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Diesel aux oil cooler
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MsTaboo
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 2:38 pm    Post subject: Diesel aux oil cooler Reply with quote

Please help!

I have a Tristar with a 1.6TD to 1.9TD (AAZ) setup that just won't stay as cool as I would like with the stock cooling system.
Brickworks in the UK sells a very nice oil cooler setup:
http://www.brickwerks.co.uk/index.php/oil-cooler-kit-t3-diesel.html
But as we all know, he won't/can't sell to North America.

Can anyone help me source the necessary bits to build one of these from parts available here?
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Dampcamper
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would the stock water-cooled oil cooler from a 1.6 liter NA Vanagon work in your application? It is sandwiched between the oil filter angle adapter and the filter itself. If you find a cooler make sure and get the extended-length threaded tube too. It gets fed from and back to the coolant system.
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hans j
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got some oil cooler parts from Mocal. They also make a 200* thermostatic sandwich plate but I don't know if it's listed.

http://www.batinc.net/mocal.htm
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jerrydog411
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MsTaboo

Greetings from the wet coast.

I have been pondering, and likely will get the system from Chris Corkins (Vanistan motors / posts as tencentlife) as they are engineered to be more than up to the task.

I would sugegst you contact Chris as he has a couple of options.

Here is his reply to my enquiry a while back:

John,

"You would most likely want the 2.1 2WD kit, at $350, for an on-road van.

I also offer the Syncro kit, it is the only kit that includes a fan, it can be used on 2WD vans if fan cooling is desired. It costs $550.

For most vans that are used on-road the fan isn't needed, once you are going more than about 25mph there is plenty of airflow down the D-pillar for the cooler. At lower speeds rpms are also low so the oil doesn't heat up enough to need the extra cooling, so that arrangement works out well and saves a lot of expense.

When offroading in low gears you see the combination of higher rpms but low ground speed, that's why I offer the Syncro kit with a fan. It also has an Earl's cooler, much more expensive but necessary to fit the Syncro's D-pillar (the fuel filler tube runs thru there making it impossible to fit the coolers I use in the 2WD kits there). The fan has an adjustable thermo-controller as well.

All the kits use the Mocal thermostatic sandwich plate adapter, so the oil isn't shunted to the cooler until its temp exceeds 180F.

I know some diesel users are very concerned about engine temps and add a lot of extra cooling help, that's why I mention the Syncro kit to you, but I can't advise as to whether your diesel would benefit from the extra fan cooling or not, I'm not any kind of authority on diesels in the Vanagon. You might want to dig around a bit and see where the diesel "experts" stand on that question.


Chris Corkins
Vanistan
Abiquiu, NM, USA
[email protected] "
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MsTaboo
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dampcamper wrote:
Would the stock water-cooled oil cooler from a 1.6 liter NA Vanagon work in your application? It is sandwiched between the oil filter angle adapter and the filter itself. If you find a cooler make sure and get the extended-length threaded tube too. It gets fed from and back to the coolant system.


Thanks for the idea but the late model diesels (mines a 89' from Sweden) came with the small oil cooler that the filter threads into just like the Wasserboxers.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I'm looking to build an the aux cooler like the link to BW
http://www.brickwerks.co.uk/index.php/oil-cooler-kit-t3-diesel.html
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MsTaboo
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hans j wrote:
I got some oil cooler parts from Mocal. They also make a 200* thermostatic sandwich plate but I don't know if it's listed.

http://www.batinc.net/mocal.htm


Thanks Hans, I noticed that BW's kit uses Mocal parts. I'm mainly concerned with getting all the right fittings so I need part numbers, etc.
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MsTaboo
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Jerrydog,
I looked at Chris's kits before posting here. I guess I could get in contact with him, but like he says, he's not familiar with diesels.
I have the added condition of working on a Tristar/Doka. They don't have the D pillar, the truck bed makes the rear corner different.
While a shorter length of hose would be nice, the front mounted cooler location eliminates the need for a fan.
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jerrydog411
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

forgot to mention; mine is a diesel also and that is what got me interested in the Vanistan cooler ... designed primarily for the WBX ... works well with the AAZ or JX also.

we posted at the same time. forgot about your lack of D pillar; i am sure he cam make a different hose length kit for you and he has a kit with and a kit without a fan.

I just bring him / his ideas up as his products all get rave reviews and his support is very good.

Let us know how you proceed as I am curious also.

Cheers.
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Country Doc1
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was wondering the same thing. I have a 1.6TD JX motor, and it's an 89 that has the small factory accessory oil cooler as well.

Not sure whether the best approach is to add Chris' aux cooler, or the Brickwerks one?

dc
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Country Doc1
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was wondering the same thing. I have a 1.6TD JX motor, and it's an 89 that has the small factory accessory oil cooler as well.

Not sure whether the best approach is to add Chris' aux cooler, or the Brickwerks one?

dc
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denwood
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The guys at Mocal do not recommend more than six feet of hose on a wet sump system. Dry sump systems use a transfer pump which apparently makes the difference in 911 front cooler installs. Chris's kit will save you a few bucks and work just fine. I did a gas version of what you are looking for, parts list from my install will work:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=531173

Have seen at least one DOKA cooler setup with a NACA type air intake duct installed in the rear quarter.
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hans j
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MsTaboo wrote:
hans j wrote:
I got some oil cooler parts from Mocal. They also make a 200* thermostatic sandwich plate but I don't know if it's listed.

http://www.batinc.net/mocal.htm


Thanks Hans, I noticed that BW's kit uses Mocal parts. I'm mainly concerned with getting all the right fittings so I need part numbers, etc.


Part numbers are going to depend on where you want to place the cooler and if any specialty fittings are needed. I think all my stuff was AN8 or AN10. They can supply you with the correct fittings and hose if you call or email. Also a local hose/rubber shop can supply you with fittings and hose.

Note though that the thermostatic plate doesn't cut off oil to the cooler 100% There is always some oil flowing through the cooler and on REALLY cold days you might have trouble keeping oil at a good temp! I had one on my Audi (200*F plate) and when I was headed to Colorado one year, I had to keep the revs up to keep oil temps from dropping below 150*F!

When I install one on my TDI, I am going to use my extra 200*F plate and a water to oil cooler running on the return line from my water to air intercooler.
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westyventures
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did a mod to the stock layout that really works well:
Ditch the stock smaller water/oil cooler and replace with the Touareg/Audi V6 cooler that is not only larger but has better internal cooling fin layout. THEN, block off the connection where the cooler flows into the diesel lower hose from the radiator to the thermostat cover. Replace the bypass hose (head to pump) with the one from an AAZ or 1Z/AHU TDi car, connecting the cooler port now to that hose's tee. Now it flows all the time and not just when the thermostat opens - and flows more than ever possible with the former routing. The results are astounding: No matter how hard I push this the oil temps never rise over 115C, 95-100 is normal now. Coolant temp seems to have stabilized lower as well. The stock radiator and cooling system has plenty of capacity to handle the oil cooling as well.
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jerrydog411
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

westyventures wrote:
I did a mod to the stock layout that really works well:
Ditch the stock smaller water/oil cooler and replace with the Touareg/Audi V6 cooler that is not only larger but has better internal cooling fin layout. THEN, block off the connection where the cooler flows into the diesel lower hose from the radiator to the thermostat cover. Replace the bypass hose (head to pump) with the one from an AAZ or 1Z/AHU TDi car, connecting the cooler port now to that hose's tee. Now it flows all the time and not just when the thermostat opens - and flows more than ever possible with the former routing. The results are astounding: No matter how hard I push this the oil temps never rise over 115C, 95-100 is normal now. Coolant temp seems to have stabilized lower as well. The stock radiator and cooling system has plenty of capacity to handle the oil cooling as well.


Karl, where did you get your Touareg cooler? I put in 2 or 3 new ones from different sources (Febi, Meyle and a no name) and, within a day or 2, they all strted leaking around inlet / outlet ports.
I would like to go back to this plan including your experience with the flow mod you mention ... I would just like to do it once (more).
Cheers.

John
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westyventures
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been using primarily good used coolers I bought through eBay.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the V6 larger oil cooler on my ALH too. Don't forget to get the longer threaded pipe with it!

I only see 120C/250F (sensor in oil drain plug) after driving a freeway section on a hot day (above 85*F) with 6% grade for several miles and already starts at 5000 feet above sea level. So I'm not too worried about it. Other then that, I run 200-225F.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

westyventures wrote:
I did a mod to the stock layout that really works well:
Ditch the stock smaller water/oil cooler and replace with the Touareg/Audi V6 cooler that is not only larger but has better internal cooling fin layout. THEN, block off the connection where the cooler flows into the diesel lower hose from the radiator to the thermostat cover. Replace the bypass hose (head to pump) with the one from an AAZ or 1Z/AHU TDi car, connecting the cooler port now to that hose's tee. Now it flows all the time and not just when the thermostat opens - and flows more than ever possible with the former routing. The results are astounding: No matter how hard I push this the oil temps never rise over 115C, 95-100 is normal now. Coolant temp seems to have stabilized lower as well. The stock radiator and cooling system has plenty of capacity to handle the oil cooling as well.


Thanks for the info, do you have any photos of the layout? And were you able to keep the aux water pump that comes on after driving?
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MsTaboo wrote:

Thanks for the info, do you have any photos of the layout? And were you able to keep the aux water pump that comes on after driving?


The layout isn't really changed, no photos at the moment. Just a plug in the old lower hose outlet and swap in the later style J hose with the tee. It may require a trip to NAPA or other parts store to get a formed 5/8" hose to connect from the J hose to the oil cooler, if I recall correctly. I'll try to get a photo later and post, dirty unwashed engine photo!
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have any of you TDI folks completely dispensed with the heat exchanger in favor of just using a thermostatic sandwich plate and cooler?
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