Type 1 Thermostat in Type 4?

[RevKevin]

So I've read a few of the online tutorials about using a T1 thermostat in place of the stock T4.

I have a Type 1 thermostat that I picked up on ebay and as well as a new cable on the way. The stock thermostat and original parts are still there as far as I can tell. Am I going to need any additional parts to make the T1 work and is there anything else I should have on hand or is it a pretty straightforward swap?

[mightyart]

If you read the articals online you probaly know that you have to modify it a little to get the cable to work with it, other then that you just need the stock stuff.
I happend to have a threaded rod that I bent and drilled a hole in and it turned out like this:

Thought you were going to get rid of the Van after the oil screen bolt snafu?
Hows that daughter of yours doing?

[RevKevin]

Sweet, thanks. In all the tutorials they mentioned some kind of slight modification would be needed but didn't get into too many details as far as exactly what. The site I ordered the cable from had some kind of square washer that looked like it could do something similar but they were out of stock.

The one thing keeping me from doing the quick and easy fix was the van was my daily driver so I was leaning towards a new block or TIG welding and re tapping the point on the block where the crossbolt anchors. We picked up a Volvo 940 Wagon a few months back that's our new daily driver/family car so the performance pressure is off of the Vanagon but I still need it as a second car.

I'm pretty much leaning towards just sealing it with something along the lines of hi temp JB Weld or Allenweld. Any Ideas?

As far as Lydia I was going to post some pics in a separate post to give everyone an update on hows she's doing, thanks for asking.

[RevKevin]

So looks the guy who sold me the thermostat on ebay might be backing out. Anyone have any good sources for a decent type 1 (or better yet a type 4) for under $50?

[Rhinoculips]

I'm confused. What is the benefit of putting a T1 Thermostat into a T4?
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“May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds.” - Edward Abbey

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[mightyart]

[RevKevin]

Won it for $45. Apparently he had to go in for surgery and while he was gone his son swiped it. He says he's going to try to get it back but if he can't I hate to ruin his 100% feedback. I transferred funds minutes after the auction closed so he already has my money.

German Supply is where I have the new cable and a few other bits on the way from, would suck to have to pay more shipping on a second order.

I've seen a few in the classified section but they're either overpriced or junky looking. Any idea if the newer air cooled spring style I keep seeing would work or is even worth messing with?

[TWD]

[Wildthings]

[reluctantartist]

Do you have the old thermostat? do you have all the pieces. Are there any cracks in it? When these fail and do not have cracks, they can be repaired. You have to be handy with a soldering iron. Look here http://www.ratwell.com/technical/Thermostats.html

Good luck

Air cooled rocks.
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1982 Westy, 1974 412 Variant... Yes, Aircooled's are great! Oh and I do have modern computer controlled vehicles too, but I just don't care about them.

[RCB]

Ive heard so much about a thermostat on an air-cooled Vanagon I called the VW dealer in Redwood City and they said no need to install one .
The temperature here in the Bay Area doesent call for one.
Two mechanics at the dealership said the same thing and the mechanic Ive used for umteen years said the same thing.
I know that if they fail for whatever reason the flaps will stay open.
I havent had any issues here in the San Francisco Bay Area and Ive had Helga (82 air-cooled Westy) for quite awhile.
So fah so good. Fingers crossed ??

[greenbus pilot]

[RCB]

VW had no idea on where the vehicles would be sent to once they were manufactured. They cost so little monies they decided to put one on all of them. They were just covering their ass . If your located in Alaska ya need one if your in Death Valley you dont need a thermostat now do you.
The lowest the temperature gets here in the Bay Area is about 50`and when it gets cold I just warm up my Westy a few extra minutes B4 hitting the road.
Now...................................my actions are based on what I was told by the VW dealerships Service Department and the VW mechanics at the dealership and the independant mechanics who have worked on my Westy for year upon year.

[Wildthings]

No doubt about it, the need for engine temperature control is climate related. When I lived in Alaska years ago, I cut holes in the tin on my T1 to cause recirculation of cooling air during the winter, also taped all the engine compartment vents shut. Doing that would have killed an engine in southern Cal.

[RevKevin]

[reluctantartist]

[RevKevin]

Perfect! Thank you! You think someone would have mentioned that at one point in the articles, but it sounds like in most cases people are replacing the thermostat after the PO removed it.

I don't doubt the need of the thermostat, especially up here in Seattle where the weather fluctuates so much. Every article I've read so far on the subject seems to start out with a variation of: "You may not think you need a thermostat, but... engine wear, warped cylinders, the four horsemen, etc."

[germansupplyscott]

anyone who says a thermostat is not needed for a type 4 engine simply doesn't understand how the cooling flaps work. if they work for a VW dealer then shame on them all the more. the main issue is that without a stat your oil temperatures will be all wrong. the cooling flaps on a type 4 have a critical secondary role: besides regulating the cooling air stream to the cylinders and heads, the left flap controls the airflow to the oil cooler, diverting air away from it while the engine is cold, directing maximum air to the cooler once the engine reaches operating temperature. furthermore, people who remove the cooling flaps altogether - we see it regularly in the shop - are asking for trouble. without the flaps, airflow to the oil cooler is almost non-existent.

as for the comments above about the pricing of the thermostats on our website, i would be very happy to offer them for much less, but the price on our site only reflects our costs on this part. it is not as if we are sitting on a cache of these are charging premium prices, the costs are what they are and it is surely unfortunate that such an important item is so expensive. however we think it is better to have them for sale than not.

we have an article:

http://www.germansupply.com/xcart/customer/home.ph..._in_t4.tpl

on installing a type 1 stat into a type 4 engine. it is a very simple project.
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SL

[RevKevin]

Thanks for jumping in Scott, good to know you guys are on here. Guess where I bought my new T-stat cable...

[RevKevin]

So I finally had a few hours to myself today and got around to pulling the old thermostat. When comparing it to the Type 1 I bought I noticed some differences that concerned me.

Here was the ebay description:
"USED ORIGINAL FACTORY THERMOSTAT
HAS A FEW DINGS & DENTS ON TOP
THREADS PERFECT

TYPE I BETTLE 61-74
TYPE II BUS, VAN 60-71
Ghia 61-74
Type III FASTBACK 62-73
& THING 73-74 12-1600cc

65*/70* CENTIGRADE
PRE-TESTED OPENS AND CLOSES AT SPECS
VOLKSWAGEN P/N 111 119 159A"

#1. When it arrived I noticed that it had been painted with gold paint, which I kind of shrugged my shoulders at. All the solder was obviously new as well.

#2. When comparing the old and new thermostat I noticed that the only marking on the new one was the temperature range. Nowhere was there a VW or Wahler logo.

#3. Notice that on the new one that there is only a plate on one side, and it doesn't have the 4 tabs like the Type 1 and Type 4 thermostats in the other picture.

#4. My digital camera bit it the other week, otherwise I'd have a side by side picture of the old and new thermostats, but the new one is actually about 1/2" longer than the old one and the bellows are finer if that makes sense.

So I guess basicly what I'm asking is what was it the guy actually sent me, did I get gyped, is this an old cheap knockoff instead of a genuine VW part, or did I mess up and get the wrong Type 1 thermostat?

Looks like what I'm going to have to do is shave a few bellows off of the new one then solder the type 4 plate on there. Any suggestions as far as what tool to use?