhere. Wink And VW didn't put unnecessary parts on their economy cars...

A pressureized car wash or even a pressure washer with some engine degreaser will work wonders on your underside. It looks like regular neglected VW oil mist plus ten years of sitting in a dusty barn or something. Clean engines are fun engines to work on.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't know how you are intending to use your rig, but if you are going to be going off the pavement much, I would ditch the enlarged sump. To vulnerable to rock damage in my book.
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